How profitable is this game for most of you?

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05-13-2006, 08:16 PM
slyman__07

How profitable is this game for most of you?

Hey all,
This is new for me I have never been involved with any forums before, but every since I got hooked on NL holdem I'm trying to gain as much knowledge as I can about it. I truly love this game and want to continually better myself at it.

My question is quite simply, Is it really possible to make decent gains playing online poker for money? I have been playing and studying this game for about 4 months now. I have only played a small number of real money, online games one of which was profitable, however I went back to the same room again and lost a lot more money. I'm also winning a lot more of my live home games against friends that I play with after work. I understand that newbies generally lose a lot, however my game has been improving to the point were I now in most online, play money games, tend to be one of the top if not the only top player in that game. I'm excited about this game because of the challenge it gives me and I have seen the potential to make a decent profit, but I am also conflicted because I still don't see enough consistency in the game for me to justify being comfortable playing more money games.

Often what I see is a very tight game where the players only raise and play into the flop with top hands, or games that are semi loose, but cost me an arm and a leg because everybody is raising during the pre-flop to rediculous amounts. When I have a high ranking hand I can't afford to pay huge amounts of money every single time just to see that the flop does not benefit me at all and I better fold. Is it possible to find with some consistency, games were I have a chance at making some financial gains? I have not really found a lot yet. There are still games that make me second guess wether or not I would be able to make some money and play at a competent level with those around me.

I'm going to continue to practice and read here and at home from some of the poker books I have been borrowing from the library. Any information you folks might have or stories of success that you might want to share that would boost my confidence would be greatly appreciated. I don't know if there is a limit to how much I can post, so I do apologize for the length of this message. Future messages I will keep shorter, this is just a big conflict I'm dealing with and really need re-assurance for.

Thanks all!
Slyman__07[/quote]
05-13-2006, 08:23 PM
Pelion

Re: How profitable is this game for most of you?

Quote:

Originally Posted by slyman__07

I still don't see enough consistency in the game for me to justify being comfortable playing more money games.

Poker is not a game of consistency. It is a game of varience. If you play better than the other players then over time you will make money, however it is very easy to sit at a table and play perfectly and come out at a loss. Over the course of 500 hands or so you will usually see a profit if you are outplaying your opponents. There will be times when you go for literally thousands of hands breaking even or losing without making too many major mistakes, but thats just the game.

If you want to take it up seriously I suggest moving away from play money games. You can play far better and far more fun money games at a $2 buyin without risking much money. Just jump in and see what happens... Oh and post lots of hands too.

Welcome to the Forums
05-13-2006, 08:47 PM
KingLizard

Re: How profitable is this game for most of you?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelion

Quote:

Originally Posted by slyman__07

I still don't see enough consistency in the game for me to justify being comfortable playing more money games.

Poker is not a game of consistency. It is a game of varience. If you play better than the other players then over time you will make money, however it is very easy to sit at a table and play perfectly and come out at a loss. Over the course of 500 hands or so you will usually see a profit if you are outplaying your opponents. There will be times when you go for literally thousands of hands breaking even or losing without making too many major mistakes, but thats just the game.

If you want to take it up seriously I suggest moving away from play money games. You can play far better and far more fun money games at a $2 buyin without risking much money. Just jump in and see what happens... Oh and post lots of hands too.

Welcome to the Forums

Two great points here:
1) The variance - I played 5K hands and tripled my BR. Then the next 4K were flat. It seems there are up sessions, days, and even a couple of weeks. Then down we go.

2) Stop with the play money. Every once in awhile, usually during a downturn, I'll hit the play money tables. There is just no comparison. All in with nothing ... oops ... stacked ... reload with more free money.

Good luck and try out the micro stakes NLHE tables at a website near you.
05-13-2006, 08:47 PM
SinkRox

Develop your game, and find sites/games you like to play in and do most well in... keep playing and studying.. and youll see results.

A year ago i moved form a yrs of micro SnGs to cash and started making $6.6 per hour 5 tabling 20NL.. fast foward a year and ive learnt alot more and am now making 20-30 p/hr at4-6tabling 100NL. Some of the top guys are making 100-400 p/hr... thats sick. work at it and see how far you can go :D remember its an everlong road of progression.
05-13-2006, 08:50 PM
johnnyBuz

i first started playing online ring games around november. and to be honest, i have lost quite a bit of money. but those losses have taught me MANY MANY things. and i can tell that i am always improving. and every now and then i feel like i take a huge step forwards, in terms of knowledge and tactics to utilize in online play.

the past few days i have been on an absolute tear and am working my bankroll up to be able to play NL50 without fear of losing a buy-in, or two, or three. that was always my problem before. being too worried about losing money that i couldn't win it.

now i'm just enjoying the upswing i am on, and trying to be realistic that it won't last forever, and when the cards run dry just tighten up and stop trying to get "cute" and make plays at pots that i have no business being in. i think that's where a lot of my money is lost, pots i shouldn't be in. then i lose my bankroll on a hand where i was a favorite and got bad beat and start cursing out pokerstars and anyone that will listen.

