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*** OFFICIAL BREXIT SUNLIT UPLANDS and #MEGA THREAD ***

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  1. #2701
    We are desperately in need of political reform in the UK. You would have to be a special kind of stupid to not have realised that in the past few months.
  2. #2702
    Quote Originally Posted by The Bean Counter View Post
    We are desperately in need of political reform in the UK. You would have to be a special kind of stupid to not have realised that in the past few months.
    Not sure what kind of reform that should be though. Other countries have parliamentary democracies and seem to function pretty well. Maybe replace FPTP with PR? Or, is it just a matter of not electing so many shitheads?
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  3. #2703
    And the lettuce has won.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  4. #2704
    Vinland's Avatar
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    I've never sat down to look into how your parliament works compared to Canada, but you seem to go through more PM's than we ever could. And our parties for the most part stick to their PM's in power bc there is almost zero infighting bc they just agree with the party line no matter how fucking stupid a decision is.
    And if you are an MP who strays from the party line on a vote you get your pee pee slapped
  5. #2705
    Vinland's Avatar
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    LOL she lasted six weeks.
    Bring on the next one.....
  6. #2706
    It's gonna be Boris isn't it?
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  7. #2707
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    It's gonna be Boris isn't it?
    My money is on Mourdant. Either her or an avocado.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  8. #2708
    Quote Originally Posted by Vinland View Post
    I've never sat down to look into how your parliament works compared to Canada, but you seem to go through more PM's than we ever could. And our parties for the most part stick to their PM's in power bc there is almost zero infighting bc they just agree with the party line no matter how fucking stupid a decision is.
    And if you are an MP who strays from the party line on a vote you get your pee pee slapped
    They're pretty much the same, I'm sure the Canadian one is modelled on the UK one at the very least.

    We've had a couple of short-term PMs (<1 year) in my lifetime in Canada, Joe Clarke and Kim Whatserface. But it's never been a revolving door like it is here now.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  9. #2709
    Vinland's Avatar
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    Kim Campbell. She took over for Mulroney when he stepped down, but he stepped down after what, 7 years? And she got it by default and then lost in the election, not bc she resigned. It just seems so strange that a party will have such vocal disagreements with the PM. I'm not used to that.
    The Conservatives had some infighting over the last ten years, but the most vocal ended up leaving and forming their own party.
  10. #2710
    Quote Originally Posted by Vinland View Post
    Kim Campbell. She took over for Mulroney when he stepped down, but he stepped down after what, 7 years? And she got it by default and then lost in the election, not bc she resigned.
    Oh yeah, Campbell. I guess I've never seen a Canadian PM resign except when they lose an election.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  11. #2711
    Tory party here is split between centrists, center-right, and loony far right. They really have no-one who can bridge that gap just because it's so wide. There's some fringe parties that are on the far left or right and they never win many seats.

    Labour went hard left with Corbyn and lost to a Tory party that was itself shit, twice. At least Labour has Starmer now who should soak up all the centrist voters who are sick of the Tories' ongoing shitshow.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  12. #2712
    Seems Boris is contemplating a comeback to run for the vacant PM job, with a number of Tory MPs already declaring support for him.

    I mean ok, I kinda get the idea that he doesn't seem so bad now that we've had a month or so of Truss body-slamming the economy, but still, come on. You just fucking got rid of the guy with most of his cabinet resigning. Don't try to give us this shit that he's actually really good and that was all just a big whoopsie. fml.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  13. #2713
    He's the only candidate with a real democratic mandate. Although you'd think we need an election regardless of who wins, May 2023 the latest.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  14. #2714
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    He's the only candidate with a real democratic mandate. Although you'd think we need an election regardless of who wins, May 2023 the latest.

