Spot with JJ in 3 bet pot

No reads no HUD on at this time I had 3 Bet him once before and he folded. within the last 4 hands.

I Really felt he had QQ+ here or maybe calling with A10 cuzz i just 3 bet him earlyer. I had that GUT instinct and I decided to fold but I was wondering how I should have played this...Previously I would have snap called down to put it all in. But recently my saying is if i dont know FOLD! cuzz everytime i didnt know before i called to learn and most the time i had that GUT feeling its right


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

CO ($43.75)
Button ($25)
Hero (SB) ($34.80)
BB ($14.80)
UTG ($15.25)
MP ($25)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif
3 folds, Button bets $1, Hero raises to $3.50, 1 fold, Button calls $2.50

Flop: ($7.25) 5http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, 10http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 10http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
Hero bets $3.50, Button raises to $9, Hero ?

Total pot: $14.25 | Rake: $0.65

what are your reasons for 3-betting preflop

lol PF is fine let's not analyze it

I think 3betting is better than flatting preflop. Playing JJ well is tough at the best of times, especially OOP, and by 3betting you're going to get a fold often (esp against an open-raise from the button, which will often be a steal attempt).

(EDIT: sorry, didn't see Spenda's post until after I posted mine ...)

Post-flop is tough without stats or reads, but I struggle to put him on much that you beat. I don't think he plays 5x or 66-99 this way very often (I think at 25NL they call flop almost every time). So unless he's a maniac or loves a bluff, which of course you don't know, it looks a lot like 55, QQ+ or a T to me. Its also a small raise, which could mean that he wants a call. So I probably fold, although I'm not very happy about it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bigspenda73

lol PF is fine let's not analyze it

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Doesn't correct PF analysis lead us to the promised land of Post flop bliss?

sure seems like an easy shove to me.

I don't see a ten in his 3bet flat range
prehaps a 9T,JT type of hand
also he may think your full of S#it and is
doing this with pkt pair, AK,AQ,AJ,KQ, or a flush draw.
so I call/shove :P

yeh
i get it in on flop and expect to see worse alot more than Tx

how about a range trip:
put him on a steal range
now narrow that to a call your 3-bet range
now narrow that to a raise your c-bet range.

makes the hand easier to talk about. Assume Tag-wannabe i guess

Tx sometimes will just call and shove turn
so to me his most likely range is air
I call and hope he shoves turn

Quote:

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Originally Posted by clvacva

I don't see a ten in his 3bet flat range
prehaps a 9T,JT type of hand

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My experience is that if we 3bet your average 25NL donk off a raise, his call 3bet range less than 4 hands later will be significantly wider than it was the first time, especially when he's in position. So without any further reads I think here we can include at least AT and probably KT, JTs and T9s as well.

So I think he gets to the flop with a pretty wide range, but I have more trouble finding any hands we beat other than air in his flop raise range, so we would have to believe he's bluffing there a fair amount of the time to continue.

EDIT: I missed the FD, which must be a reasonable chunk of his flop raising range too - and its probably likely enough to make me strongly consider calling and then shoving a non-heart turn.

The wonderful thing about TAGG wannabe's at 10nl and 25nl is that they open-raise 22-88 and then can't let go of them when 3bet. I put 66-99 in his 3 bet flatting range, possibly discounted. Once you get a read, you'll find a lot of these villains have 22 - 66 in their 3bet flatting range. And he has to feel like TT5 missed your hand (and he's right, sort of).

I think there's value here, especially since you gotta think he 4bets you preflop the majority of the time w/ QQ+.

I like your pf line. I don't think I can call here - especially without reads or stats to support a call.

I think I shove flop. QQ+ might 4bet since you've 3bet him a few hands ago, and the weak cbet on a TT5 board may have induced this bluff.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Robb

And he has to feel like TT5 missed your hand (and he's right, sort of).

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Not really, we nailed the flop.