this has all taught me its about patience, intelligence, and just a tad bit of luck. but i am starting to discover that i can make some decent money at this game (for a college student) and i think you can too, as long as you improve and take an objective look at your play.

i know people say it's better to start at low limits, but IMO anything less then NL25 isn't profitable. the players are such maniacs, and tactics that work at other limits, like blind steals, re-raises, etc. hardly work there because people aren't afraid of just going all-in with their full stack ($5 max) so it's hard to get a feel for how real poker is played. that's my take on it. hope this helped some.
05-13-2006, 10:43 PM
WhooFleuryScores

I'd say mostly everything that needs to be said has been said;I myself am approaching the 2 year mark so I need to start making results too.That being said this is a long term game,and do your best,keep studying,learning,posting hh,and keep plugging away.

Remember;noone else can trully distate your results but your decisions.The cards will fall as they do,and even then they will even out in turn.
05-13-2006, 10:46 PM
JB25163

Quote:

Originally Posted by SinkRox

everlong

good song
05-13-2006, 11:41 PM
slyman__07

Thank you for your comments they have really helped and boosted my confidence and renewed my perspective.

I also must say that I am impressed with this forum there is just a plethora of useful information and just interesting reading material.

Thanks again, this won't be my last post!!
05-14-2006, 12:39 AM
martindcx1e

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnyBuz

i know people say it's better to start at low limits, but IMO anything less then NL25 isn't profitable.

yes but learning at 25NL could be quite expensive
05-14-2006, 01:11 AM
Renton

i started at 25nl
05-14-2006, 01:13 AM
martindcx1e

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renton

i started at 25nl

well either you had an expensive learning period or you started off playing pretty solid.
05-14-2006, 01:23 AM
johnnyBuz

anything lower then 25nl your just going to see straight up awkward and bad play, and i don't think it prepares you for 25NL.
05-14-2006, 01:26 AM
martindcx1e

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnyBuz

anything lower then 25nl your just going to see straight up awkward and bad play, and i don't think it prepares you for 25NL.

i think 10NL at stars/ub do a good enough job of preparing. winning consistently at those games should translate to winning at 25NL usually.
05-14-2006, 01:28 AM
Renton

Quote:

Originally Posted by martindcx1e

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renton

i started at 25nl

well either you had an expensive learning period or you started off playing pretty solid.

i did a lot of reading prior. I did piss away about 200 bucks or so playing like crap on 25nl and a bunch of tournaments though.
05-14-2006, 01:36 AM
Renton

rofl

I played a little drunken 50nl tonight.

http://img83.imageshack.us/img83/2931/rofl6bu.jpg
05-14-2006, 01:43 AM
martindcx1e

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renton

rofl

I played a little drunken 50nl tonight.

[img]loading it[/img]

lol i saw you at the 50nl tables and was wondering if your 200nl downswing got that bad haha.
05-14-2006, 03:21 AM
donnybaker

you're at the right place, i've learned a crapload here.

I've been playing for almost a year and I can tell you that there is decent money in playing poker.

Like others said, stay away from the play money, you won't learn anything. You only need a $20 bankroll to play $2 NL. $100 and you can play the $10 NL on stars or somewhere, and that is easily profitable. If you play a standard TAG game, you will increase your bankroll. Make sure you check out the bankroll management thread, that is key to making money imho. I'm pretty sure that 80% or more players online don't closely track their play and just keep reloading (where the profit comes from).

Play for bonuses whenever possible, the party bonus clears easily at $25 NL, but you need $500 to make the most of it. Bonuses add up. They account for about half my total bankroll right now. Plus, as you're learning you will make stupid mistakes and lose money, a bonus helps to ease the pain.

Finally get pokertracker or pokeroffice. I know you can get pokeroffice through a bonus, but I've got both and I haven't used PO in a few months, I just like PT a lot better, so I recommend it.

Anyway, good luck!
05-14-2006, 05:43 AM
Pelion

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnyBuz

i know people say it's better to start at low limits, but IMO anything less then NL25 isn't profitable

er..... huh?

The worse the players are, the more profitable the game is (provided you make the right adjustments). 10NL on stars is very beatable. 5NL on stars is even more beatable. 2NL on paradise is a goldmine in terms of the rate at which you will double up.
05-14-2006, 06:10 AM
fjuanl

you'll get better with experience. make an effort to study but realize that you cannot get better without the experience. when i first started playing i was barely up any $ but after I learned from my mistakes and gained experience, all of a sudden I started winning a lot more
05-14-2006, 05:54 PM
johnnyBuz

i can't play 5 or 10NL on stars. i either get too cocky or try raising .25 minimum (on 5) when people usually raise like to .08 max or something.

i just cant figure those games out. and it's too slow for me. my learning curve has started at 25nl.