    By that logic, he never should have been removed. So like I said, just a big whoopsie.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  15. #2715
    Damn, just realised I forgot to change my avatar to the new PM.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  16. #2716
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    If y'all mofos let BoJo back in, then y'all deserve what you get from that.
    SMH

    You can say the same if Trump gets reelected.
    You can find any pattern you want to any level of precision you want, if you're prepared to ignore enough data.
  17. #2717
    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    By that logic, he never should have been removed. So like I said, just a big whoopsie.
    He quit. People are allowed to quit their jobs.

    I would also agree with your obvious response that he quit his mandate and needs another one to effectively govern. But no other candidate has any kind of mandate. Sunak lost to Truss in a leadership contest, he doesn't even have the support of Tory voters.

    I don't give a fuck who gets the job. We need an election by May 2023 the latest. Whoever is the leader until then is merely keeping the seat warm.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  18. #2718
    If Boris becomes PM again, I'll be at the front of the rioting mob.
  19. #2719
    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    Not sure what kind of reform that should be though. Other countries have parliamentary democracies and seem to function pretty well. Maybe replace FPTP with PR? Or, is it just a matter of not electing so many shitheads?
    PR is one. Some other ideas for improvement (but not necessarily political reform as such):

    Removal of whips.

    Pay enough money to attract competent people to politics.

    Employ genuine experts in the cabinet and civil service to run government functions.

    Fund parties from the public purse, not trade unions and rich individuals and companies looking to gain an advantage

    Pursue criminal charges against misue of public funds, lying in the Commons and to the public.

    Edit: prevent somebody becoming PM with only 80k people backing them.
    Last edited by The Bean Counter; 10-22-2022 at 07:55 AM.
  20. #2720
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    He quit. People are allowed to quit their jobs.
    lol, that's a creative interpretation of the word "quit." He only quit after most of his cabinet resigned. Even then he was hiring more ministers as fast as he could. So he obviously was trying to hang on.


    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    We need an election by May 2023 the latest.
    I agree. The problem is there's nothing to say the Tories have to call one. They can go through as many leaders as they like.

    Also, it's not in their interest to call one soon, as they would get decimated. The best outcome for them now would be to put in someone halfway competent like Sunak or possibly Mordaunt, then try to stabilise things for two years, then call a GE. They'll still lose but not as badly.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  21. #2721
    I don't think they'll be able to resist the pressure for an election. There will be noise all winter. People could stomach May 2023 because May is traditionally when we go to the polls, and it gives the new leader reasonable time to prove he/she is up to the job. But if this lingers on for years, it will do more damage than good to the Tories.

    Let's assume the Tories actually want to win the next election. Their best chance is to quickly put someone in charge who is competent, call and election for May '23, and hope the new leader goes some way to fixing the damage done by Truss. Sound economic policies will result in a market bounce, and that will look really good for whoever is in charge. This could even be an elaborate plan to win a snap election. The paranoid fucker in me is always suspicious when politicians do stupid things. These people aren't stupid. They're assholes. So when they do what seems to be a stupid things, like testing your eyes by going on a long drive with your family, it kinda pings my radar. So tanking the markets so they can repair it and make a new leader look like an economic genius, that falls into the "plausible" category if not "likely".
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  22. #2722
    Looks like it's going to be Prime Minister Sunak.

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1584273945775464448

    I can't believe BJ got even one person to nominate him; those guys are so desperate it's not even funny.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  23. #2723
    And here I was thinking it'll be nice to have a normal person as PM.





    Seriously, wtaf? Did someone clone him and insert a chip in his head to make him talk like that?
    Last edited by Poopadoop; 10-24-2022 at 12:59 PM.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  24. #2724
    Went looking for a gif of that Simpson's episode where Smithers kidnaps Tom Jones and makes him appear before Marge with a gun in his back as what Sunak's speech seemed like, but found this instead.

    Serendipity ftw.

    Last edited by Poopadoop; 10-24-2022 at 01:12 PM.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  25. #2725
    Oh wait here it is.

    Edit: ffs, won't post.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSimpsons...ter_tom_jones/
    Last edited by Poopadoop; 10-24-2022 at 01:12 PM.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  26. #2726
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    And here I was thinking it'll be nice to have a normal person as PM.





