Image manipulation

I just played a short session (30 mins) at 100NL, outside my bankroll so i bought in half stacked. Though there was only one other guy there with a stack much bigger than me anyway.

It was short handed (4 players) so i sat tight for a few hands showing an AK preflop raise, and a top pair flop bet.. then went into LAGG mode. I made a series of plays against one player inparticular that i wish to ask about.

6 hands total. (they did not happen consecutively)
1st hand - raise preflop he calls, i bet flop with 9 high, he folds, i show it.
2nd hand - I limp suited connectors and bet an OESD, all folds, i show it.
3rd hand - I raise preflop in EP, check raise the flop and show Q high

now i think he's going to start calling/raiseing me so i look for an oppertunity to lose a couple of bets to him suggesting that i'm always bluffing the flop. hence i can tighten and make him pay.

4th hand - I limp 79s and bet the flop, he calls, i check the turn and fold to his bet

so now he thinks that my flop bets are bullshit, so...
5th hand - i raise preflop, pot the flop, and pot the turn, and show him a 10 high gutshot draw.

6th hand - Now its deffinately time to tighten up.. i wait about 7 hands before raising AQ hearts, he's the only caller.. i flop a flush draw, make my usual continuation so he thinks i'm bluffing again, with the intent to check fold the turn if i miss. I hit my draw, so i check and he bets 2/3rds the pot, smooth call. river blank, i check.. he bets again, weakly, I raise, and he pays me most of his stack.

total profit $40 for the session, quite good for half an hour and only one decent hand, unfortunately i'd taken half the guys stack in bluffs so the pay off was small because he only had around 20 left

now the question.. is hand 4 a good idea? if you can execute it and only lose the minimum amount, to make him think he can run me over for when i hit my big hand. And also to set up that when i'm bluffing i will give it up on the turn, allowing me to make a bigger bluff on the turn in other hands. Or have i set up enough of a loose image with the other hands anyway?

I think hand 4 was better for you than him. On that hand he showed you that he thought you were bluffing and you rewarded him for his play, after that you knew it was almost time to tighten up. Hand 5 shows him that you are now going to bluff out even further, coaxing him into keeping his hands longer and paying you off better when you do hit your hand. Unfortunately for him, I don't think he knew who the sucker at the table was, but you pegged him pretty good.

You're my hero. I haven't experimented with image at 100NL yet. I manipulate the shit out of 25NL, and do my fair share at 50NL. I guess because the 100NL tables I've been sitting at on Party are already action friendly.

Nothing quite like action farming. I had a good laugh one night when I bet $20 into an $10 pot after telling this guy he had no backbone repeatedly. He called me with ace high and won. I took too long to flip the tight switch. The guy is now a good friend of mine in that poker room, and we have a lot of respect for one another. I never enjoyed losing half a buy in quite that much. It was hilarious.

hahaha that would be a semi decent way to lose money.. though i'll still try to avoid it.

This was at the 100 table on champs.. full ring but with only the few people there.. and they seemed pretty weak so i wasnt going to make any money sitting around waiting for hands. Hence the need for bet bet bet bet bet bet bet. It was all around small egdes though, and i'm beginning to think/realise that lagg is predominately about that, taking all the smaller pots i can, and using them to manipulate the image, and not ivesting to much money into a bluff.. say no more that 10 bets? except on the odd occassion where it really does call for an AI.

Also ron.. do you play much lagg at full ring or just go back to camping and save the manipulation for 6max?

oh and.. gus hansen sat at the champs NL25 table tonight.. that was pretty rockin, i havent seen him on in a long time.

Edit: In reference to ejdewey's post.. so you think its a good idea to do this intentional loss on occasion? does anyone else agree?

If you don't mind giving away a couple of bucks I think it is golden. At that point he probably figured he could read you like a book and made him alot more confident that he could bust you at any time. Hand 5 was gravy here, with that one he is even happier to follow you to the river so you can drown him in it. Personally, I like to pull these kinds of players a little to get a feel for how far they can be lead, but the way you set out to do this takes some real guts. It's not often you find a guppy like this.

i dont think i would do it too often.. but because it was short handed i was able to get into alot of pots with him.. and no one else there was that into agression, so i was 80-90% preflop raising and really pushing these guys around.. I made a point of showing my solid preflop raises if i took the blinds.. to keep them guessing.. ie. good hands preflop, shit hands on the flop/turn. I dont know if thats a good idea or not. I think the whole strategy just really wouldnt work with any more than 3-4 players because i was singling out a certain player rather than adressing my whole table image.. I dont think the other guys were all that aware anyway, so it was just me and him, so i bet at him and respect the other guys, not that they did a great deal of betting anyway...

I think for it to work at a bigger game it would have to be a pretty aware table.. I think there would be alot of players who are aware of things in hands that they play but dont actually watch when they aren't in the hand. To often you might get the great image with one guy from the intentional loss while the rest of the table hasnt picked up on it and you cant guarentee that you'll be in a pot with the right guy when you hit your hand.

6 max VS Full Ring in the LAGG department is a risk reward equation. If you build a bad image successfully on full ring it can be way more rewarding than 6 max. The problem is you get caught more often for losses in the process of building a shitty image on ful ring since there are fewer "non action" hands. Bigger risk, bigger reward IMO.

When I sit at full ring I'm less inclined to build image since there's a better chance a couple of real fish are sitting at the table making it somewhat unnecessary.