Two hands: Bet size, Top set

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07-09-2007, 11:04 PM
mixchange

Two hands: Bet size, Top set

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Hero ($104.45)
SB ($134.90)
BB ($48.50)
UTG ($117.05)
MP ($67.35)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 9http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif.
1 fold, MP raises to $2, Hero calls $2, SB calls $1.50, BB raises to $3, MP calls $1, Hero calls $1, SB calls $1.

Flop: ($12) 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, Qhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif (4 players)
SB checks, BB bets $3, MP calls $3, Hero raises to $16, SB folds, BB folds, MP folds.

Final Pot: $34

What do you think of this bet? I've taken criticism here for betting too lightly. There's $18 in the pot and I raise $13 more. Is this a good sized bet considering my draw? Used to be I'd be $10 here. Table is loose.

Hand #2

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Hero ($105.75)
MP ($128.90)
Button ($106.05)
SB ($91.45)
BB ($95.75)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif.
Hero raises to $4, MP calls $4, 3 folds.

Flop: ($9.50) 2http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 6http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif, 5http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif (2 players)
Hero checks, MP checks.

Turn: ($9.50) Jhttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif (2 players)
Hero bets $5, MP calls $5.

River: ($19.50) 4http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/heart.gif (2 players)
Hero bets $11, MP raises to $36, Hero ??

Well, I played this hand sooooo bad. I missed my c/r on the flop (should always bet it, lots of PP will call anyway and lots can beat us or be scary on turn, smart villains if behind won't take the bait and will see my check as a sign of strength). Villain has been a solid player who I expected to bet, but smartly did not. This led to me to think he either had overcards or a small/medium PP.

On the turn I hit yahtzee and figured hand was in the bag so I didn't want to bet too big to keep him going. What do you think? Bet $8?

Shoulda been $8 flop, $18 turn.

Then river comes and I'm raised. I think my river bet was a fine value size considering the action leading up. I figure I just call here, not raise right? My hand is pretty disguised, but he could have a straight.
07-09-2007, 11:13 PM
bigspenda73

Don't really see how he has a 3. I 3bet that river, just not sure how much really, I guess you just only have enough left for a shove.
07-09-2007, 11:16 PM
Galapogos

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

Don't really see how he has a 3. I 3bet that river, just not sure how much really, I guess you just only have enough left for a shove.

78?
07-09-2007, 11:20 PM
|~|ypermegachi

hand 1: i like.

hand 2:
http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/1...eckflopkk5.jpg
07-09-2007, 11:26 PM
Cocco_Bill

hand1 standard except perhaps preflop

hand 2 bet flop every time
07-10-2007, 01:46 AM
sauce123

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cocco_Bill

hand1 standard except perhaps preflop

hand 2 bet flop every time
07-10-2007, 03:34 AM
snowbird4life

Quote:

Originally Posted by sauce123

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cocco_Bill

hand1 standard except perhaps preflop

hand 2 bet flop every time

pretty much
07-10-2007, 04:36 AM
mixchange

well, I know I shoulda bet the flop as I mentioned. Comments on river?

Glad to know Hand 1 I'm playing right. Sometimes I'm not quite sure what to bet with that kind of hand. Bill, what would you do PF?
07-10-2007, 04:59 AM
snowbird4life

well first off, i wouldn't try to check raise the flop with jj especially when your in the betting lead, id say 85 percent of the time your opponnent will check behind here. especially on that flop. As you know, i think the flop check is just horrrible and i wouldn't recommend it, theres really no point, what are you expecting him to do? bet his kq aj etc? I guess if he had a low pp he would, but i think your being pretty optimistic to check and hope for this situation.

And as you noted, a big preflop raise or a 3 bet preflop, then a check on the flop often means big hand/set so, i don't think the check really is doing anything for you here at all. Also when an overcard comes on the turn, what do you do? Also i think you can bet more on the turn here, esp with the draws out, I think i bet 6-7ish. Same with the river, i probably bet more like 13-16.

As for the river comments, i think this is a call. While im tempted to shove, what is he pulling this bluff with, air? As you noted he is a solid player. This could easily be something like 2 pair, lower set slowplaying till the river then wanting value etc, but i think the chances are too great he has something like 78s here to warrant a raise. My vote is he flips over 78s and I would just call.

As for hand 1, preflop i probably fold, these min raises are just annoying, can often be reraised, and from some donks, min raises actually represent huge hands so from some players, you have to respect them. As for the flop 3 bet, everything seems fine there to me. Are you disappointed that they folded? I think the outcome is pretty acceptable that they folded. Your hand while strong, is still a drawing hand, and while it would be nice to get a call and hit your hand, i think taking it down there works just fine for me.
07-10-2007, 05:36 AM
Da GOAT

im interested in hearing spots where c/r'ing flop is better than c/b'ing after you PFR'ed.

here for example hero thinks opp has lower PP so why not bet? why do you want your check to look like a show of strenght vs smart opp's?
07-10-2007, 10:10 AM
bigspenda73

Quote:

Originally Posted by Galapogos

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigspenda73

Don't really see how he has a 3. I 3bet that river, just not sure how much really, I guess you just only have enough left for a shove.

78?

Yea, didn't even notice that. It does have to be discounted a bit due to the fact that opponent didn't fire the flop after we checked.
07-10-2007, 05:30 PM
snowbird4life

Quote:

Originally Posted by Da GOAT

im interested in hearing spots where c/r'ing flop is better than c/b'ing after you PFR'ed.

here for example hero thinks opp has lower PP so why not bet? why do you want your check to look like a show of strenght vs smart opp's?

Maybe i misread your question a little bit, but I think a spot where c/ring the flop would be better, is if you think your opponent hit the flop in some fashion, then when you check raise it would rep strength (overpair or set) as if you really hit the flop hard against a good thinking opponent, and hopefully get value out of a whiffed hand and get them to fold a solid hand that has you beat.

but i dont think hero wanted his check to look like a show of strength. I think it was just something we noted, as often a 3 bet pre or a big raise and then a check on the flop represents a huge hand.