    Seriously, wtaf? Did someone clone him and insert a chip in his head to make him talk like that?
    Ok, this is going to be lit!
    The strengh of a hero is defined by the weakness of his villains.
  27. #2727
    Quote Originally Posted by oskar View Post
    Ok, this is going to be lit!
    Can't wait for the video by the body language experts to try to decipher this one; it'll just be one hour of them scratching their heads.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  28. #2728
    The good news is that regardless of his robotic speech, there's no reason to think he's going to anything to crash the economy or piss off our allies. So there's that.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  29. #2729
    Perfectly normal. Everythings fine.

    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  30. #2730
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    Ahhh... Makes me wonder what wufwugy is up to.
    Prob like married with kids and a big-kid job by now.

    Hope he's doing well, whatever he's up to.
    You can find any pattern you want to any level of precision you want, if you're prepared to ignore enough data.
  31. #2731
    Vinland's Avatar
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    I remember that name. Wasn’t wufugy the forums’ socialist? Wanted to kill rich people (or tax them 99% can’t remember which one)?

    He had some interesting, but good arguments. Wasn’t sure he played poker seemed like he was always in here
  32. #2732
    Wuf was a hard-on capitalist. Presumably still is, idk. It's been a few years since he last said hi.

    I can't remember who wanted to tax rich fuckers 99%, wuf might have said it in jest but I can't imagine why any sensible person, even leftists, would ever think this is sound economic policy. 49% is as extreme as tax should ever get imo, the earner should be keeping the majority of every penny they earn, whether that be slinging burgers or performing brain surgery or hedge fund management. A society should be able to function with lower tax than that though. If we're having to tax rich fuckers half their salary, then something is wrong with the economic system, most likely corruption.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  33. #2733
    Quote Originally Posted by Vinland View Post
    I remember that name. Wasn’t wufugy the forums’ socialist? Wanted to kill rich people (or tax them 99% can’t remember which one)?

    He had some interesting, but good arguments. Wasn’t sure he played poker seemed like he was always in here
    Nope, he was a big Trump fan.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  34. #2734
    I think he backed away from Trump but at first yes he liked him.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  35. #2735
    MadMojoMonkey's Avatar
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    Wuf wouldn't have argued to tax anyone 99%. His position was that taxation is theft.

    He supported Trump at first, even into the first year of his presidency, but got fed up with him, eventually.
    Funny, one thing he once said about Dems firing at Trump is that it was like they were just throwing pickles at a window, hoping one would stick. That much hasn't changed, really.
    You can find any pattern you want to any level of precision you want, if you're prepared to ignore enough data.
  36. #2736
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I can't remember who wanted to tax rich fuckers 99%, wuf might have said it in jest but I can't imagine why any sensible person, even leftists, would ever think this is sound economic policy. 49% is as extreme as tax should ever get imo, the earner should be keeping the majority of every penny they earn, whether that be slinging burgers or performing brain surgery or hedge fund management. A society should be able to function with lower tax than that though. If we're having to tax rich fuckers half their salary, then something is wrong with the economic system, most likely corruption.
    The marginal tax rate on going from £100k to £125k is a minimum of 65% and at least 73% if you have one child in childcare. So anybody with half a brain earning £100k-£140k just puts everything over £100k into pension. Tax cap on pension is £40k per year.
  37. #2737
    The knives are already out for Fishi lol.

    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...21aafee13b25fc
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  38. #2738
    Hope you bitcoin guys are getting ready to sell, I have a feeling the market is about to crash.

    https://twitter.com/jemimajoanna/sta...06547948343296
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  39. #2739
    I'm not buying yet. I am waiting for an entry point but not yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  40. #2740
    Bazinga!

