Randomness thread, part two.

[jackvance]

My breakfast is often a microwave pizza.

[boost]

My parents were those hippies on the "bleeding edge" of organic back in the 70s and shit. It's crazy to see how far it's come. Fuckin' big food man, they found a way to fuck it up.

Their "free range eggs" are SHIT compared to my real free range eggs. For the most part grocery store organic that's shipped across the continent is as expensive or more than local farmers market produce, and is lower quality to boot

Yeah, for eggs (and pretty much everything, but especially eggs), it's conventional(pale small flat lying yolks, no flavor)<<<<quality no hormone free-range store bought<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<<<<<<locally raised fresh farmers market

[d0zer]

we've got ducks that just started laying eggs, and they're even more flavorful than our chicken eggs, and the yolk is tough as fuck. Like it's so thick that when you puncture it raw in the pan, it doesn't leak, almost like poking into the yolk of a near-overdone fried egg.

[eugmac]

ya buying local is far more important imo than buying organic. part of me actually wants to start from scratch as a farmer.

[rong]

Part of me wants to start from scratch as a porn producer.

[Luco]

Part of me wants to start from scratch as a porn producer.

I think I can guess which part

[bikes]

france has banned child beauty pagents.

[wufwugy]

France age of consent: 15. Banned beauty pageants

US age of consent: ~18. Adores beauty pageants

France is in line with reality. US confuses the sexuality of things, and maybe that's why it has so many sickos

[eugmac]

ya those beauty pageants are really creepy, i would be all for getting rid of them. the emotional damage done to the kids must be fairly noticeable.

[aubreymcfate]

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor...share_blogpost <-- article about why blurred lines is nbd

smart blog is smart. and this is coming from someone who, most of the time, fucking hates when feminist issues are dismissed as overreactions by the masses. even so, it feels like many feminists have lost the capacity for critical thinking... case in point this blurred lines controversy. (i mean yeah i'll have a convo about whether it's misogynistic or not - i don't think it is but the convo is legit - but rape anthem? plz)

and i know im late on this but w/e humor me


beauty pageants are fine when you're old enough to know that you enjoy the hyper-feminine things in life and like to celebrate them. but for children that's pretty twisted. especially since in an ideal world maybe there's some way it could be a light, good-natured event, but considering the way society actually is, these children are totally abused in the process.

[boost]

re: femist's overreaction to blurred lines. Yeah, I just think it's a knee jerk reaction from some respected members of the community, and then it's a domino effect when respect manages to turn off people's capacity for critical thinking. The problem is, not only does this delegitimize legitimate past, present, and future gripes, but it also emboldens the actual rape culture. If the masses are like "lol, this song is totally not what you're saying it is!" and keep rocking out to it, the actual rape culture-- their ideas about sexual relations, sexuality, etc are going to be propped up since everything has to be a dichotomy.

[wufwugy]

^^ yep

in other misogynistic news, it's hilarious how upset breaking bad watchers get when their misogyny is pointed out

[d0zer]

if there's an official GoT thread with spoilers why isn't there a breaking bad thread? I mean we're pretty much too late now, but srs can u believe that last episode? FAN <- SHIT

[wufwugy]

goat show is goat

wire and bwe are second and third, but bb takes the cake due to its steadily rising plot

[boost]

^^ yep

in other misogynistic news, it's hilarious how upset breaking bad watchers get when their misogyny is pointed out

I think you're off here. VG is off here, and Anna Gunn is most certainly off here with her poorly conceived, supported, and executed op-ed on the issue. There was very good reason for Psqquilar hate. Some of it was overboard, and some of it was due to misogynists hating all female characters. However, calling everyone who disliked the personality represented by the character a misogynist is lolaughable. If there was widespread hatred for Omar, I'd agree with charges of homophobia, because despite the character's flaws, he is very charismatic, has an endearing side, stands by his code of ethics, and is very easy to root for. You absolutely cannot say the same for how Sky-Whore is written.

goat show is goat

wire and bwe are second and third, but bb takes the cake due to its steadily rising plot

You're just caught up in the excitement of the moment. BrBa is for sure top tier, and maybe in hind sight we can say it has unseated the wire, but I honestly doubt it. And lol@ not including GoT in that listing. You craycray.

[wufwugy]

Al Capone is such a great speaker. And makes even better points

http://www.ted.com/talks/jackson_kat...n_s_issue.html

[wufwugy]

I think you're off here. VG is off here, and Anna Gunn is most certainly off here with her poorly conceived, supported, and executed op-ed on the issue. There was very good reason for Psqquilar hate. Some of it was overboard, and some of it was due to misogynists hating all female characters. However, calling everyone who disliked the personality represented by the character a misogynist is lolaughable. If there was widespread hatred for Omar, I'd agree with charges of homophobia, because despite the character's flaws, he is very charismatic, has an endearing side, stands by his code of ethics, and is very easy to root for. You absolutely cannot say the same for how Sky-Whore is written.

I haven't been that blown away by the misogyny of some who watch Breaking Bad because an inherent trait of misogyny is not seeing it when it arises. That aside, the amount of hatred Skyler has gotten is unreal. Virtually nothing she has done is different than the kinds of things Jesse has done, yet her character is treated with disdain where Jesse is praised. All the characters have reasonable behavior within the scope of the show and real life, but the amount of hate Skyler gets for her behavior seems tenfold that of every other character combined.

When Jesse questions Walt, he's got a good point; when Skyler questions Walt, she's just a bitch getting in the way. When Walt does what he thinks is best for his family regardless of the problems he creates, he's a troubled soul or no attention is paid to his decision in the first place; when Skyler does what she thinks is best for her family, she's ridiculed, unless, of course, she goes along with her husband. Walt and Jesse are mass murderers, and everybody still calls them Walt and Jesse. Skyler cheats on her aloof husband and she's called Psychler, Schizler, Sizzler, and Sky-Whore. But she was called those things before that anyways. She is called those things because a bunch of male viewers don't like women stepping out of line and messing up a good action thriller. And this fact is the last thing those male viewers wanna acknowledge. God help us if Lydia wasn't hot and berated characters for doing things that kept us from seeing all that masculine awesomeness

If it matters, as I watched the series, my thoughts on Skyler were that I don't like her that much personally, but everything she did was understandable. I felt the same exact way about Pinkman. But then I go on 2p2 and see nothing but hate for Skyler and love for Jesse. That's what misogyny looks like. Makes sense for a website that has banned me several times for posting spoilers even though I had no foreknowledge of events. I guess they were just so used to vapid opinions that when something accurate came along, it must have been mischievous instead. Forgive my mini 2p2 rant. I add it because it irked me to see those idiots pat themselves on the back for catching the "obvious troll" that was me. Some critical thinking would do them good; perhaps even save them from their overt misogyny and subsequent denial of it

You're just caught up in the excitement of the moment. BrBa is for sure top tier, and maybe in hind sight we can say it has unseated the wire, but I honestly doubt it. And lol@ not including GoT in that listing. You craycray.

