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I seem to not be able to do this at all. It totally makes everything scattered and I can't even remember positioning that well, as well as calculating pot odds so fast.
Is there anything that helps players play MTs better? How do you guys do it? It is really difficult for me and I feel that I'll end up losing in a lot of games.
so play cash or S&G's instead...
Oh I'm sorry. I think I used the wrong term. Sorry hehe.
What I meant was Multiple tables online. Not multiple table tournmanets.
Hm I started talking about MTTs too. Edited in light of last post by OP, lol.
Are you trying to add too many extra tables at once? Have you tried adding just one more table and seeing how you do with that before adding more? If you're finding that you're timing out or making hasty decisions when you play, get rid of a few tables.
How many tables are we talking here?
Hehe I changed the topic title. I apologize again for using the wrong term.
K I edited my reply so that it makes sense then :P Edit your post again and change MT and MTT to 'multiple tables at once' or something - it's still kinda unclear.
rofl 1 MORE LOL.Quote:
Originally Posted by courtiebee
Well, I'm really a true beginner at online poker. I turned 21- 5 months ago, and I barely play any online games. I played a tournament once and a cash table at the same time on UltimateBet and someone sucked out on me with K 3, and I went on supertilt. Never had I been on tilt before that extreme!
Going back to MTs, I can only play 1 table very very well. When it gets bigger, I time out frequently, and can't calculate pot odds very well.
Perhaps play one table for now until it's easier for you, then? Once it becomes more intuitive and you don't have to think so much about every action, you can start to add tables.
I'm sure someone here who is a good multi-tabler will be able to give you some advice for how to eventually add those extra tables without timing out all the time, but you should probably make sure that your one table is solid on its own before venturing that way in the first place.
Ah Thank you :). So its sacrificing my reads to know more poker math?
I played mainly live games so, maybe that's why it is really difficult for me. Implied odds are over the top for me, as well as mannerisms and betting patterns. I might be carrying that too much with me online, cause I see how long they take to bet, time out, and if they trick using those methods.
I mean come on, how many hands do you play, like 50%?
One table you'd be just waiting for good hands a LOT of the time and rarely have to play on both tables at the same time
Yeah when you play online, you can't notice timing and focus on individual players so much anymore. Not to say that timing tells aren't important anymore, but they're not as important as in live games (and you can't pair the tells with expressions and body language like you can live so they're less effective that way too).Quote:
Originally Posted by Zel
Online most of what we have to work with is betting patterns from players. Once you play enough hands, you'll have a better general idea of what certain patterns mean and you'll be able to play your hands without thinking so much about them.
I play maybe 10-20% of my hands. I'm really new to lots of this poker advice, and I'm trying to understand position a lot better. So maybe that's why I'm really slow.
To courtiebee: Thanks! When it becomes 2 tables. Remembering each individual player's betting pattern is really hard. I often lose a lot of the information I build on players and get them switched between tables except for the 1 or 2 aggro players that remain.
Well, just take notes
Personally, I use PAHUD as a crutch :)
It really just takes time. As you get used to it you can add more tables. When I started I only played 1 STT at a time, by the time I stopped playing them I was playing up to 10 but it took time.
You can always practice by 24-tabling play money.
And I'm not joking.
Shouldn't this be a poll?
I'm comfortable up to 6 tables cash, 4 tables sng, and I never play MTT's, but I guess somewhere in between.
I too started gradually. Just played one table for months, then two, then three and so on. After you've been in the same or a similar situation a couple of hundred times, you won't need to think about it too hard.
took me a few months b4 i could even handle two tables. I know what ur goin through.
not sure if anyone has said this yet but most poker rooms have an option to always sit in the same spot, so make sure u sit in seat 5 on all tables or wherever.
besides that, just play 1 table until u slowly realize your getting bored then add a 2nd table and do the same until u find a nice balance. I'm only up to 5 tabling but its worked out good so far
practice
This is a great suggestion... using some type of HUD is also good. After playing enough hands... a high percentage of your play can be done on auto-pilot using minimal information. I learned to multi-table using SnGs... as that is pretty much the epitome of robotic play. Spoon's suggestion of using play money tables is also very good.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaddyDeez
Thank you so much guys! :] You guys are very helpful! I appreciate all of the good advice. It looks like I have to practice, practice, practice!
I'm happy to know that I'm not the only one! :D
I'm sure people multi table without software but I wouldn't think about trying it. Either build your roll till you can afford it or just make the investment now and get PT3 or HEM. Either one will pay for itself in a few weeks/months depending on the limits you play.
After learning to use the software start adding tables (2,4,8,12) I found on cash games 9 seems to be mine and my screens limit. SNGs I usually do 4. Just takes time learning to trust the software, on PS I watch a lot of replays while hands are going on and make notes while I'm not in the hand.
if your computer supports a second monitor(for f ..sake, what is the english word for grafikkarte), find yourself a cheap second monitor. play two tables, one on each monitor in full size. in that way you dont have to switch between windows, things dont get as mixed up.