    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  41. #2741
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  42. #2742
    Starmer has been eating Sunak alive at PMQs. "Bring the lettuce back" lol.

    https://twitter.com/BestForBritain/s...22958484254727
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  43. #2743
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  44. #2744
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    The strengh of a hero is defined by the weakness of his villains.
  45. #2745
    ^ Goddamn Europeans with their lack of trade barriers and their schadenfreude!

    Thank God Rishi has seen the light...we don't need your goddamn frictionless trade - we have sovereignty!

    https://twitter.com/LBC/status/1594668858694144002
    Last edited by Poopadoop; 11-21-2022 at 12:52 PM.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  46. #2746
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  47. #2747
    lol the voice of reason on Twitter...

    I would never ask someone where they are from and if they tried to tell me I would cover my ears and start screaming.
    Basically an old lady who works at the Palace asked a black woman who was wearing traditional Barbadian attire where she is from. Naturally she's from England and this is such a fucking outrageous question to ask a British woman wearing "ask me about my culture" clothes that it's worthy of front page news and an apology followed by a resignation.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  48. #2748
    MadMojoMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    lol the voice of reason on Twitter...



    Basically an old lady who works at the Palace asked a black woman who was wearing traditional Barbadian attire where she is from. Naturally she's from England and this is such a fucking outrageous question to ask a British woman wearing "ask me about my culture" clothes that it's worthy of front page news and an apology followed by a resignation.
    I mean... the first time she asked, it was kosher.
    Then the woman replied: I was born here, I'm British.
    And the rich lady was all: no, seriously, where are you from?

    The first time was fine. The 2nd time was kinda fucked up.
    You can find any pattern you want to any level of precision you want, if you're prepared to ignore enough data.
  49. #2749
    Presumably that's paraphrased. I've seen no transcript of the conversation, only Ngozi Fulani's claims on Twitter. And Fulani is claiming that actual offending comment was "where do your people come from" which was asked "repeatedly", presumably twice in slightly different ways. This lady seems to me to be clumsily making small talk and attempting to take an interest in Fulani's culture, noting that she's not dressed in typical British attire and is apparently inviting interest in her culture.

    I mean this doesn't seem malicious to me at all, certainly not worthy of the reaction it's getting. This is completely bizarre and absurd.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  50. #2750
    My speculation of how the conversation likely went is along the lines of...

    "Where are you from?"
    "I'm from Britain."
    "Yes but where are your people from?"

    Given the context, that Fulani is wearing Barbadian attire at a party where there's lots and lots of small talk happening, and drinks flowing, this seems like non-malicious small talk and a complete non-story. The phrase "your people" is dated and clunky, but we're talking about an 83-y/o lady here who has probably never even used the internet, let alone is up to date with modern standards of language.

    People are far too easily offended. That for me is a bigger social problem than people being dicks.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  51. #2751
    I mean if Lady Oldface says "well you're clearly not British, where are you really from?" in a sneering tone then yes that's fucked up, but I don't believe this is what is happening at royal wine parties. Everyone there is trying to make a good impression so they get invited to future events. It's a very elite club that nobody wants to be kicked out of.

    No malicious intent whatsoever. People need to take a step back and ask if it's really worth making a scene over. If someone is being a dick, then fair enough, but that isn't clear here and it's hard to believe it was intentional.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  52. #2752
    The old lady probably didn't do it to be an ass, but her behaviour was still inappropriate and offensive.

    First, she reached out and moved the black woman's hair so she could see her nametag. In what universe do you go do that to someone you don't even know? Only in some colonial world of yore, not today's world.

    Then, she hectored her for a good five minutes about "where she was from, where are her people from etc.." That's such an ignorant line to use on a POC, obviously. She wasn't satisifed with the answer "I'm from Britain," and the implication of continuing is to ask is that she's an outsider. That's the kind of question this woman has probably been asked all her life - and it must get old. The point is, it's not appropriate to keep after her after she already answered the question. The old lady should have accepted that and moved on.

