Putting a man on a hand

I can't do it. Can you? How do you go about doing this?

I often see people playing a hand, and somehow they "know" that their opponent is on a strait/flush draw, or overcards, or perhaps an overpair. I've been trying to read players, but I'm having trouble with the limited information available in Texas Hold 'Em. All I can observe is starting hand selection on the occasion that a hand is shown down. I play Sit 'N Gos, and with the aggresive style that is typical of the lower stake games, many pots are won uncontested. I suppose I need more information than that, but I'm not exactly sure what to look for, and how to make use of the info.

I guess what I'm asking for is critera to use when trying to read a player, and how to apply that information. I'm sure many of you are going to tell me that it just takes practice, experience, or instinct, and I'm trying my best to learn, but I don't think I'm going about this the right way. I find myself just guessing what they have, and most of the time I'm wrong.

If anyone has the time, I would really like to see a hand history (preferrably of a SNG) in which you have developed a read on a player(s), with notes on how/why you've made these reads. Perhaps that's a ridiculous request, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

Thanks in advance for the replies. I think this site is an excellent resource, and I appreciate the effort you all have made in educating the students of the game.

I think the best you can try to do is put someone on a range of hands and try to guess at which hand combination is the most likely for that person.

eg.

You are the button with AJ, there is two limpers before you and you limp in too.

Flop comes 36J with two hearts.

BB and first guy check, second limper min-bets and you raise to 3/4 the pot. At this point the BB and first limper fold and the guy who min-betted calls.

Now you think about his guy:
1) You think he is a fish because he plays a lot of hands and likes to gamble.
2) You check your notes on the guy and they say you've seen him show down Axs.

What else do we know:
1) You know from experience that fish like to play sooted cards.
2) You've read that lots of really bad players like to min-bet draws in the hope that other players wont raise.
3) You know that the flop has a possible flush draw and low straight draw.
4) You know its unlikely he has the straght draw because though he is a bad player is is unlikely that he is playing 45.
(This would be different if the big blind was playing against you, he could have anything)
5) If he has the a jack then his kicker is lower then yours so you arent to concerned about that. You also remember that fish love to call down with TPNK so is a strong possibility that is what he is doing.
6) Fish don't mind chasing without pot odds.

Now keeping all this in mind, we watch as the 2 of hearts hits the turn.

Villan thinks for a few seconds and checks.

What do we know:
1) His two most likely holdings are a pair or a flush draw. He also could have 2 pair or a set but they are hard to detect so we wont worry about them for the minute.
2) We know that bad players like to slowplay strong hands.

Okay, so at this point we are slightly worried that he has the flush. So we bet for information.

We aren't trying to defend against draws so a 1/3 pot bet should do.

We bet 1/3 the pot and the villan thinks again and calls.

New info:
1) Again villan likes to slowplay so we are still thinking he could have the flush even though he didnt raise.
2) The probability of him having something like a pair increaces a little bit because we know that fish like to call down with pairs.

River comes 2c

This is a card which is unlikely to have helped anyone except a set which is now a full house.

Villan bets 3/4 the pot.

Now we think:
1) His most likely hands were a pair and a flush.
2) He wouldn't produce this big river bet if he had a pair. It doesn't follow the standard fish calling down pattern. A pair is out.
3) It's possible he had a set or two pair but I think he would have raised the turn because my bet was so small. We give this a 20% probability.
4) Its always possible he is bluffing, according to Harrington on Holdem this should get at least 10%.
5) Its still possible he is playing a pair in a weird way. 20%
6) The most likely possibility is that he has the flush. 50%

So we fold.

So, considering all the above we deduce that his most likely holding is a flush. Congradulations, we've put the guy on a hand.

Reads are based on a few things:
1. Player's history of action (in this Sng, previous Sngs)
2. Players action in a specific hand
3. 'Common' betting patterns

For exmaple a tight player who folds 90% of the hands raise preflop 3-4BB from EP - you can probably put him on AA,KK,QQ,AK.

