Hand range practice from the Button

I'm trying to focus on how I play the button and going over my hand histories I found this. I can see that the hand was very badly played but nonetheless I decided to try some range practice for the sake of it. In particular I am trying to practice putting an opponent on a range using just the basic Vpip/Pfr/Agf.

I have 52 hands and his stats are: 17/15/80

$0.02 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

UTG+1: $0.97
MP: $3.87
MP+1: $1.97
CO: $1.84
Hero (BTN): $2.00
SB: $2.63
BB: $2.06
UTG: $0.40

SB posts SB $0.01, BB posts BB $0.02

Pre Flop: ($0.03) Hero has K:spade: J:heart:

fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.08, fold, BB raises to $0.24, Hero calls $0.16

His betting range preflop taking into considertaion that he is in the BB is maybe 10% and that is something like this:

88+,A9s+,KTs+,QTs+,AJo+,KQo

Which is already ahead of all of my range, but of course I didn't see that then.

But he is not just betting he is raising my bet from the button so I reduce that to just the top 5% of his hands, and that is likely to be something like this:
99+,AJs+,KQs,AKo

Would that be a reasonable way to look at things in terms of reducing his hand range based on position and my actions, and just the
stats of Vpip/Preflop raise ?

In fact, I have a stat that says he calls bets preflop 1.92% and that is basically JJ+.
He has made a fairly standard-looking 3-bet and I call although obviously I shouldn't have.

Flop: ($0.49, 2 players) 9:heart: 5:heart: 2:heart:
BB bets $0.36, Hero calls $0.36

That doesn't give him trips on any of his range or a flush.
So now I have a flush draw, but also overcards. That gives me 14 outs and a 28% chance of improving my hand.
33:14 = 2.5:1.
Pot odds are: 85:36 which is 2.36:1.
So I don't actually have odds to call but I did anyway because again, I didn't see that at the time.:rolleyes:


Turn: ($1.21, 2 players) T:spade:
BB bets $0.90, Hero calls $0.90

Again, that missed his range, but it now gives me a straight draw too.
I now how 17 outs by adding the none heart queens giving me odds of 31:17 = 1.8:1
My pot odds are 2.11:0.90 = 2.34:1 so now I do have odds to call.

River: ($3.01, 2 players) A:club:
BB bets $0.56, fold

I missed my draws so I fold which I should have done before anyway?

What I'm really interested in here is how I can go about reducing an opponent's range based on his position and his response to my actions.

I haven't had a chance to read through the rest of your post, but fold to the 3bet preflop. You're giving him a wider range than you need to. You're behind most of the range that you gave villain, which doesn't justify a call.

1 - when involved in a 3bet pot, use your opponent's 3bet stats. It's not going to be reliable with only 52 hands, but it can at least influence your ranges.

2 - what is your image at the table, especially from the button? Are you playing loose/tight, is your ATS high or low? The stats you show indicate that your opp might be smart enough to widen his range if you're loose or ATS is high.

3 - Your calculation of outs is bad, especially for the flush draw. A bunch of his range includes Ah, Kh, and Qh, so even if you hit your flush you could easily lose.

Calling raises preflop = 1.92% =! JJ+ DOUCY

I have just recently learned (although I used to fold mostly anyway) that calling a 3bet with KJ is a horrible move. You are so incredibly behind it's not even funny. Any broadway cards he is holding completely dominates yours.

If you want to call a 3bet in position, you *MUST* have QQ+ or lower suited-connectors like 78s. I am on the fence wondering if it's worth calling with low pp's but I've had moderate success doing it if I am in position.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by johnnyBuz

I've had moderate success doing it if I am in position.

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huh, i have great success doing it in position :rolleyes:

1st up - nice work op for continuing to post hands where you know you're going to get criticised. And kudos for continuing to identify errors in post-play analysis/review.
These type of hands and analysis are probably far more useful than 'shall i fold my set/flopped flush' type of hands that are pretty much irrelevant until you reach the point where you fix the big leaks.

re ranges
1 - preflop you can just put him on a nut range and fold without history
2 - flop, you forgot to include flushes, sets (99), and overpairs in villain's flop betting range - obviously he is c-betting all of these
3 - again, his range is still way stronger than you suggest. re-run stove against a range of AhK, 99+, KhQh, AhQh, AhKh
4 - yep, you're screwed. Fold here is the second good play of the hand (first was stealing from LP with KJo).

re actions during the hand
1 - you can open to 2.5x or 3x instead of 4x when stealing from button.
2 - you can fold to the 3b, even vs the optimistic range you gave him you're in all sorts of trouble even before factoring the huge problem of being RIO-fucked
3 - fold to flop c-bet. Your flush draw is to the 4th nuts, you aren't even happy if you hit and he keeps betting. Your overs are crap cos you aren't happy stacking off even if you hit a jack.
4 - you talk about pot odds to call to the flush draw, your call is even worse than your calculations suggest given that you are calling to a hand that is still going to lose often when you hit
5 - you're counting odds on the turn without considering that most of these outs are not clean = are definitely not giving you confidence that your hand is nut when you hit. Drawing to non-nut outs is a far different game than drawing to the nuts.

Quote:

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you can open to 2.5x or 3x instead of 4x when stealing from button.

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Not that I want to hijack the thread, but when you do that do you also do it when you do a legit raise vs limpers? Say there are two limpers, would you raise only 4.5 to 5x with AK? So far I have kept raising 4x from the button even on steals because I don't like raising smaller when I have legitimate raising hands. I raise 3x only when on the SB alone vs BB.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by daviddem

Not that I want to hijack the thread, but when you do that do you also do it when you do a legit raise vs limpers? Say there are two limpers, would you raise only 4.5 to 5x with AK? So far I have kept raising 4x from the button even on steals because I don't like raising smaller when I have legitimate raising hands. I raise 3x only when on the SB alone vs BB.

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if there are limpers in the pot i will go standard 3.5x +1x for every limper.
my suggestion only stands for steal situations when we are entering an unopened pot from lp.
for context, i raise 3x when stealing from co, 2.5x from bu, and 3x from sb - others do things differently. You could probably get away with 4x-ing button steals with the top of your range and 2.5x-ing with the rest vs non-reg or non-observant blinds. In fact, this is probably optimal at micros.

that makes sense

Please find your fold button preflop. To be clear, his pre-flop range is WAY tighter there.

Also, on the flop you're accounting for you having a FD, but you're not allowing for the fact he might have a better one. AhKx, AxKh, KhKx, QhQx all improve to a better flush, and while you say the flop didn't get him a flush, it did if he has AhKh. Likewise you're counting your overcards as outs, but again if he has AA or KK then a K still leaves you with second best hand, and if he has QQ or JJ then a J coming means you still lose to those as well.

The turn T isn't terrible, but it didn't really change a lot for you. There's a small chance he has TT and now your overs aren't outs anymore.