    In a vacuum it's not a crime against humanity to ask someone where they're from. But in the context of centuries of being treated like second-class citizens, it's pretty bad to make a whole issue out of it.
    Last edited by Poopadoop; 12-02-2022 at 12:08 PM.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  53. #2753
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post

    People are far too easily offended. That for me is a bigger social problem than people being dicks.
    The problem is that there are still people out there who think that behaviour is acceptable.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  54. #2754
    Also worth mentioning that white people making excuses for other white people's racist behaviour is pretty cringe.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  55. #2755
    First, she reached out and moved the black woman's hair so she could see her nametag.
    Haven't seen that footage but ok, dick move.

    In what universe do you go do that to someone you don't even know? Only in some colonial world of yore, not today's world.
    This leap in logic is not helpful. If she's this kind of person, do you think she's treating me with any more respect? That you assume colonial racism because she's working for the royals, that's no better than applying stereotypes to others.

    Then, she hectored her for a good five minutes about "where she was from, where are her people from etc.."
    How do you know this? Is there footage of this because I need to see it. Having a five minute conversation with someone who is not enjoying the conversation is tedious and obvious. Especially if the entire five minutes is the same question rephrased. This is not believable.

    She wasn't satisifed with the answer "I'm from Britain," and the implication of continuing is to ask is that she's an outsider.
    I'm giving the old lady the benefit of the doubt in assuming that Fulani attire is what inspired this line of questioning, not the perceived idea she's an "outsider". If I wear a red and white striped top, a beret and carry a baguette under my arm people might think I'm from France, and might be confused when I tell them I'm from Solihull.

    That's the kind of question this woman has probably been asked all her life - and it must get old.
    If she's been wearing Barbadian attire all her life while living in Britain, then it would not surprise me if she was regularly asked where she's from.

    The point is, it's not appropriate to keep after her after she already answered the question.
    I might be willing to agree with you here, but I really need to see the footage that you clearly have seen, that shows a five minute and one-way conversation.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  56. #2756
    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    Also worth mentioning that white people making excuses for other white people's racist behaviour is pretty cringe.
    My skin colour is literally irrelevant and you're racist for saying this. If I were black, you wouldn't have said this.

    Check your privilege.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  57. #2757
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    My skin colour is literally irrelevant and you're racist for saying this.
    LOL, nice try.



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    If I were black, you wouldn't have said this.
    It's only white people sticking up for her afaik.



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    Check your privilege.
    Which privelege is that?
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  58. #2758
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    This leap in logic is not helpful. If she's this kind of person, do you think she's treating me with any more respect? That you assume colonial racism because she's working for the royals, that's no better than applying stereotypes to others.
    It's not a leap to think an old white woman who's in with the royals think she's better than a black person, even if only unconsciusly, and feels entitled to touch her hair.



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I'm giving the old lady the benefit of the doubt in assuming that Fulani attire is what inspired this line of questioning, not the perceived idea she's an "outsider". If I wear a red and white striped top, a beret and carry a baguette under my arm people might think I'm from France, and might be confused when I tell them I'm from Solihull.
    I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt too. I don't think she set out to be an ass, I think she's just ignorant and has some unconscious racism. I doubt if you were wearing a beret she'd pester you for five minutes about what part of France you came from after you told her you're British. But who knows, maybe she's really that stupid.



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    If she's been wearing Barbadian attire all her life while living in Britain, then it would not surprise me if she was regularly asked where she's from.
    Makes sense if the old woman thinks Barbados is in Africa. She asked her "where in Africa are you from?"



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I might be willing to agree with you here, but I really need to see the footage that you clearly have seen, that shows a five minute and one-way conversation.

    All of what I reported is what the black woman herself said. If any of it is wrong, the old lady hasn't said anything to deny it. You'd think she'd be keen to correct the record if the black woman was hallucinating or otherwise making things up.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  59. #2759
    Quote Originally Posted by poop
    It's only white people sticking up for her afaik.
    This is an assumption that presumably is not backed up by any actual data.