Examples of 'common' betting patterns
1. Continuation bets after preflop agression
2. Calling bets with flush/str8 draws in lower limits indicates a lot of times flushes and str8.
3. Calling your bets on the flop and the turn and raising hard on the turn is a lot of times indication of a slowplaying of strong hand.
4. Small bets when flush or str8 draws exist is sometimes also an indication of a draw.

It takes experience and practice, there is no 'cookbook' on how to read players.

One thing you have to do is to observe the actions of the players pretty closely. Most players follow some sort of pattern (they are tight, they are loose, they like to play suited connectors, they fold without TPTK or better, they play any A etc.. etc.. etc...)
Keep notes on players, for one thing you cant remember everything, and for another, the act of taking notes makes you more observant.

the biggest thing about it is practice and expierience. The more you play, the more you'll get a feel for how people play and learn to sniff out betting patterns. also, just try practicing at it. based on what information you have, just start trying to make guesses at what people have. And don't just do it on hands your involved in. while your sitting at a table, watch every hand that's going on and pay close attention to what people show down.

One advice that was given a while ago, dont remember by whom, is that in order to practice this skill play a low buy in tournament, and cover your hole cards, play only according to 'reads'. I have not tried it but it sounds like a cool idea

My ability to "read" hands has improved a lot. How? My method is simply by making a read on every single hand that I see.

While the ability to see hole cards has made poker televisable (is that a word?), the next great idea for televised events IMO will be to display only the chip stacks and blind levels when hands are being shown and then to reveal the hole cards only after all of the action is completed.

My ability to read hands has also greatly improved. It takes experience. It takes paying attention. Sometimes, it takes not playing lower stakes because people there often have no clue what they're doing, so you see some crazy things.

Every bet tells a story. Search for AOK's piece where he describes the betting that goes on in poker as a "conversation" between however many people are involved in the hand. Every bet has a reason, and it's either to gain information, to represent (or misrepresent) a hand, etc...

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Originally Posted by chardrian

While the ability to see hole cards has made poker televisable (is that a word?), the next great idea for televised events IMO will be to display only the chip stacks and blind levels when hands are being shown and then to reveal the hole cards only after all of the action is completed.

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I'd love to see this happen, but I'm afraid the general public wouldn't like it. They used to have poker on TV with this format, and except for hands that saw a showdown or all-in confrontations it was ridiculously boring to watch. "Jim, Dan Harrington just raised on the button. This could be a steal attempt or he may actually have a hand here. Okay, lets see what everyone else does...Okay, everyone has folded and Dan Harrington takes down a pot. Wow, what exciting poker we have going on right here!" :roll: You'd never know if he was raising crap or AA. For some reason that just doesn't seem like fun TV to me.

I don't think it'd be much more interesting if you had everyone's hole cards *after* the hand, either...You'd see people betting, maybe having a hand take 2-3 minutes to be complete, and only then you'd know why people were doing what they were doing.

It'd be fun for us poker dweebs, but not everyone is like us.

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Originally Posted by Ultimate George

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chardrian

While the ability to see hole cards has made poker televisable (is that a word?), the next great idea for televised events IMO will be to display only the chip stacks and blind levels when hands are being shown and then to reveal the hole cards only after all of the action is completed.

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I'd love to see this happen, but I'm afraid the general public wouldn't like it. They used to have poker on TV with this format, and except for hands that saw a showdown or all-in confrontations it was ridiculously boring to watch. "Jim, Dan Harrington just raised on the button. This could be a steal attempt or he may actually have a hand here. Okay, lets see what everyone else does...Okay, everyone has folded and Dan Harrington takes down a pot. Wow, what exciting poker we have going on right here!" :roll: You'd never know if he was raising crap or AA. For some reason that just doesn't seem like fun TV to me.

I don't think it'd be much more interesting if you had everyone's hole cards *after* the hand, either...You'd see people betting, maybe having a hand take 2-3 minutes to be complete, and only then you'd know why people were doing what they were doing.

It'd be fun for us poker dweebs, but not everyone is like us.

