KK, lots of action

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $.02 BB (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

MP3 ($.73)
Hero ($2)
Button ($1.97)
SB ($.67)
BB ($3.68)
UTG ($2.20)
UTG+1 ($4)
UTG+2 ($1.09)
MP1 ($.40)
MP2 ($2.31)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif, Khttp://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.02, UTG+2 calls $0.02, MP1 calls $0.02, 1 fold, MP3 calls $0.02, Hero raises to $0.14, 3 folds, UTG+1 calls $0.12, UTG+2 calls $0.12, MP1 calls $0.12, MP3 calls $0.12.

Flop: ($0.73) 8http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es/diamond.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...miles/club.gif, 7http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...iles/spade.gif (5 players)
UTG+1 checks, UTG+2 checks, MP1 checks, MP3 bets $0.59 (All-In), Hero calls $0.59, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 raises to $0.95 (All-In), MP1 folds, Hero ???

can I ever fold this?

No possible way you could justify folding here. But if I were you, I'd try and raise more preflop when 4 people limp ahead of you. Get some value out of those cowboys!

Push the flop

$0.20-0.25 to go preflop, and I agree with TLR, reshove the flop. NO way you can possibly think about folding here.

I definitively should have raised more preflop.

I called for two reasons. First because the pot is s$2.86 and I have to call $0.36. second because I had seen these guys go and call all-ins with crap. What are your reasons for calling/pushing the flop?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by miracleriver

I definitively should have raised more preflop.

I called for two reasons. First because the pot is s$2.86 and I have to call $0.36. second because I had seen these guys go and call all-ins with crap. What are your reasons for calling/pushing the flop?

---

You are referring to the 2nd call, while I was referring to the 1st one
According to your post when you called the flop bet pot was 1.32 and you had to call 0.59, at this point you want not let drawing hands be priced in to call, if you call the 0.59 the pot will become 1.91, and villians need to call 0.59, giving the first call 3:1 odds to call, the 2nd one 4:1 etc...
This is why you should push after MP3 went AI, you want to get the other guys to fold their draws, hopefully get a call from someone with A8 or something similar.
If someone has a 7 you are screwed, but thats a chance worse taking.

i dont think your pf raise was that bad...if it was the first hand at that table. but, if you had been there awhile, you should notice what it takes to "thin the field" and raise it up bigger...if neccesary.

that said, this is $2 NL. a place where a lot of players are using a short-stacked strategy with 100 BB stacks. they simply do not respect the amounts (percentage wise) of money in stacks and on the table. you need to adjust for that fact.

and at these stakes, i am pretty sure you need to shove over the flop and make anyone else play for their stack, too. KK is nice, but dont be surprised to find a 7 in the bunch...too many people saw the flop.

you would prolly have decent success open-shoving QQ+ in a $2 table...so long as you had some limpers in front like you did here. a lot of AJ+/88+ would prolly call you down for $2. again, i dont think they are thinking in terms of BB's at this level...hell, they barely do at 10 NL. and you need to take advantage of that.

i reckon this "table texture" is kind of similar to a 1/2 NL live game at your local casino. maybe not quite, but the point is...

you will find a $8 raise at a 1/2 NL table live will not do what it will online. i repeatedly saw $15 raises get a hand down to 4 ways post flop. that meant that the pot was already $60!! now how do you protect a flop with an over pair when there are all kinds of draws out there? you almost need to shove the flop...to get any respect at all. if you lead pot on the flop, and get a caller or two...you are almost comitted to the river, but dont have the stack size to correctly take away odds on the river...or value bet. it becomes a "shove any made hand" kind of game.

to practice getting a feel for this...drop to play money for a bit. buy in full, and see how far you can go with bullying the table with "fake money." see what kind of stack you can build. when they fold, and when they start to stick up for themselves. when you build a huge bankroll by bullying off the play money nits (once you locate them), you switch to $2 NL, and do the same thing...you will notice you will get a little more respect (because you are actually playing for a little money), but not much. you can do almost the same thing. but, it wont work for long at higher levels...people will play back at you faster the higher you go.

ahhh, the birthplace of LAG poker...play money.

I don't raise it anymore than .18 PF

as played it's an easy flop push

Someone please check my math on this one.

I've got that there is a 17% chance that one of your opponents has a 7. Therefor, you are a 9:1 underdog 17% of the time. On the other hand, you are a 4:1 favorite 83% of the time. You are getting 8:1 odds to call. If this is correct, you are not enough of an underdog NEAR ENOUGH of the time to fold here.

No purpose to this, just practicing my math skills.

REAL ADVICE: I like 30-35c to go preflop. You're almost guaranteed a caller at this level. Always better to play a heads up pot with kings against a good hand like AJs+/TT-QQ.

you realize it's $2nl and not $5nl right unibomber?

I realize, and maybe that raise suggestion is based on the fact that I can't play this low stakes at Absolute (even though I probably need to). However, I stick by my suggestion. I want to push out a hand that could possibly hit hard on a flop just like this. Maybe too aggresive you think?

I believe that making bets and raises a little bigger at this level, causes the opponents to make their mistakes a little bigger.

nice to use the math to make the decision, but sometimes you need to pin villain on a range before you go to math.

if you have a read on the players/table, it would help.

dont get me wrong, i still think you call, but i cant get pissed when i see the 7.

The math was just brain exercise. I'm a fighter, I can't do that kind of math at the table. I have a hard time remembering that I'm playing poker. I was hoping someone could check the math for me and tell me if I did it right.