Well, GoT is not as well done as those three. The competition for top spots is so vigorous that the doldrums in the middle of GoT S3 is enough to argue against it. Wire is another level, we all know that. Breaking Bad beats the pants off everything else with regards to plot, and it has almost no other flaws. Boardwalk Empire is somewhere behind BB in the plot department, but ahead of everything else, and every other aspect is top tier as well.

GoT might be #4 even though it's still my personal favorite. Well that and Firefly. Most say Sopranos is a contender for top spot, but that notion should be put to rest. It's great, but not at the top. Wouldn't it be funny (ironic) if the reason so many think Sopranos is at the top is because its one of the best shows with a male-centric view of things. Regardless, the short of it is that it has too many myopically dimensioned characters and is too repetitious to compete with the top 5

[jyms]

I would be surprised to find that those that think Sopranos is top have even watched the others. I'm thinking BB over the wire myself but the ending episodes can make or break this whole series as far as #1 or #4 goes. GoT I can't comment on, becasue I won't start that show until BB is over. BWE is something I actually haven't figured out when to watch either

[aubreymcfate]

does anyone watch eastbound and down? I just started it from the beginning after loling my ass off at a random ep earlier this year.

[jackvance]

Man when does GoT start again? It was seriously the only TV series I could get really passionate about in the last few years.

[Galapogos]

I would be surprised to find that those that think Sopranos is top have even watched the others. I'm thinking BB over the wire myself but the ending episodes can make or break this whole series as far as #1 or #4 goes. GoT I can't comment on, becasue I won't start that show until BB is over. BWE is something I actually haven't figured out when to watch either

I haven't watched the Wire but have watched BB and Sopranos. For me, Sopranos is still #1 and BB is #2. And I'm not saying Sopranos is my favorite by a mile, but it's a clear victory in my book. I find the character of Tony Soprano way more interesting than WW. I also find in BB that too often people's rational in the show annoy the hell out of me. And not in the way where I wish they would think what I want them to think so I'm mad. It just seems like they're given a certain rationale to justify the show's direction and they don't come by it naturally enough.

That being said, when all this is over I'll have to give Sopranos a rewatch because I might be idealizing it since it's been maybe 4 years since I watched it all.

[aubreymcfate]

i'm currently on season 5 of the sopranos, first time watching it. i think it's difficult to compare them because bb is one tight story, one trajectory, one path. sopranos.. i mean yes there is an overarching storyline, but the point of watching it is not simply to see how the plot unfolds - it's not super riveting in that aspect (i mean sometimes it is, but on the whole it's not) - but to immerse yourself into the life of these mobsters, particularly tony's, and experience that blend of the relatable and the horrifying.

sopranos is more like real life in that all this random shit is thrown at tony (and in effect, the viewer), and everyone's just sort of plodding along through life and drama naturally ensues. BB, on the other hand, is a very deliberate progression of events. sopranos is not as immediately riveting, but it has more leeway to take its time with character studies.

edit: also just quick note on the skyler stuff - serious A+ to everything wugy said. and no, a critique of her character does not automatically mean misogyny. that's ridiculous. my best friend who is a feminist and blessed with the graces of critical thinking dislikes skyler as well, but for real reasons, not the bullshit ones that wugy tore apart.


maybe this contradicts everything i just said (not really though, this is obv in jest), i lol'ed so hard at the end. comment section is a nightmare though.

[NightGizmo]

No love for "Six Feet Under"? IMO it's way better than Sopranos. Sopranos meandered too much, it felt too unfocused to me.

[aubreymcfate]

^^ i know wug likes it. and my aforementioned best friend loves it. it's on my list of things to watch, for sure.

[eugmac]

tv show thread is down the hall.

[wufwugy]

ur mom is down the hall

[d0zer]

does anyone watch eastbound and down? I just started it from the beginning after loling my ass off at a random ep earlier this year.

Yeah I like eb&d even though the first season was the best. Still, Kenny fuckin powers.

Also 6' under was fantastic.

[d0zer]

tv show thread is down the hall.

This isn't the way this thread works. You can't complain about the content of the random thread, you have to create the randomness you think you want.

[rong]

Has anyone watched twin peaks? It still rated really high on imdb in spite of being super old. I remember people watching it when I was a little kid and it was quite a big deal then. I've toyed with the idea of watching it but I keep finding other things that bump it down the list. Watching Band of Brothers now, only 2 episodes in but it's fantastic stuff.

[wufwugy]

Has anyone watched twin peaks? It still rated really high on imdb in spite of being super old. I remember people watching it when I was a little kid and it was quite a big deal then. I've toyed with the idea of watching it but I keep finding other things that bump it down the list. Watching Band of Brothers now, only 2 episodes in but it's fantastic stuff.

BoB is amazing. Pretty sure Twin Peaks is the only top tier show (non-anime) I've not watched. I'm positive it's really good, but my haterade is in such a way that I'll have to be in a certain mood to watch it, and I just haven't been for a while, so keep putting it off. Put Mad Men off for similar reasons for like two years, but finally got around to it

[rong]

I've been the same with mad men, BWE and GoT. I watched the first episodes of each of them but just couldn't get interested in any of them. I'm sure they're good, but I think I tried each of them after watching something else great, like after finishing The Wire and Sopranos, and at that point very little could keep my attention.

One thing I kinda miss is heroes. I really liked that show for a while, for some reason I stopped watching it, can't remember why, no idea how it ended or if it even got to an end. I'd watch it again but I can't remember enough of it to start in the middle and can't be bothered to rewatch a couple of series as it wasn't that good.

[aubreymcfate]

I've been the same with mad men, BWE and GoT. I watched the first episodes of each of them but just couldn't get interested in any of them. I'm sure they're good, but I think I tried each of them after watching something else great, like after finishing The Wire and Sopranos, and at that point very little could keep my attention.

One thing I kinda miss is heroes. I really liked that show for a while, for some reason I stopped watching it, can't remember why, no idea how it ended or if it even got to an end. I'd watch it again but I can't remember enough of it to start in the middle and can't be bothered to rewatch a couple of series as it wasn't that good.

i think you're doing yourself a disservice by watching the first episode of something and deciding you're not interested, especially shows like got and bwe. think of them as novels. they're long, intricate stories. you need to get acquainted with the characters and premise and it shouldn't be rushed. i'm not sure what the standard numbers of eps you should watch to give a show a chance should be (unless it's like, inexcusably bad from the get go). maybe five?

GoT especially is a huge story. setting the foundation for it is essential.

obviously if you watch something and NOTHING grabs you at all, it's completely bland, overtly offensive to your aesthetic sensibilities, etc. that's different... i'm not really sure where to draw the line i guess, so this is kind of an open-ended comment on my part.

wufwugy i invite you to share the opinions i know you have on this

[rong]

With so much to do in this life, I'm not gonna try to like a TV show. Another time in another mood I may give each another go, but I need to be in the right mood for a show, I can't just watch it because it's good, if that makes any sense at all.