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The difference is that older televised events only got to see the hands on rare occassions so the viewing audience never knew if it was a bluff, a made hand, etc. afterwards. Now you would get that info on every hand. My wife - who finds televised poker to be as interesting as I find the home shopping network - has asked me why don't they wait until after those guys bet to show us the cards? Otherwise all they do is put up a whole bunch of odds.

To me it is sorta like that old gameshow "Password." Me and my grandma used to put a piece of tape over the tv so that we wouldn't see the damn word and could actually play along. The same could be done with televised poker me thinks.

AOK's "Conversations" can be found here:

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...=conversations

I think everyone ahs pointed out the key factor.
Experience.
It takes a long time. The simple thing is that you can play any hand in any way (yes thats a problem) But, especially at lower stakes players play their hands in a similar fashion. You wont see someone raise you with a big draw very often. They call your bets, then often check the danger card to you, as irish mentions. Similarily, big hands often raise the turn unless they dont like the flop. This is another sign. Basically you have to wonder firstly what a player would expect to play from his position (not always good at lower stakes) and then why would they call/fold/raise you with the hands you would expect them to play from their position.

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Originally Posted by Irisheyes

I think the best you can try to do is put someone on a range of hands and try to guess at which hand combination is the most likely for that person.

eg.

You are the button with AJ, there is two limpers before you and you limp in too.

Flop comes 36J with two hearts.

BB and first guy check, second limper min-bets and you raise to 3/4 the pot. At this point the BB and first limper fold and the guy who min-betted calls.

Now you think about his guy:
1) You think he is a fish because he plays a lot of hands and likes to gamble.
2) You check your notes on the guy and they say you've seen him show down Axs.

What else do we know:
1) You know from experience that fish like to play sooted cards.
2) You've read that lots of really bad players like to min-bet draws in the hope that other players wont raise.
3) You know that the flop has a possible flush draw and low straight draw.
4) You know its unlikely he has the straght draw because though he is a bad player is is unlikely that he is playing 45.
(This would be different if the big blind was playing against you, he could have anything)
5) If he has the a jack then his kicker is lower then yours so you arent to concerned about that. You also remember that fish love to call down with TPNK so is a strong possibility that is what he is doing.
6) Fish don't mind chasing without pot odds.

Now keeping all this in mind, we watch as the 2 of hearts hits the turn.

Villan thinks for a few seconds and checks.

What do we know:
1) His two most likely holdings are a pair or a flush draw. He also could have 2 pair or a set but they are hard to detect so we wont worry about them for the minute.
2) We know that bad players like to slowplay strong hands.

Okay, so at this point we are slightly worried that he has the flush. So we bet for information.

We aren't trying to defend against draws so a 1/3 pot bet should do.

We bet 1/3 the pot and the villan thinks again and calls.

New info:
1) Again villan likes to slowplay so we are still thinking he could have the flush even though he didnt raise.
2) The probability of him having something like a pair increaces a little bit because we know that fish like to call down with pairs.

River comes 2c

This is a card which is unlikely to have helped anyone except a set which is now a full house.

Villan bets 3/4 the pot.

Now we think:
1) His most likely hands were a pair and a flush.
2) He wouldn't produce this big river bet if he had a pair. It doesn't follow the standard fish calling down pattern. A pair is out.
3) It's possible he had a set or two pair but I think he would have raised the turn because my bet was so small. We give this a 20% probability.
4) Its always possible he is bluffing, according to Harrington on Holdem this should get at least 10%.
5) Its still possible he is playing a pair in a weird way. 20%
6) The most likely possibility is that he has the flush. 50%

So we fold.

So, considering all the above we deduce that his most likely holding is a flush. Congradulations, we've put the guy on a hand.

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I like this way of thinking out a hand...thanks :)

Putting someone on a hand is just putting them on the range of hands that make sense for the bets they have made. That's it pure and simple. Anyone that says they know exactly what someone else holds is full of it. If you have read HOH, he says when players are thinking a long time, they are usually trying to figure out the hands that the opponent may have betted like that with, figuring the odds of each of those hands, and then deciding whether to call or not. When good poker players sit and think, they are rarely trying to sniff a bluff.