Gross. Is this a fold?

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07-27-2008, 09:34 AM
dalecooper

Gross. Is this a fold?

I have 11 hands with villain and this is the first one she's played. (Before I get asked again, he/she/it was using a female avatar.)

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed) Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

MP ($60.25)
CO ($59.20)
Hero ($64.90)
SB ($25.95)
BB ($59.40)
UTG ($30)

Preflop: Hero is Button with :Ac: :Ah:.
1 fold, CO raises to $1.75, Hero calls $1.75, 1 fold, BB calls $1.25.

Flop: ($5.50) :4c: :8d: :5s: (4 players)
BB checks, CO checks, Hero bets $5.5, BB raises to $14.75, CO folds, Hero...
07-27-2008, 09:38 AM
Muzzard

3b pre that is all. I guess given no history I call and probably get it on on the next street.
07-27-2008, 09:40 AM
dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

3b pre that is all

Other villain had a high c-bet % and high fold to 3-bet %, and the players in the blinds were folding machines.
07-27-2008, 09:44 AM
Muzzard

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

3b pre that is all

Other villain had a high c-bet % and high fold to 3-bet %, and the players in the blinds were folding machines.

So why don't you mention this is the original post then, surprisingly I'm not clairvoyant.
07-27-2008, 09:46 AM
dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

So why don't you mention this is the original post then, surprisingly I'm not clairvoyant.

Because I don't really care about that part of the hand. I know the amazingly obscure piece of strategy that says "usually 3-bet AA."
07-27-2008, 09:49 AM
Muzzard

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

3b pre that is all

Other villain had a high c-bet % and high fold to 3-bet %, and the players in the blinds were folding machines.

So why don't you mention this is the original post then, surprisingly I'm not clairvoyant.

Because I don't really care about that part of the hand. I know the amazingly obscure piece of strategy that says "usually 3-bet AA."

Ok so when you get a bit fpsy don't shit ur self when u get played back at coz your hand its totally underrepresented. Sure if they got a set, its one of those things..given the fact they are unknown you can't not felt this. I call and c/r turn AI. It's just easier to play this in standard way by 3betting pre coz 50nl is full of donks.

Also, given the act that the blinds are tight leads me to beleive we should probably 3bet this more often than not, because there OOP cold calling range is probably PP's and only a select few other hands and flating allows them to play most their range perfectly.
07-27-2008, 10:04 AM
dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

Ok so when you get a bit fpsy don't shit ur self when u get played back at coz your hand its totally underrepresented. Sure if they got a set, its one of those things..given the fact they are unknown you can't not felt this. I call and c/r turn AI. It's just easier to play this in standard way by 3betting pre coz 50nl is full of donks.

Seemingly tight player fires a big check-raise at someone who wasn't the original raiser and made an aggressive flop bet? On this flush-free board? We need to start talking ranges. I feel like hers is too strong, but obviously you disagree.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

Also, given the act that the blinds are tight leads me to beleive we should probably 3bet this more often than not, because there OOP cold calling range is probably PP's and only a select few other hands and flating allows them to play most their range perfectly.

That's reasonable.
07-27-2008, 10:13 AM
Muzzard

Quote:

Originally Posted by dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

Ok so when you get a bit fpsy don't shit ur self when u get played back at coz your hand its totally underrepresented. Sure if they got a set, its one of those things..given the fact they are unknown you can't not felt this. I call and c/r turn AI. It's just easier to play this in standard way by 3betting pre coz 50nl is full of donks.

Seemingly tight player fires a big check-raise at someone who wasn't the original raiser and made an aggressive flop bet? On this flush-free board? We need to start talking ranges. I feel like hers is too strong, but obviously you disagree.

I'm not disagreeing entirely. I'm saying out hand is waaaaay underrepped.

You can't say someone is tight if you have 11 hands on them. Range wise its not just 44/88/55 is it, could be anything as little as A8 or 99+. Also I think you should bet less on the flop, what does the full pot bet achieve? There's no way I'm folding this with no reads/stats given the fact we are underreped so much. Equally why would they c/r so much on a dry board when our range isn't very strong on this board.

Obv they had a set/straight and you got beat.
07-27-2008, 10:33 AM
dalecooper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

You can't say someone is tight if you have 11 hands on them. Range wise its not just 44/88/55 is it, could be anything as little as A8 or 99+.

Fair enough - and that's what I came to talk about. I don't know for sure if she was tight; she might have just had ten crap hands and then one playable one since I sat.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

Also I think you should bet less on the flop, what does the full pot bet achieve?

2 things in my thinking - 1. try to ensure nobody hangs around with something semi-retarded like a pair + a gutshot (e.g. 66 or 77); 2. original raiser is aggressive and tricky enough that he might play back at me with nothing, if the other player folds and he reads my bet as a steal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

There's no way I'm folding this with no reads/stats given the fact we are underreped so much. Equally why would they c/r so much on a dry board when our range isn't very strong on this board.

Ha ha - maybe I should have posted this in that annoying-ass thread about what to do with overpairs when check-raised. You're making similar arguments to mine. The key difference is we were talking mainly about heads up hands where hero raised preflop - this'un's a little different.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muzzard

Obv they had a set/straight and you got beat.

You underestimate my nittyness, friend: I folded it. I figured too much of her range was sets and straights and I let it go. First time I've folded aces on the flop in a loooonnnggg time.