[rong]

Actually, that's a lie. I had to try and like the wire. And I'm sure glad I made the effort.

[aubreymcfate]

i had to with Mad Men too and i'm so glad i did.

[bikes]

Actually, that's a lie. I had to try and like the wire. And I'm sure glad I made the effort.

MAKE THE DAMN EFFORT WITH EVERYTHING SUGGESTED

[Savy]

Actually, that's a lie. I had to try and like the wire. And I'm sure glad I made the effort.

I'm still yet to make that effort, seen the first couple of episodes a few times now and have just never been interested enough to carry on.

[bikes]

stuff tl:dr

science bitch

[boost]

I haven't been that blown away by the misogyny of some who watch Breaking Bad because an inherent trait of misogyny is not seeing it when it arises. That aside, the amount of hatred Skyler has gotten is unreal. Virtually nothing she has done is different than the kinds of things Jesse has done, yet her character is treated with disdain where Jesse is praised. All the characters have reasonable behavior within the scope of the show and real life, but the amount of hate Skyler gets for her behavior seems tenfold that of every other character combined.

Dude, you're just talking now. Seriously. Nothing she has done is different than Jesse? Seriously? I just don't even know what to say to shit like this. You're delusional if you think this passes for anything more than a laughable glob of words.

Maybe she gets all this hate because she is the only character with this much screen time who is pretty hard to find likeable. She is not the protagonist, yet she was the controlling, domineering, passive aggressive wife of the protagonist. We are not fucking examining a real life situation, we are looking at a story. It is not the same thing.

When Jesse questions Walt, he's got a good point; when Skyler questions Walt, she's just a bitch getting in the way. When Walt does what he thinks is best for his family regardless of the problems he creates, he's a troubled soul or no attention is paid to his decision in the first place; when Skyler does what she thinks is best for her family, she's ridiculed, unless, of course, she goes along with her husband. Walt and Jesse are mass murderers, and everybody still calls them Walt and Jesse. Skyler cheats on her aloof husband and she's called Psychler, Schizler, Sizzler, and Sky-Whore. But she was called those things before that anyways. She is called those things because a bunch of male viewers don't like women stepping out of line and messing up a good action thriller. And this fact is the last thing those male viewers wanna acknowledge. God help us if Lydia wasn't hot and berated characters for doing things that kept us from seeing all that masculine awesomeness

When Jesse questions Walt, it always leads to comedy, awesomeness, or comedic awesomeness. This is a story, and we are allowed to be results oriented with peoples actions. Jesse is a sympathetic character, a funny one at that. Can you really say the same for the way Skylar was written? Especially in the early seasons? We got all sorts of backstory for Jesse and character development that showed he was troubled, but deep down he was a good person. Skylar gets none of that, yet you blame the audience for their uneven reaction to the characters. Get the fuck outta here.

And yeah, I called her Sky-Whore. It's a joke that I thought was obvious. Look at any other good TV show thread on 2p2. We are generally hearing these names and not seeing them. So when it comes time to actually type nonstandard names, people take liberties. I'm not even sure how you are using any of them aside from "Sky-Whore" to substantiate your illconceived point. Wait, wait, now that I look back you included "Psychler" which I'm almost sure was never used anywhere, ever. Please cite your sources. Pretty sure you just made that up. Even if you didn't make it up, I can list dozens of alternate spellings which had no hidden meaning. The joke, one used across OOTV, is to purposefully misspell unusual names that you've only heard in dialogue. It's a joke, and the joke has no roots in misogyny.

If it matters, as I watched the series, my thoughts on Skyler were that I don't like her that much personally, but everything she did was understandable. I felt the same exact way about Pinkman. But then I go on 2p2 and see nothing but hate for Skyler and love for Jesse. That's what misogyny looks like. Makes sense for a website that has banned me several times for posting spoilers even though I had no foreknowledge of events. I guess they were just so used to vapid opinions that when something accurate came along, it must have been mischievous instead. Forgive my mini 2p2 rant. I add it because it irked me to see those idiots pat themselves on the back for catching the "obvious troll" that was me. Some critical thinking would do them good; perhaps even save them from their overt misogyny and subsequent denial of it

That's all well and great that you felt the same about the two characters. Fact is, not many other people agree. As I said before, Jesse drops major comic relief bombs on the show. Skylar has dropped, um, idk, none? Your banning.. well, ok, so what? You just sound like a bitter reject now. I was accused and questioned in PM, which when combined with the deletion of my post made it obvious what I had gotten right. *shrug*, there's no perfect way to mod that thread. But again, not sure how this relates to anything, especially since the Skylar hate did not originate on 2p2 and is not limited to it.

Well, GoT is not as well done as those three. The competition for top spots is so vigorous that the doldrums in the middle of GoT S3 is enough to argue against it. Wire is another level, we all know that. Breaking Bad beats the pants off everything else with regards to plot, and it has almost no other flaws. Boardwalk Empire is somewhere behind BB in the plot department, but ahead of everything else, and every other aspect is top tier as well.

I disagree completely. But I am heavily biased towards period pieces, or anything that has a high escapist value. I like being taken to other times and different worlds by my entertainment. GoT and BWE succeed at this in ways I never thought were possible for a TV show. On top of that, the acting, plot, music, etc is all on point. As for s03 of GoT, I can sorta see your point, but even then, this is really the first half of the story arc. I'm not sure it makes sense to judge it apart from s04.

GoT might be #4 even though it's still my personal favorite. Well that and Firefly. Most say Sopranos is a contender for top spot, but that notion should be put to rest. It's great, but not at the top. Wouldn't it be funny (ironic) if the reason so many think Sopranos is at the top is because its one of the best shows with a male-centric view of things. Regardless, the short of it is that it has too many myopically dimensioned characters and is too repetitious to compete with the top 5

Firefly is amazing, but lol@tossing it in with these. It's just too light to be considered. It's pretty much the peak of the episodic, Star Trek Next Generation type of shows, but it can't hang with the heavily serialized dramas of today.

does anyone watch eastbound and down? I just started it from the beginning after loling my ass off at a random ep earlier this year.

Eastbound is slept on. I agree with dozer that s01 was the best, but Mexico was phenomenal as well, and Danny McBride is too good at bringing the funny. Can't wait for the final season.

[boost]

allllllllllllllllll that being said about Sky-Whore, I'm glad she is in the show. Every character doesn't have to be immediately likable. She plays a roll in the show that has made it better. The show wouldn't be what it is if it weren't for her. Her character plays a central roll in establishing who Walter White is. I hate her(Skylar, not Anna Gunn, ldo) as a person, but value her role as a character.

[wufwugy]

wufwugy i invite you to share the opinions i know you have on this

Unless the show's elements are noticeably poor, the entire first season must be watched before judging it. All the best serial shows start slow. Wire is sort of an exception, and that's a testament to how superbly written it is.

