Hand Analysis- Two PP hands.

-----Hand 3-----
Hero's M = 17.73
PokerStars Game #19672741839: Tournament #102579247, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level III (25/50) - 2008/08/16 - 21:37:05 (ET)
Condensed history provided by the Tournament Trimmer (v1.1.4w) from http://www.FlopTurnRiver.com
Table '102579247 1' 10-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: mazigh77 (1525 in chips)
Seat 3: UltraGmax (3445 in chips)
Seat 4: RedStingray (990 in chips)
Seat 6: RUSETTRIPPIN (1730 in chips)
Seat 7: Illfavor (1330 in chips)
Seat 8: vegas1023 (1890 in chips)
Seat 9: Hezemeftez (870 in chips)
Seat 10: sveni (3220 in chips)
Illfavor: posts small blind 25
vegas1023: posts big blind 50
Preflop: Illfavor dealt 8:diamond: 8:heart:
Hezemeftez: calls 50
sveni: raises 150 to 200
mazigh77: folds
UltraGmax: folds
RedStingray: folds
RUSETTRIPPIN: folds
[b][color=red]Illfavor: ???


-----Hand 8-----
Hero's M = 18.77
PokerStars Game #19673049797: Tournament #102579247, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (100/200) - 2008/08/16 - 21:52:28 (ET)
Condensed history provided by the Tournament Trimmer (v1.1.4w) from http://www.FlopTurnRiver.com
Table '102579247 1' 10-max Seat #10 is the button
Seat 3: UltraGmax (4340 in chips)
Seat 6: RUSETTRIPPIN (1410 in chips)
Seat 7: Illfavor (5630 in chips)
Seat 9: Hezemeftez (1690 in chips)
Seat 10: sveni (1930 in chips)
UltraGmax: posts small blind 100
RUSETTRIPPIN: posts big blind 200
Preflop: Illfavor dealt 7:diamond: 7:spade:
Illfavor: raises 400 to 600
Hezemeftez: folds
sveni: folds
UltraGmax: raises 400 to 1000
RUSETTRIPPIN: folds
Illfavor: ???

Two situations in the same tournament where, frankly, I did not know what to do with my medium pocket pairs. My PP play is a gaping whole in my game, as I am just terrible with them, and this is the best way I know to fix it. Please give me your insight.

Many thanks.

1 I'd shove without tight read

2 fold. I'd be tempted to just open fold here, getting called is going to make you really unhappy and obv getting raised sucks

First one (88) - shove over or fold depending on reads, I probably lean towards just folding here considering opp raised

Second one I open raise and fold to the raise. Agree that it sucks to get called or raised but I'm not open folding 77 even from UTG with 28x BB.

You don't play much with 28bb, if you start playing MTTs you'll be surprised how much better JTs or KJs (hands I assume you would autofold) play here. You're basically bluffing with a 1/8 chance to like the flop minus the chance you don't even get to see it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by drmcboy

You don't play much with 28bb, if you start playing MTTs you'll be surprised how much better JTs or KJs (hands I assume you would autofold) play here. You're basically bluffing with a 1/8 chance to like the flop minus the chance you don't even get to see it.

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Agreed, card removal effects matter here too because they're less likely to have a hand that can play with you if you have two broadway cards in your hand.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by drmcboy

You don't play much with 28bb, if you start playing MTTs you'll be surprised how much better JTs or KJs (hands I assume you would autofold) play here. You're basically bluffing with a 1/8 chance to like the flop minus the chance you don't even get to see it.

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You mentioned those two hands, JTs/KJs, that play well in this situation specifically in a MTT, so are you calling the raise in that setting? I can see how much better they would play, given the multiple ways to outdraw a better hand, even when dominated. Is this specifically short-handed, with a large M? Thanks for the input...I don't play MTTs much and that's really interesting insight.

since it's a min raise I might go ahead and take a flop, any more and I'd probably dump it. Nothing wrong with folding even to a min raise when you're OOP and at the bottom of your range.

It's more about when you get called because you flop a pair or a draw a lot more than a set, and on a super rag board like 233 you have some outs against low PPs. With the 77 even if it comes 566 you usually aren't going to be a favorite if a bunch of money goes in.

I'd fold the first one after a raise. Your opponent has raised after another opponent has limped. He is 'saying' he has a good hand but he could obviously also be doing this with a variety of hands. Unfortunately a reraise pot-commits you and I don't think pushing AI for 325 chips is a great play. Finally remember there are still 2 other live players besides the raiser in the hand and they deserve some consideration as well.

The second hand I raise and fold rather than clash with the big stack. If anyone else reraises and the big stack folds, I will call.