Advice please....

Hi,

I've been lurking on this forum for a couple of months now, and it has been invaluable in helping me improve my game. I was amazed to find the newbie circle of death wasn't a unique experience!

I've been playing bad poker for a couple of years, but recently I had a tilt that was like the straw that broke the camels back - It pissed me off so much that I became determined to learn how to play properly.

To cut a long story short basically I read a shit load of books and internet posts/videos etc.. and have been grinding away for the last couple of weeks and am pretty confident I have 10nl beat. I then started running as bad as I ever have yesterday, and tilted my $150 roll on some really dumb plays and bad beats at levels I wasn't rolled for (I particularly enjoyed losing 10-10 to 10-10 all in preflop).

I reloaded ($150) and took a crack at a large field $25 MTT (I know I was nowhere near the roll needed but I was just playing it as a one off before it was even part of my roll). I ran as well as I ever have :) (winning 99 vs aa and 10j vs kk) and ended up with $1200 for 6th.

Now here is where I need the advice. I'm comfortable at most levels for MTT's - I have had a few cracks at the Sunday Million etc... but I as I understand it $1200 propably doesn't roll me for anything more than $10 buy-ins for MTT. I'm ok at SnG but it's not my strong point (I'm guessing I should be playing at about $50 buy-in?). What are peoples opinions on stepping up the cash stakes - I will probably play a bit of 25nl tonight, but should I be looking to play 100nl if that goes ok?

Also I have generally avoided bonus whoring up to this point, because I wanted to do it with a proper roll. I have accounts at Mansion and Hollywood so no bonuses from there but I'm good to go everywhere else (Apart from PStars which is where my roll is at the moment).

Basically I would be interested to hear anyones advice on what my next step towards builing a decent roll should be, and what sort of stakes I should be playing at currently.

Thanks,
Chump

P.S. I am aware that the main areas I actually need to work on at the moment are tilt control and BR management.

You admit that you have tilt and BR management issues, and that you aren't particularly skilled at Sit 'n Gos. MTTs are not for you. You will have to play a ton for variance to even out and your real win-rate to become apparent. I suspect that you would grow impatient and play out of your roll before that ever happened. And even if you made a few final tables, you wouldn't be well equipped to handle them, so what's the point?

You aren't really rolled for 100nl. Give 50nl a shot.

Welcome to FTR. There are a whole bunch of stickies at the top inside the beginners digest including a bankroll management one

Read through everything there and more.

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Originally Posted by grnydrowave2

You admit that you have tilt and BR management issues, and that you aren't particularly skilled at Sit 'n Gos. MTTs are not for you. You will have to play a ton for variance to even out and your real win-rate to become apparent. I suspect that you would grow impatient and play out of your roll before that ever happened. And even if you made a few final tables, you wouldn't be well equipped to handle them, so what's the point?

You aren't really rolled for 100nl. Give 50nl a shot.

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Hi,

Thanks for the quick response...I'll certainly take on board what you've said - The problem is I think MTT's are where I really want to be, when I say I'm not particularly skilled at SnG's I think it is mostly a patience issue with the 1 table 5.50s on PStars....I feel perfectly happy playing ultra tight early on in the MTT's because I'm moving tables fast enough that no-one notices and there's allways some donk pushing before I even get a chance to move with AA or such like...But on the 1 table SnG's I seem to always want to act on my reads before I've taken long enough to sure them up.....My end game skills are actually ok I'd say if I make top 3 I win almost 50% of the time...From what your saying maybe I should invest some of the roll playing $10 1 table SnG's to work on some of my issues there?

You're completely right about 100nl lot's of people think I can add up just because I have a maths degree...pah...

Thanks,
Chump

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Originally Posted by Pelion

Welcome to FTR. There are a whole bunch of stickies at the top inside the beginners digest including a bankroll management one

Read through everything there and more.

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Hi,

Thanks for the advice, and thanks for all your other posts - I recognise the picture and am sure I have read and learnt a lot from a lot of stuff you've posted :)

That's been my tactic recently, read,read,read,read.....The stuff I have found really usefull from a playing point of view is mostly the videos and HoH 3 as they have taught me lot about the way I should be thinking......do you have any suggestions in this direction???

Thanks,
Chump

Bankroll management bankroll management bankroll management. Read the stuff here and adhere to it. Otherwise you will be back to zero again soon enough...

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

am pretty confident I have 10nl beat.

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Play another 10k hands of 10nl, if you're still beating it then go and beat 25nl. Your roll is $1200, but you didn't win that from playing fullring cash poker... I guess you could just dive straight into 25nl, but step back if your roll drops below $1000 (losing 8 buyins could be variance, or could be worth improving before you drop even more)

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

I particularly enjoyed losing 10-10 to 10-10 all in preflop

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You've got to have a pretty good read to be getting it all-in pre flop with pocket tens. Sure, this was a badbeat, but when villain more likely has qq-aa you sorta deserved it.

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

ended up with $1200 for 6th.

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Very nice score dude, congratulations!

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

I'm comfortable at most levels for MTT's.... I'm ok at SnG but it's not my strong point (I'm guessing I should be playing at about $50 buy-in?).

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good mtt players are usually pretty solid SnG players... and $50 is too high.

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

What are peoples opinions on stepping up the cash stakes - I will probably play a bit of 25nl tonight, but should I be looking to play 100nl if that goes ok?

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re-read the bankroll management stuff. Understand the why behind the 30 buyins rule. You'd have to be running very well to move up to 100nl, turning $1200 into $3000 at 25nl could take a while... what about the intermediate step of 50nl?