When a show excites right out of the gate, its story structure and character arcs suffer. Those shows hit peak early and from there fluctuate. Sopranos is a decent example of this. People say it got too repetitive and went too long for a reason. We never learned much more about Tony as it progressed because we learned everything we needed in the first couple seasons. A lot of its side characters came and went, sometimes without the best reason. Furio is a good example of this. He is an awesome character, but Sopranos dropped the ball big time with him.

Just about every great show since Sopranos popularized serial television has a longer arc, one that uses the plot triangle over the course of the entire series. By design, this means their early episodes and early seasons should be less gripping. Instead of climaxing early, they lay the exposition and run steady rising action. Breaking Bad is beyond every other show in this regard due to its ability to carryover the climaxes of previous seasons and making it a part of the rising action of the subsequent ones. BWE is next in line, where the rising action and climaxes of each season gets better, but the carryover is still less. GoT had an amazing first season in this regard, but wasn't able to keep pace due to opening the story up too much. However, it could still utilize those dynamics for future seasons to make epic build ups and climaxes.

Carnivale is the best example of this. The first ten episodes are pretty boring. When you're watching it, you're thinking about how you don't understand why this is even a show. But then by the end of the season, it gives you a little bit of what the show is really about, and you realize that all the boring exposition was integral to creating the incredible characters, setting, and plot of the story. Sadly, viewers aren't prepared to acknowledge this necessary quality of amazing stories, so Carnivale didn't get the ratings, and was cancelled premature, just as it was getting fucking amazing. Had it gone the full 5 seasons instead of 2, it would be goat hands down

I'd say an early turnaround for a show is 5 episodes. I liked Wire after 3 episodes, which is super fast for me. I accredit that to Wire's exceptional cool dynamic. It became interesting before the characters or plot even began developing because of how cool the dynamics were.

Orange is the New Black has the opportunity to break this mold. It is entertaining from the very beginning; however, I think it is clear the writers will need to make some really hard decisions about character development in order to maintain it for longer than 3 or 4 seasons. If they recycle, it won't work


I find it's important to make a distinction between what is good and what I like, and I think it would work for others. Sometimes what is good and what I like are the same thing, but often they're not. I didn't like BWE for the first 1.5 seasons, but I could tell it was good, so I stuck it out, and now have found what about it I like. One of the biggest reasons why crappy shows and movies exist is because people rate them based on what they like, not what's good. Michael Bay gets work because he taps into what people like superficially. It doesn't matter if his work is any good, people watch it because they like it. Then they want more similar stuff, so Hollywood pumps out a whole bunch of crap that is easily likable. They pump it out so profusely that quality ends up suffering everywhere. Then we all notice this reduction in quality and don't want it anymore, but we were the ones who created the problem in the first place by only rating things based on our feelings instead of an objective view of the elements. If only audiences stopped paying attention to what they like and instead give what is good its due.

2008 Rambo is a great example of what movies would be like if we gave "good" its due. It's very well done yet also has every aspect of that sweet action shoot em up likeability many of us want. If we stopped watching shoot em ups just because they're shoot em ups, we'd find that a whole lot better shoot em ups are made. Instead of it being 5 years since the last great action film, we'd get them on the regular. At least that's my theory. I need something to warm me at night when nobody watches my 08 Rambo recommendation because it's called "Rambo" and they subconsciously expect it to be of supbar quality. It's not, it's incredibly well done

[wufwugy]

With so much to do in this life, I'm not gonna try to like a TV show. Another time in another mood I may give each another go, but I need to be in the right mood for a show, I can't just watch it because it's good, if that makes any sense at all.

I'm the same way. I make sure I don't watch something unless I'm willing to put in enough time to truly judge it

[aubreymcfate]

Danny McBride is too good at bringing the funny.

he really fucking is. i thought he was one of the few genuinely funny parts of "this is the end."

[MadMojoMonkey]

Orange is the New Black: Most gratuitous use of boobies in a non-sexual (or at least non-arousing to me) context ever.

[boost]

MAKE THE DAMN EFFORT WITH EVERYTHING SUGGESTED

Says the man who has yet to watch The Wire.

science bitch

Ha, I almost went with exactly this.. I kinda wish I had..

he really fucking is. i thought he was one of the few genuinely funny parts of "this is the end."

Yeah, I just watched that, and he killed it. There were some funny moments, but mostly slap stick stuff-- Craig Robinson was really good too I think, I like that guy.

[wufwugy]

Dude, you're just talking now. Seriously. Nothing she has done is different than Jesse? Seriously? I just don't even know what to say to shit like this. You're delusional if you think this passes for anything more than a laughable glob of words.

Maybe she gets all this hate because she is the only character with this much screen time who is pretty hard to find likeable. She is not the protagonist, yet she was the controlling, domineering, passive aggressive wife of the protagonist. We are not fucking examining a real life situation, we are looking at a story. It is not the same thing.



When Jesse questions Walt, it always leads to comedy, awesomeness, or comedic awesomeness. This is a story, and we are allowed to be results oriented with peoples actions. Jesse is a sympathetic character, a funny one at that. Can you really say the same for the way Skylar was written? Especially in the early seasons? We got all sorts of backstory for Jesse and character development that showed he was troubled, but deep down he was a good person. Skylar gets none of that, yet you blame the audience for their uneven reaction to the characters. Get the fuck outta here.

And yeah, I called her Sky-Whore. It's a joke that I thought was obvious. Look at any other good TV show thread on 2p2. We are generally hearing these names and not seeing them. So when it comes time to actually type nonstandard names, people take liberties. I'm not even sure how you are using any of them aside from "Sky-Whore" to substantiate your illconceived point. Wait, wait, now that I look back you included "Psychler" which I'm almost sure was never used anywhere, ever. Please cite your sources. Pretty sure you just made that up. Even if you didn't make it up, I can list dozens of alternate spellings which had no hidden meaning. The joke, one used across OOTV, is to purposefully misspell unusual names that you've only heard in dialogue. It's a joke, and the joke has no roots in misogyny.

I don't have much more to say on the issue. The video Aubrey posted sums it up. Most of the distaste for Skyler is for legit reasons, but not all of it, and it has an over the top-ness about it exactly like in that video. Walt and Jesse are treated with respect, Skyler is not. Walt and Jesse do something bad and it's understandable, Skyler does something bad and she's a bitch.

That's all well and great that you felt the same about the two characters. Fact is, not many other people agree. As I said before, Jesse drops major comic relief bombs on the show. Skylar has dropped, um, idk, none? Your banning.. well, ok, so what? You just sound like a bitter reject now. I was accused and questioned in PM, which when combined with the deletion of my post made it obvious what I had gotten right. *shrug*, there's no perfect way to mod that thread. But again, not sure how this relates to anything, especially since the Skylar hate did not originate on 2p2 and is not limited to it.