    I just scanned through the top replies with the word "Fulani", and it didn't take long to find a black woman criticising her. I'll stop at one. Carry on looking if you want to find more black people who think Fulani is an opportunistic race baiter doing more damage than good to the black cause.

    https://twitter.com/KemiOwonibi/stat...60332225601536
    It turns out Ngozi Fulani (real name Marlrne Headley) is an impõster answering appropriating Nigerian name, tribal name, culture, and identity. Dressed to Buckingham Palace like someone just exiting a shrine, she accused an elderly lady who took interest in her heritage of rãcism
    It's not a leap to think an old white woman who's in with the royals think she's better than a black person, even if only unconsciusly, and feels entitled to touch her hair.
    Such people probably exist. What's wrong with this is instantly assuming that's the motivation of anyone accused of speaking clumsily or inappropriately. You're applying a stereotype. "Well you're a Royal hanger-on so that means you're probably a racist colonist."

    I don't think she set out to be an ass, I think she's just ignorant and has some unconscious racism.
    Ignorant perhaps. But if we agree she's not trying to be an ass, why are we hearing about it? Why is it major news? Someone non-maliciously accidentally offended a woman at a wine party for rich and influential cunts, and that's something we need to know about and discuss on social media?

    Makes sense if the old woman thinks Barbados is in Africa. She asked her "where in Africa are you from?"
    Literally the first I've heard of the word "Africa" being mentioned.

    All of what I reported is what the black woman herself said.
    And you just blindly believe everything she is saying while condemning the old lady as a racist colonist?

    I find it hard to believe such a conversation can happen for five minutes, like you claim. That's a long time to be asking the same question over and over while getting a negative response. It simply didn't happen for five minutes.

    You'd think she'd be keen to correct the record...
    She's an old lady and probably afraid of the backlash. Maybe she'll get to have her say in due course but I'd imagine this fuss is taking quite a toll on her. Of course people don't give a shit about that because she's a horrible racist white lady who dared to ask a British woman wearing not-British attire where she's from.

    Fucking chancer, this woman is. Race baiting chancer. She's loving all this attention while the old lady hides in her house, forced into retirement, scared to answer her phone. That's how I see it, and why I'm defending the white lady somewhat. If she was being malicious and completely oblivious to a five minute awkward conversation then I'll stop defending her. I'm not defending a racist. I'm defending an old lady asking a clumsy, non-malicious question that is asked at parties everywhere.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
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  60. #2760
    It's not just news. It's international news.

    Old white woman asks black woman at UK party where she's from.

    News in USA.

    Bizarre as fuck.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
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  61. #2761
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    Closest I could find to an actual video is 44 seconds long, and you can't hear the actual conversation between the 2 women.

    Upon further inspection, this does seem to be a bit of a wind-up on Fulani's part.

    Apparently she's the head of an African and Carribbean culture something something IDGAF. And introduced herself originally as such.
    So it's not just that she's dressed in foreign attire, it's that she introduced herself with a title that kinda maybe would indicate she's from somewhere else.

    Oldladyface def. shouldn't have asked "Where are you really from?" if that's the actual quote (I didn't hear her say it).
    But it's not like she persecuted the woman.
    You can find any pattern you want to any level of precision you want, if you're prepared to ignore enough data.
  62. #2762
    I'm glad you've taken a reasonable position mojo. Assuming "where are you really from" is an accurate quote, that's really clumsy but not worthy of all the attention it's getting. If it's "where are your people from", that's less clumsy but still not very modern. That seems more like what a royal hanger-on would say, too. The "your people" could be a colonial relic in the language of royal types. That's what I think poop means when he says "unconscious racism" - the cultural terminology used in certain circles. I don't think anyone unconsciously thinks they are superior to others... that's a conscious thought.

    The problem with this story being so huge is that people will now actually be afraid of asking people they meet where they're from, which is dreadful. 99% of the time when that question is asked, it is a sincere question being asked by someone interested in the person they are having a conversation with. Some people are proud of their culture and want to talk about it. Some people are glad when they're asked where they're from so they can enjoy some small talk about their home.