As for bonuses and rakeback. If you're planning to be playing at the stakes you anticipate playing at I think you'd be silly not to be whoring. You can clear a lot of bonuses at 25nl... if you aren't US based then you can be earning a bunch while you play. Um, how many cash tables you comfortable running concurrently? and don't sign up to any new site without exploring the rakeback options thoroughly!

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Originally Posted by daven

Bankroll management bankroll management bankroll management. Read the stuff here and adhere to it. Otherwise you will be back to zero again soon enough...

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I know this so well, but I need to say it to myself everyday - and I did need to have it said. My last decent score was 1st in a $9 360 entrants for $800 odd blew it all taking shots at big buy-in MTT's........

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Originally Posted by daven

I guess you could just dive straight into 25nl, but step back if your roll drops below $1000 (losing 8 buyins could be variance, or could be worth improving before you drop even more)

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I have to be honest I will probably be giving this a go rather than stick at 10.....

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Originally Posted by daven

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

I particularly enjoyed losing 10-10 to 10-10 all in preflop

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You've got to have a pretty good read to be getting it all-in pre flop with pocket tens. Sure, this was a badbeat, but when villain more likely has qq-aa you sorta deserved it.

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$5.50 rebuy satelite to $55 I was tilting and induced a trashy villian to allin with ax and lower pockets a large part of his range.

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Originally Posted by daven

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

ended up with $1200 for 6th.

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Very nice score dude, congratulations!

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thanks :) I still went out on a dumb move but blame the fact it was 7am my time and the tourney started at midnight....

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Originally Posted by draven

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

I'm comfortable at most levels for MTT's.... I'm ok at SnG but it's not my strong point (I'm guessing I should be playing at about $50 buy-in?).

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good mtt players are usually pretty solid SnG players... and $50 is too high.

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I tried to explain the SNG situation slightly in my post above, I'm playing some $20 buyin now, is that about right?

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Originally Posted by draven

As for bonuses and rakeback. If you're planning to be playing at the stakes you anticipate playing at I think you'd be silly not to be whoring. You can clear a lot of bonuses at 25nl... if you aren't US based then you can be earning a bunch while you play. Um, how many cash tables you comfortable running concurrently? and don't sign up to any new site without exploring the rakeback options thoroughly!

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To play my best game probably not multi-table more than 2......but 4 is not a disaster, at the moment I am mostly playing only 1 table to concentrate on improving.....

I'm English, so basically study up on rakeback and whore like a err...whore?

Thanks for taking the time and effort, I really appreciate it


:D

Havent read anyone elses post so apologies if i go over old ground.

Its good that you now have a workable bankroll. Thats a great start point. However, if you feel you have tilt and emotional issues then i think you need to sit down and play small games that over a sample you will be able to beat and get used to the grind of cash games.
I suggest 25nl. You may be over rolled but you have issues about perhaps going busto if you get tilted bad, so take a safe amrgin. It'll also give lots of time to get used to how all this works without it having a significant impact on your br.

Dude... u sound like good people. Best of luck. Only thing I'll add is to NOT miss out on getting rakeback on your initial sign-up. I've made UB my home for a while now, but didn't know about RB when I originally signed up. Now I'm f-d, losing $5-$10 a day in potential RB and nothing I can do about it 'cept change sites. Bonuses come and go, but you'll be living with your RB decision for quite a while 'specially if you play a lot.

Good luck and welcome to FTR! :)

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I'm guessing I should be playing at about $50 buy-in?

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I have more than 8000 $ and still playing 20+2$ sng

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Originally Posted by VicVega

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I'm guessing I should be playing at about $50 buy-in?

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I have more than 8000 $ and still playing 20+2$ sng

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Move up, you git.

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

The problem is I think MTT's are where I really want to be, when I say I'm not particularly skilled at SnG's I think it is mostly a patience issue with the 1 table 5.50s on PStars....I feel perfectly happy playing ultra tight early on in the MTT's because I'm moving tables fast enough that no-one notices and there's allways some donk pushing before I even get a chance to move with AA or such like...But on the 1 table SnG's I seem to always want to act on my reads before I've taken long enough to sure them up.....My end game skills are actually ok I'd say if I make top 3 I win almost 50% of the time...From what your saying maybe I should invest some of the roll playing $10 1 table SnG's to work on some of my issues there?

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Hi and welcome to FTR, it's good to have you here.

I think that playing some STTs is a good way to improve your MTT game. A lot of the skills are similar and since you're immediately on the FT in a STT that's really good practice.

If you're bored at normal speed SNGs, then try turbos. You will need to develop your preflop push/fold game but that's a valuable skill. With a $1200 roll I'd play the $16 or $27 turbos at Stars (or equivalent at another site). If you want to play normal speed I'd say the $22s is where you want to be - move up to the $33s once you have about $1500 or so in your roll.

The other option is to play the $11 or $22/180 person SNGs - they're basically like unscheduled MTTs but have a pretty decent payout for the top few places, and they don't take quite as long as the huge field MTTs.

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

I have to be honest I will probably be giving this a go rather than stick at 10.....

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sounds ideal. Just so long as we've talked you out of hitting 100nl straight away!!! The 10nl suggestion was just to reinforce that 100nl would be crazy

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

I tried to explain the SNG situation slightly in my post above, I'm playing some $20 buyin now, is that about right?

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sounds good

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Originally Posted by chumpafoo

I'm English, so basically study up on rakeback and whore like a err... crack fiend?

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yep, there are a lot of resources around regarding bonuses and rakeback. DO NOT sign up for any site without first checking out if rakeback is available. Posting here to ask is a good way to find out easily, and might help you get the best first deposit bonuses at the same time. Suggest you start a separate thread for this, and make sure you've checked out methods for transferring money online (e-pass, neteller, moneybrookers, etc) so you don't get stung for transaction fees and currency conversion charges...

My advice: Get PokerTracker and start learning NL cash.