I referenced 2p2 because I'm talking to you, and you're active there with many opinions from there.

And yes, I am butthurt. Most of them are a bunch of fucking idiots. They're not the worst bunch of numbskulls, but certainly trying. I think it's okay for me to be upset about people being idiots. I don't act like I'm not

I disagree completely. But I am heavily biased towards period pieces, or anything that has a high escapist value. I like being taken to other times and different worlds by my entertainment. GoT and BWE succeed at this in ways I never thought were possible for a TV show. On top of that, the acting, plot, music, etc is all on point. As for s03 of GoT, I can sorta see your point, but even then, this is really the first half of the story arc. I'm not sure it makes sense to judge it apart from s04.

I'm making a distinction between what is good and what I like. On my like list of current shows, GoT is numero uno. But when the elements are evaluated, it falls behind a few others shows. It isn't as well done as some others, but that doesn't mean that it isn't as enjoyable. It's the most enjoyable IMO

Firefly is amazing, but lol@tossing it in with these. It's just too light to be considered. It's pretty much the peak of the episodic, Star Trek Next Generation type of shows, but it can't hang with the heavily serialized dramas of today.

I wasn't using FF as an example. It's my personal favorite for personal reasons, not objective reasons.

[boost]

Skyler gets praise when she does bad things! She gets hate when she opposes what people signed up to watch. We know there will be killing, drug dealing, etc. We signed up for that. The best moments for all the characters are when they break bad. When she sends the goons to force Ted's silence, people loved it, when she went herself to intimidate him while he sat in a neck brace, people loved it.

You're going to get lumped in as a fem'tard when you make an issue out of a nonissue like this. Are there misogynist that hate on Skylar? Yes, she is a woman, and there are misogynist. I'm not saying that misogyny isn't a problem, with both audiences and writers-- but you're trying to make a martyr out of the wrong person (character) here.

re: subjective vs objective-- my bad, you even made it a point to say you recognize the two as being different.

[wufwugy]

Skyler gets praise when she does bad things! She gets hate when she opposes what people signed up to watch. We know there will be killing, drug dealing, etc. We signed up for that. The best moments for all the characters are when they break bad. When she sends the goons to force Ted's silence, people loved it, when she went herself to intimidate him while he sat in a neck brace, people loved it.

That doesn't counter my point. When the male characters do things the audience doesn't like, they're not treated with such vitriol as is the typical response to the females. Skyler is just a better example of this than some others. Everything you said applies to Hank. He's trying to stop all the bad stuff that best way he knows how, and nobody has an unkind thing to say about him. But the moment Skyler tries to protect herself or her family from bad stuff, she's ridiculed. People say it's because of "how" she does it, but that's nonsense. Male characters and characters partaking in masculine responses to things get away with the same sort of behavior all the time, but beware whenever a woman does it in a feminine way. She's just getting in the way

Even the fact that the label "Skywhore" is thought of in the first place shows the underlying problem. Tony Soprano cheated on his wife constantly, but was never called Tony Slutprano. Of all the nicknames men get, they're not nearly as derogatory as the ones the women get, and the women don't even have to "earn" those nicknames in the first place. This isn't any different than the underlying homophobia demonstrated when we call things we dislike "gay" and related terms. I'm super guilty of it, as is most everybody, but that doesn't mean the problem isn't there.

You're going to get lumped in as a fem'tard when you make an issue out of a nonissue like this. Are there misogynist that hate on Skylar? Yes, she is a woman, and there are misogynist. I'm not saying that misogyny isn't a problem, with both audiences and writers-- but you're trying to make a martyr out of the wrong person (character) here.

Good. I have lost all respect for the ignorant opinions of those who would do so. Misogyny is one of the biggest problems in the US*, but the last people who recognize it are those who commit it. That includes many women. It's kinda hilarious that the creator of the show pointed out the misogyny, yet the audience is so entrenched in their delusions that they rationalize it away.

I'm not making a martyr out of the wrong person. This happens constantly. Go find feminine roles in your favorite TV shows, and you'll find that if they ever get "out of line", they're vociferously disrespected by the fans. Related, many popular women characters are quite masculine or subtly rely on the masculine to save them, and a lot of the feminine ones are treated with kid gloves and never explored. It is getting better, but not there yet

[boost]

Hank is the protagonist of his own story.

Maybe you're just labeling abhorrent ways of going about things as being the "feminine way" of doing them. I see the way she acts as stereotypically feminine, not feminine.

Making a play on a woman's name that involves a female gender specific insult is proof of nothing. Especially when the joke is carried out ten times as many times without any insult at all. I mean, come on, it's the internet, people are more often than not simply trying to be inflammatory. That's not to excuse derogatory behavior, but let's put things in perspective.

I personally wasn't bothered by her cheating. It perfectly fit the arc of their relationship, and actually I was happy because it setup for some good conflict. Her being hypocritical and cooking the books for Ted on the other hand...

Misogyny is a big issue in this country, as is racism and homophobia. Let's not be alarmist about every perceived instance and actually try to deal with the problems. That is not to say we should let things slip by, but again, you're betting on the wrong pony.

VG pointed it out. Sure. Maybe because he actually thought so, or maybe because he was convinced it was the right thing to do, whether morally or financially. But you're making a shitty appeal to authority here, so not much more needs to be said about it.

Meh, I really take issue with your implication that women who don't wear pink frilly things are somehow sellouts. You're rigidly defining gender roles, while trying to champion gender equality. What are you even... The fact is, most top tier shows are shown predominantly from a male perspective, if you drift over to ones which are not, Sex in the City, The L Word, Girls, etc, I bet you find the opposite. I've only watched the opener, but take a look at the females who tease are rape, vs the creepy staff at the prison in Orange is the New Black. Both are in a position of power over our main character, both are being sexually inappropriate, yet the former are interesting and likable characters, yet the latter is a disgusting slimebag.

[aubreymcfate]

Meh, I really take issue with your implication that women who don't wear pink frilly things are somehow sellouts. You're rigidly defining gender roles, while trying to champion gender equality.

i really don't want to become a part of this debate but i have to step in and say that's not what he was doing... at all. and i'm surprised someone as smart as you twisted his words that way. non-traditional female characters like Arya are great, and we need characters like that, but we also shouldn't be slamming femininity, what people call "girly girl," in the process. that's what he was trying to say. he never once implied that there's anything inherently wrong with masculine female characters.

anyway, carry on...

[boost]

Fine.

Then I'll just retreat to the likelihood that writers are simply more well versed at writing masculine characters, whether they be female or not. VG probably was honestly shocked at the hate his female character was getting, but that doesn't mean it wasn't his fault for the way he wrote her. Then again, Jane was equally meddling, for lack of a better word, yet afaik she's pretty much universally loved.

idk, I just feel like wuf want's to Captain Save a Hoe, and is conveniently forgetting our introduction to the character and the way she acted for the first few seasons. Exactly what qualities does she have? Why are we supposed to like her? For the first half of the series she never tries to fix anything, she just uses passive aggressiveness to react in a spiteful way. Do I understand how a marriage could get to the point of birthday-handjobs-while-ebaying? Sure. But that doesn't remove that fact that for a long time she failed to directly add any wit, humor, excitement, etc to the show. Name another character like that, or give me examples to the contrary. Otherwise gtfo with your misogyny bs.