If you play cash you can sit at just the normal speed tables, not the fast ones. At pokerstars you can filter out the fast tables with the holdem ring game filter.
Aka the solution to 99% of issues posted in this forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by badgers
in my experiences multi-tabling has helped me tighten up my game A LOT like VERY VERY SIGNIFICANTLY... waaaaaaaaay back when i started playing poker... like years and years ago i was the donk playing any suited cards or ace and calling all raises and all-ins with any two face cards...
when you multi table you pretty much ALWAYS have something to do because you're always clicking fold fold fold fold fold raise fold raise fold fold raise fold very rarely a call...
so it kinda feels like you always have "action" cause you're always doing something instead of just watching the cards...
keep in mind this only works in micros because once you start moving up to higher stakes this will be exploited, you will bleed blinds, and well you will just get beaten every time if you don't also pay attention to the game and opponents
when i was play 2NL i was 24 tabling it with out a HUD pretty much and now that i'm at 5NL i just do 9 tables at most without a HUD and 4 tabling it with a HUD... once i get to 10NL i plan on not doing more than 4 tables with a HUD
Damnnn... 9 tabling. Good god lol.
What's a hud? Is that poker software legal? Hehe I'll probably not be around those things because money isn't the important thing to me in poker :). I really love poker theory itself!
You did 24 tabling without a hud? How is that even possible? lol
This is a loose call, but maybe "graphics card" :D? That's what you plug the monitor(s) into.Quote:
Originally Posted by hagscel
As for the original question, I'm just starting to play for real money after gaining confidence in my play on play money tables. I found that after a while, especially once I started playing more tight/aggressive, I simply got bored just playing one play money table. Lately I've been playing two or three and/or chatting on AIM or browsing online at the same time.
Carrying that over to your situation, if you really want to start multi-tabling, maybe you should try doing it for fun for a while. That is, play at your normal stakes the same way you normally do (while always working on improving your play, of course), but set aside a small "fun time" every session where you multi-table for lower stakes or (if low stakes are still too much pressure to play perfectly) play money.
This might also be an interesting way to test new ideas like being a little more loose/aggressive early or trying to be more unpredictable later on (being unpredictable early is pointless at low-mid stakes, from what I've read) in tournament play, or trying a new playing style in cash games. Just be sure to take what you learn with a grain of salt since not all of the ideas that work or fail at lower stakes will do the same at higher ones.
It's a lot easier to accept temporarily weaker play when you are doing it for fun. With practice, you will get better at everything from multi-tabling to new tactics. But it's very important to keep working on your normal, solid play as well, which is why I suggest spending the majority of the time where you are comfortable right now. Only after you're confident with new approaches should you begin to implement them in your everyday play.
Also, I'm not speaking from a whole lot of experience but largely from common sense and brainstorming, so definitely take my advice with a grain, nay, a pinch of salt.
I tried 2 tables last night on SNGs ($1.20). I did this 3 times just to see if I could handle it. Early on is was fine. Fold, fold, check, etc. When the blinds were at level IV it got a bit more nerve racking. For all three sessions I had the same situation. Table 1 with 20+bb and Table 2 with <10bb. When I would push on Table 2 I would lose. For all three sessions I ended up 2nd/5th. Strange. One thing it did force me to do was to NOT look at the cards I just folded(cause I didn't have time) to see if I woulda won if I'd have stayed in. I thought about staggering them where one is Level 1 and the other is Level III. Bad idea?
Not a bad idea at all imo. The only way I multi SnG's is staggering starting time. I know many people can play them all at once, but I like to give myself a good read on everybody and hit one good pot before I start a second. Typically I'm going like 30 mins or so into the game before I feel comfortable firing up the next. The other advantage is when you get down to 3 players or heads-up you've go to be much more active, I find I have a decent shot of that if my second table still has lower blinds and 6 players. I don't see how some people do solid heads-up play with a bunch of tables, beyond me.
Also, I've found cash tables, especially full rings are WAY easier to multi, because itttt'''ssss sooo sloooooowwwwwwwwww. ;)
Another idea is to have your regular cash game open and then open up a play money table or two to practice. Keep a firm grip on the cash one as a priority. If crap starts to hit the fan u can sit out or quit the other tables with peace of mind knowing it's play money.
Kijjo. Thanks for the sugesstion. I'll try that.
What part of Al are you in? That's where I am too.
you ask this:and then state thisQuote:
Originally Posted by Zel
i smell a troll...Quote:
Originally Posted by Zel
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...highlight=sageQuote:
Originally Posted by Kijjo
Maybe something to look into.
What about monitor size? should it be a factor if you can't see all the tables at once, unless they are really small?