[boost]

Oh and aubrey, please feel free, from a woman's perspective, to explain to me Skylar's feminine ways of dealing with adversity. Because that's what wuf called it, and still, all I see are negative feminine stereotypes, spazzing out, reactionary, acting from spite, vindictive, etc. We really don't even see her being very motherly, imo.

[wufwugy]

Hank is the protagonist of his own story.

And Skyler is just an adjunct. All the women in BB are. Just like all the women in BWE, and Wire, and Sopranos. In BB, it's Walt vs Gus or Walt vs Hank or Walt vs Jesse; it's never Walt vs Skyler, she's just a bitch. Marie isn't a bitch because she sticks by Hank. Plus she's hot, and hot women can afford some room.

Marie tried having her own story like Hank has his own, but everybody hated that. Hers was similar but not as bad as Margaret Thompsons in BWE, which everybody hated. Note that I'm not blaming the audience for not liking these. They didn't fit, and I blame the writers, and part of that blame I put on how strong the subtlety of misogyny is. We hardly even know how to write plots centered around women, and when we try, they're often those awkward rabbit trails found in the Marie and Margaret lines

I make this point, like I do many, to show the subtext of the issue. Misogyny has a unique role in society in that it's really subtle and hard to recognize. Part of the problem is that "misogyny" is defined as "hatred of women". God, what a naive way to define it. If the dictionary defined "racism" as "hatred of other races", we'd be livid over how wrong and poorly calculating that definition is, but that's the current definition of "misogyny" because it's so ingrained that people aren't even aware when it happens.

Maybe you're just labeling abhorrent ways of going about things as being the "feminine way" of doing them. I see the way she acts as stereotypically feminine, not feminine.

I'm not an expert on what is feminine as opposed to masculine, but it's a very interesting area. I'd have to think about it before labeling Skyler a stereotype, though

Making a play on a woman's name that involves a female gender specific insult is proof of nothing. Especially when the joke is carried out ten times as many times without any insult at all. I mean, come on, it's the internet, people are more often than not simply trying to be inflammatory. That's not to excuse derogatory behavior, but let's put things in perspective.

My point there was mainly the subtext. Women get called "slut", men don't. Why? It happens a ton, so much so and in context which aren't even warranted. This is what modern society misogyny looks like. We call people things based on stereotypes without thinking about it. When we call women "sluts" but not men, we're retrenching those played out ideas held by those who endorsed more overt misogyny. It isn't just interesting to note that when women are sexually active they're called sluts but when men do it they're pimps, it's an example of misogyny

I personally wasn't bothered by her cheating. It perfectly fit the arc of their relationship, and actually I was happy because it setup for some good conflict. Her being hypocritical and cooking the books for Ted on the other hand...

Who's a bigger hypocrite than Walt? Who gets treated respectfully even when critiqued? Walt

Misogyny is a big issue in this country, as is racism and homophobia. Let's not be alarmist about every perceived instance and actually try to deal with the problems. That is not to say we should let things slip by, but again, you're betting on the wrong pony.

I'm betting on this pony because everything I've learned about misogyny points to it being far subtler than the other forms of bigotry. To put it in context, I'm writing an outline for a book right now, and the only female leads are ones who are sexy, get put in harms way by men, and need to be saved by men. Even as somebody who understands misogyny somewhat well, I'm most comfortable when sticking to the stereotypes that largely depend on it. Fun that.

VG pointed it out. Sure. Maybe because he actually thought so, or maybe because he was convinced it was the right thing to do, whether morally or financially. But you're making a shitty appeal to authority here, so not much more needs to be said about it.

I don't mean to get technical on you (maybe I do), but "appeal to authority" is when I use an authority as itself evidence. In this context, I'm using an authority as perspective.

The fact is, most top tier shows are shown predominantly from a male perspective,

They are. Which shows part of the underlying issue

if you drift over to ones which are not, Sex in the City, The L Word, Girls, etc, I bet you find the opposite. I've only watched the opener, but take a look at the females who tease are rape, vs the creepy staff at the prison in Orange is the New Black. Both are in a position of power over our main character, both are being sexually inappropriate, yet the former are interesting and likable characters, yet the latter is a disgusting slimebag.

Haven't seen the first two and can't stand Girls because it seems the writers crush character and story development at all costs in order to maintain its simplistic view. This is demonstrated repeatedly when the characters learn lessons in one episode but then didn't learn it by the next.

ONB has potential to be groundbreaking. I think in order for it to do so, it's gonna make a lot of people mad, but we'll see.

[wufwugy]

Captain Save a Hoe

I love this

Exactly what qualities does she have? Why are we supposed to like her?

None? She was never particularly likable, but that's beside the point. Whenever a male character isn't likeable, we tend to just acknowledge it. But when a female character isn't likable, God help us if we don't see how much everybody fucking hates her.

Oh and aubrey, please feel free, from a woman's perspective, to explain to me Skylar's feminine ways of dealing with adversity. Because that's what wuf called it, and still, all I see are negative feminine stereotypes, spazzing out, reactionary, acting from spite, vindictive, etc. We really don't even see her being very motherly, imo.

Is she hysterical? Does she need to see a doctor for her female problems?

Boost, you made a better point than I could have. Skyler wasn't ever "spazzing out" or "acting from spite" in ways different than the men. The notion that she was is precisely what BWE and Mad Men era overt misogyny used to endorse. Lord help us that a wife and mother is thrown in crisis by her criminal husband. Back in the day this was "hysteria"; now it's apparently "spazzing out"

[aubreymcfate]

Oh and aubrey, please feel free, from a woman's perspective, to explain to me Skylar's feminine ways of dealing with adversity. Because that's what wuf called it, and still, all I see are negative feminine stereotypes, spazzing out, reactionary, acting from spite, vindictive, etc. We really don't even see her being very motherly, imo.

I'll need a bit with is, especially since I'm heading out in a bit, but just one thing I'd like to point out... Why bother critiquing the fact that Skyler isn't "being very motherly"? Women are always more harshly criticized for their parenting than fathers, both in shows and IRL. If men prioritize anything above their children, well that's natural because obviously men are worldly creatures. But once a woman has kids, her entire value as a person or character is judged by that alone? That's not to say we should excuse any bad parenting from mothers or fathers, not at all, but the double standard is incredibly frustrating. People tend to be way more sympathetic to fathers.

I mean really, what about Walt? Walt is a horrible father. Skyler tried to save her kids from the situation by moving them to Hank and Marie's. How is she not being very motherly?

But really, that's besides the point. Who was the last male character on TV that you actively disliked because he wasn't being very fatherly?

case in point on the above: Don Draper. Can we all just imagine if Don Draper was a woman? I can see it now: Sex-obsessed narcissistic dirty slut who doesn't give a shit about her kids and would rather divorce her husband and marry that young boytoy and only see her kids on weekends. Way to shirk your responsibilities of parenting you self-obsessed whore. You got pregnant, take responsibility.

Wait, you're a dashing guy in a suit? Lets all talk about how charismatic and complicated you are and how cool it is that you drink like a fish at work.


I'm also super willing to concede that part of the issue is that men are just written better than women, for the most part. Misogyny is so hardwired into our brains, so obviously it affects both the audience and writers.

[wufwugy]

case in point on the above: Don Draper. Can we all just imagine if Don Draper was a woman? I can see it now: Sex-obsessed narcissistic dirty slut who doesn't give a shit about her kids and would rather divorce her husband and marry that young boytoy and only see her kids on weekends. Way to shirk your responsibilities of parenting you self-obsessed whore. You got pregnant, take responsibility.

Wait, you're a dashing guy in a suit? Lets all talk about how charismatic and complicated you are and how cool it is that you drink like a fish at work.

Bingo bango. Everybody all like "ooo he so mysterious and conflicted and sessy" and me all like "dude just a dickhead, yo"

[rpm]

Marie isn't a bitch

credibility gone.

[boost]

Re Captain Save a Hoe: I thought you would, I hoped you would, this conversation needed a bit of levity.

Spazzing out: You're twisting my words, although it didn't take much to do so. Walt spazzes out a bunch too, but he generally stumbles into some sort of leverage, a plan, or a solution of some kind or another. Again, we aren't discussing the actions of a real person, we are discussing our feelings towards a character and their roll in a piece of fiction. Because of her lack of solutions, her passive aggressiveness, etc, she isn't a fun character to root for or even sympathize with.

Margaret: I really like her, and I enjoyed her arcs. Maybe it wasn't an absolutely perfect fit with the show, and it veered a bit too far, but that's a hard call to make for a show with such an ambitious reach. I don't miss her like I miss Jimmy, but she was a solid part of the show. Sure maybe she "nagged" a bit, but she had her own drive and went out and got hers while still being quite feminine. I forget the exact line, but when she outwits the hospital administrator at the party, that was such an awesome fist pump moment. See, I've got a black friend!

Motherly: Ugh, aubrey, you took it in the wrong direction and ran with it. I never said I didn't dislike her because she wasn't motherly, I asking what qualities she had that are likable. I don't think she's a bad mother, or that Walt is a better parent, I was just saying that we haven't really even been shown a very motherly side of her.

Anyways, I just think the screams of "Skylar misogynist!!!" are mostly unwarranted, and even when they aren't, it's such a tiny issue compared to misogyny on the writers' side. You guys both seem to acknowledge that the poor writing of female characters (something that is thankfully being remedied) is a big player in all this. I think we really don't disagree on the issue of misogyny enough to continue to dedicate this many words to such an insignificant sticking point. It is pervasive, it is subtle, and it is often overlooked. I just don't see it here.

So let's don our capes, and go Captain Save a Hoe elsewhere.

[aubreymcfate]

So basically all you're saying is you think she's a poorly written character. Which contradicts one of your earlier posts about how you're glad she's in the show and is necessary or some shit. (maybe I'm wrong about this though - correct me if I am obv, I'm getting ready and don't have the time)

I think you're smart and I don't think you would hate a character for insubstantial misogynistic reasons, but you have to admit, a lot of Skyler hate IS for those reasons. And that was the issue at hand in the first place. I even said, posts ago, of course critique of Skyler isn't automatically sexist by virtue of it being a critique. Again, my best friend also dislikes her character, and she is a feminist.

[wufwugy]

Don't do it, Moe!



Sorry, I thought it was Save a Moe, not a Hoe

[boost]

I kinda skipped the Mad Men thing when aubrey wrote it (lol, cuz I oppress women... with my fist!), because I haven't watched the show yet, but skimmed the snippet in wuf's quote. I do think that there are some interesting double standards that apply exclusively to this issue. One of them is custody. Esp in the context of back then, but not much has changed now-- if a relationship ends and there are kids, the courts pretty much auto give custody to the woman. I don't hear much from the gender equality camp about this.

Also, the expectation of chivalry. Don't expect me to pay for you, don't expect me to hold a door because you're a woman, and don't expect me to put the seat down-- I was polite enough to pick it up and not piss on it, you can put it down if that's how you'd prefer it.

These issues are not a big deal in the scheme of gender equality, but the dishonestly of these expectations along with justified demands for equality can taint the latter in the eyes of those who aren't much for nuance and critical thinking.

[boost]

So basically all you're saying is you think she's a poorly written character. Which contradicts one of your earlier posts about how you're glad she's in the show and is necessary or some shit. (maybe I'm wrong about this though - correct me if I am obv, I'm getting ready and don't have the time)

I think you're smart and I don't think you would hate a character for insubstantial misogynistic reasons, but you have to admit, a lot of Skyler hate IS for those reasons. And that was the issue at hand in the first place. I even said, posts ago, of course critique of Skyler isn't automatically sexist by virtue of it being a critique. Again, my best friend also dislikes her character, and she is a feminist.

I think if their goal was a sympathetic and likable character, then, yes, she was poorly written. However I think her character as written is good for the story as a whole. I don't see the mutual exclusivity.

[aubreymcfate]

I kinda skipped the Mad Men thing when aubrey wrote it (lol, cuz I oppress women... with my fist!), because I haven't watched the show yet, but skimmed the snippet in wuf's quote. I do think that there are some interesting double standards that apply exclusively to this issue. One of them is custody. Esp in the context of back then, but not much has changed now-- if a relationship ends and there are kids, the courts pretty much auto give custody to the woman. I don't hear much from the gender equality camp about this.

Yes, this is a function of the pervasive idea that women are always the caretakers, always the ones with that responsibility. Sexism doesn't affect just women, men get the shit end of it too because of generalities like this. Feminists actually talk about these issues all the time, and absolutely do acknowledge how misogyny affects men. It's funny how those voices seem to be drowned out for some reason - or maybe you guys just aren't paying close enough attention? I don't know.

As to the expectation of chivalry - yeah, I agree with you there. Some people like a certain gender dynamic in their personal lives though. But yeah, if a woman is a self-identified feminist but then just expects things (like being paid for) as though they are givens, instead of establishing a certain context for the relationship with their partner through communication, then that is obviously hypocritical and ridiculous.

but man w/e, I think I might just switch to the Kenny Powers philosophy of life. critical thinking is for loozers. damn this show is good.