This is a really bad idea. Playing more tables is fine because your brain is still 100% focused on poker. But, when you start doing different things at the same time your brain starts to half focus on poker and half on what your reading on the internet, which results in you sucking more at poker.Quote:
Originally Posted by DoanDiggy
I used to be able to play only one table. Now I play 4 SNGs at a time. I made the transitions fairly recently and I remember well the feelings/issues .
IMO you shouldn't feel pressure in your mind to multi-table or use a hud while learning poker. When you start to get really bored you should start messing around with 2 tables and trust me the time will come but just wait for it and until then enjoy really thinking about poker & analyzing your game and don't feel like you suck because you don't multitable yet.
Using a HUD before getting in a LOT of hands without one, is sort of like giving a schoolchild a calculator on the first day of kindergarden and never teaching them math without it. Sure they will be OKAY when they grow up and able to function, but they won't be an engineer or a programmer probably, they never got in the hard practice and logic that comes with working out equations manually when you're learning. It's not a perfect example because it is more than just math - it's about truly understanding all the implications of what the hud has observed, & getting used to observing your opponents habits yourself, but hopefully you get the idea.
So, I wouldn't worry about a hud while learning either, but it's good to see it and keep in mind that someday you will use one.
I tried staggering tourneys like you suggested but stopped after I watched bjaust's video which I highly reccommend before you try multi-tabling SNGs again http://www.flopturnriver.com/poker-v...deo-NHT011.php . He said he always starts his SNGs at the same time. You have enough variables to think about to add in remembering the different blind levels too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquach991
If you are bored at the early stages but can't multi-table in later stages, and/or really just want the practice on 2 without the later stage pressure, I have tried a few things, the best thing I found was to join a MTT (like a 45 or 90 person SNG for example) as my other table, one with enough people that you will be in AA KK AK or try to flop a set mode for quite awhile, enough time to complete your SNG. This IMO is better than surfing or chatting on aim lol. When your SNG is finished, it will be time to loosen up and start paying attention to the MTT. Eventually you'll naturally feel you're ready to 2-table the SNGs.
and then state thisQuote:
What's a hud? Is that poker software legal?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zel
Well, I think I know what a hud kinda does.. I just know its good for your game. In his post, he said he did it without one, so I suppose it must mean its even harder to do that? I'm not sure.Quote:
i smell a troll...
Anyhow, post-time skip, I've asked one of my friends and he explained to me what a HUD is, and the different software tools people used! So yup! I know now!
To Animal_Chin: I agree about not focusing on anything else. If on aim, or doing something else, your self-discipline on your mind is gone. Professional Poker is like work, doing a poor job will get you fired, or demoted. Although, I really love the read about the play money though. That's a good idea definitely!
To Redpalo: I like the idea of a MTT and SnG. That's an awesome Idea, I'll be trying that out soon enough! :D.
I can do it as long as it's the same type of game. Where I get confused is when I start mixing games like Omaha and Holdem or Holem and Stud.
Guilty, I have become better at it, but I mess up a lot when I do it
I don't do it well either. I'm always trying to read the players and it gets more difficult the more tables you add. Best to stick with one at first until you get more comfortable. Or as was suggested earlier, try the play chip tables.
have you mentioned this to Chelle yet?Quote:
Originally Posted by spoonitnow
Always sit at the same spot, use a HUD, take plenty of notes (most important part imo), and I also found a batch file on 2+2 that turns the deck color yellow on pokerstars. I play with a dark table, so it's obv much easier to see who still has cards in front of them. I kept glancing at a table and raising what i thought was one person only to realize 2 other people were still in the hand! so that trick helps a ton if the deck color is similar to the table color.
don't browse the web (although i find myself still doing this, especially since i have 2 monitors but only 4-table, which means all 4 tables fit on one monitor), again take a ton of notes, run a hud if you can afford it, and that's about it.
i only play cash, but when i used to play sngs i had a bitch of a time multi tabling because of the dif. blind levels. so for sngs, probably just stagger your start time so that youre not playing 4 bubbles at once.
Does anyone have a suggestion on how many tables I should 25NL? It seems like if I go over 4 I tend to start timing out or bleeding blinds. ohh and I suggest getting the new Samsung 30"...its got a 2560x1600 natural resolution...friggin god like...its on my wish list.
I recommend playing one table ocassionally and practice playing perfect poker instead of playing a safe, profitable Tag style all the time.
Learn all playing styles, learn to exploit all playing styles, learn poker.
i have to agree with this method this how i got used to it not that many tables tho cus my computer would just blow upQuote:
Originally Posted by spoonitnow
And I'm not joking lol :lol:
I get bored/tilty if I don't multi-table. If the cards aren't coming at me quick I start counting the fractions of a second in between hands sometimes. Then again everything in my life has to be fast and in high volume or else I go nuts. I eat fast, talk fast, run fast, drive fast, read fast, type fast,,,
Except when I bang my gf. Sometimes I do that slow.
: D
(I aplogize in advance if anyone finds this post offensive in any way)