[boost]

yeah, for sure, I know that dialogue is happening, but I feel like more often than not doesn't reach the mainstream gender discussion. I really don't mean to respond to criticism of myself (or my gender) by returning criticism. I think it's important to express your grievances, but at the same time always responding with "well, yeah, but you do this isn't particularly constructive, especially coming from the dominant side. I am curious though what you think about these double standards. Clearly they are there, and I think these double standards are more pervasive and damaging than say "reverse racism" (which is poorly termed, since "racism" by a dominated group is something other than racism), but I'm completely open to that being my male bias.

As for people wishing to carry on with certain gender roles in their personal lives-- totally, I am all about that, but it's a delicate line. People quickly start to push their ideas of what a man should be onto others, ready to openly espouse how a man is somehow less of a man if he's not paying for dinner, or even.. idk.. more subtle stuff. Idk, I'm rambling now...

Random sorta related aside: It's crazy how complicated this stuff is, and it really can leave a person who wants to improve gender relations at a loss as to how to proceed. I was recently bouncing around through some articles and blogs and found this meme (an idea that has legs, not a silly cat picture with words) about how the idea of the "strong black woman" is really damaging and hurtful to black women.

[bikes]

[jackvance]

The netherlands has the hottest girls, confirmed!

Average women faces of different countries:

[bode]

they left USA#1 off, so i guess netherlands can be 2nd best.

Ukraine a strong contender though

[aubreymcfate]

ok OBVIOUSLY mediterraneans and middle easterners are superior, lets all just relax with our aryan fetishez pls

actually Argentina is the most intriguing to me. non-conventional elegance... sexy

[d0zer]

Would pee in all the butts.

[jackvance]

lets all just relax with our aryan fetishez pls

Isn't it normal to like what you see the most? I had a family gathering from my father's side for my parents' 40th marriage anniversary last saturday. Almost everyone came, think 100+ people including tons of kids (me and my sister and a rare cousin or niece here or there were the only ones without kids wtf).

I handled the IT side and bartending, and at one point i was looking around the room and I remembered the things we talked about on FTR or something and i looked around and thought "wow I really have a family filled with aryans lol". Almost all blue eyes and blonde to brown hair. Lateron i went around doing pleasantries and I'd say about the kids with really light blue eyes "beautiful eyes she has!" Then i go to one little cousin and i looked at her eyes and they were brown. I say "oh wow no blue eyes" and the mother says "haha yeah she is special".

A lot of people have telling me about their heritage lately. Including this friendly stranger a few weeks ago in a bar who decided to spend more than half an hour to out of the blue tell me his entire McLeod+Adriaansen+whatever else was which made him related to jesus lineage.. until I finally managed to sneak away.

But yeah I'm pretty interested in my heritage lately. Any efforts to dig out where my roots lie from my father and mother's side have all been straight where most of my family is still living now in Belgium! So eh I descend from the gauls or something? I'm curious.

I know my brother has plans to have the DNA checked of his 2 daughters because his gf has cancer risks which her mother is now dying from it. I told her about 123andme.com which a spanish friend of mine used to have his whole family's DNA checked and he said the results were really elaborate. I'm gonna send my stuff in there too with the next $200 i make in poker.

[aubreymcfate]

Isn't it normal to like what you see the most? I had a family gathering from my father's side for my parents' 40th marriage anniversary last saturday. Almost everyone came, think 100+ people including tons of kids (me and my sister and a rare cousin or niece here or there were the only ones without kids wtf).

I handled the IT side and bartending, and at one point i was looking around the room and I remembered the things we talked about on FTR or something and i looked around and thought "wow I really have a family filled with aryans lol". Almost all blue eyes and blonde to brown hair. Lateron i went around doing pleasantries and I'd say about the kids with really light blue eyes "beautiful eyes she has!" Then i go to one little cousin and i looked at her eyes and they were brown. I say "oh wow no blue eyes" and the mother says "haha yeah she is special".

A lot of people have telling me about their heritage lately. Including this friendly stranger a few weeks ago in a bar who decided to spend more than half an hour to out of the blue tell me his entire McLeod+Adriaansen+whatever else was which made him related to jesus lineage.. until I finally managed to sneak away.

But yeah I'm pretty interested in my heritage lately. Any efforts to dig out where my roots lie from my father and mother's side have all been straight where most of my family is still living now in Belgium! So eh I descend from the gauls or something? I'm curious.

I know my brother has plans to have the DNA checked of his 2 daughters because his gf has cancer risks which her mother is now dying from it. I told her about 123andme.com which a spanish friend of mine used to have his whole family's DNA checked and he said the results were really elaborate. I'm gonna send my stuff in there too with the next $200 i make in poker.

oh it's totally normal lol. i'm just playing.

i think it's equally normal to like something that's essentially opposite from you. for the longest time i liked the nordic types with blonde hair and green eyes... absolutely nothing to do with my first true love, nothing at all >_> but still, the aryan look does appeal to me.

and yet when i find myself falling for one of my own grecian kind, that has its own narcissistic thrill as well.

i'm also super interested in my heritage. i did the ancestrydna shit, which was cool, but 123andme definitely seems like it yields more interesting and detailed results, so I think i will definitely be doing that as well.

ancestrydna did tell me that i am 56% eastern european, 24% middle eastern, 15% persian/turkish/caucasus, and 5% unknown, so that's cool. only piques my interest for specifics further though.

[jackvance]

It will take about 2 months if you request the kit now and send it and before it is processed and you get the results. But you should totally share them if you get them! You can find strange things, this other friend of mine told me he had 2% indonesian in his genes (he looks perfectly "belgian"). I wonder what kinds of outlandish genes I might have. My eyes are some kind of grey-green-blue, no-one has been able to really put a color on it yet. The rest about me is pretty average joe from around the block I think.

[jackvance]

Oh it is 23andme.com without the 1.

And upon further inspection, I find the most "intruiging" look the israelian girl, it's like I know this polish girl, ukraine indeed strong contender and samoa gets trophy for worst looking, it's like a grandmother face.

[aubreymcfate]

strangely enough the greek doesn't look like the signature greek woman to me.



now that's a greek lady mug. greeks are super varied in appearance though (some greeks are super white, some look straight up not white at all, like Rafi from The League), so i guess it's a hard thing to pin down.

the israeli girl is definitely hot. lebanon is also really striking.

[MadMojoMonkey]

Is that stuff really legit? I remember a few years ago, there was a similar (maybe the same?) company that was doing DNA based genealogy, but they were looking at like a tiny, tiny fraction of your DNA and making a statistical generalization.

I heard about it when a group of people who had long-documented family histories went and got tested and the results were all over the place.

I'm no biologist. I do not know how much information is actually encoded in DNA, or how much variation there is over different human communities.

I'm just skeptical of this process. I mean, if you don't know any of that stuff, then they can pretty much tell you anything, right?
Snake Oil.


*Am I wrong for holding the spelling of geneAlogy against it? The suffix -ology means "the study of" so what the hell kind of ruse is genealogy trying to pull?