    How do you navigate this minefield in 2022?
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
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  63. #2763
    Quote Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey View Post
    Closest I could find to an actual video is 44 seconds long, and you can't hear the actual conversation between the 2 women.
    That's Fulani talking to Camilla, the Queen Consort or whatever her title is. Not the old lady whatserface, a different old lady.



    Quote Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey View Post
    Upon further inspection, this does seem to be a bit of a wind-up on Fulani's part.
    She tweeted her side of the conversation, that's it. Then some people wanted to interview her, so she went.






    Quote Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey View Post
    Apparently she's the head of an African and Carribbean culture something something IDGAF. And introduced herself originally as such.
    She founded a domestic abuse charity that caters to African and Caribbean women. She introduced herself as being from it.

    I mean, fair enough, we haven't heard the other side of the story. But, the royal family apologised to Falani, as did Lady SH, and she resigned. So there's that.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  64. #2764
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    That's Fulani talking to Camilla, the Queen Consort or whatever her title is. Not the old lady whatserface, a different old lady.
    Oops. My bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    She tweeted her side of the conversation, that's it. Then some people wanted to interview her, so she went.
    LadySH: Where are you from?
    Fulani: I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

    No scandal. Just 2 people cooperating in a conversation. LadySH could have been more PC with the questions, but Fulani was being standoff-ish with the answers, regardless.

    Quote Originally Posted by Poopadoop View Post
    She founded a domestic abuse charity that caters to African and Caribbean women. She introduced herself as being from it.

    I mean, fair enough, we haven't heard the other side of the story. But, the royal family apologised to Falani, as did Lady SH, and she resigned. So there's that.
    So there's what?
    A rich family covering up any questions that might lead to uncovering that there was an actual story there? That the line of questioning was indicative of a greater sentiment? That LadySH was in the wrong?
    What?

    There's no indication of any conclusion above others. Just a hush-up.
    Oh that lady that brought attention to us? We fired her. Please stop paying attention to us.
    You can find any pattern you want to any level of precision you want, if you're prepared to ignore enough data.
  65. #2765
    Quote Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey View Post
    LadySH: Where are you from?
    Fulani: I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.
    Why does she have to explain her heritage and descent? She's obviously African lol.

    Lady TinEar should have taken her first answer as an indication she didn't want to go into her descent. It's irrelevant.

    I mean fine, let's assume Lady TE is just a curious person with an interest in ethnography. If she's also sensitive to others feelings though, it might occur to her that her line of questioning is annoying the other person and she should let it go, not keep badgering her, then patronising her when she finally gets the answer she wants.



    Quote Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey View Post
    LadySH could have been more PC with the questions, but Fulani was being standoff-ish with the answers, regardless.
    Because shes' been asked it a bunch of times by racists and her guard is up.




    Quote Originally Posted by MadMojoMonkey View Post
    So there's what?
    A rich family covering up any questions that might lead to uncovering that there was an actual story there? That the line of questioning was indicative of a greater sentiment? That LadySH was in the wrong?
    What?

    There's no indication of any conclusion above others. Just a hush-up.
    Oh that lady that brought attention to us? We fired her. Please stop paying attention to us.
    "Please stop pointing out the racist behaviour of our staff" lol.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  66. #2766
    Quote Originally Posted by poop
    Why does she have to explain her heritage and descent? She's obviously African lol.
    I mean, assuming where someone is from is an order of magnitude more offensive than asking someone where they're from.

    Because shes' been asked it a bunch of times by racists and her guard is up.
    lol every person who asks where she's from is a racist.

    Fuck me poop you're so desperate for racism to exist that when someone says "wacism" you're licking the dirt off their boots.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
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  67. #2767
    Where does that transcript originate from btw? Is this fact checked?
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  68. #2768
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I mean, assuming where someone is from is an order of magnitude more offensive than asking someone where they're from.
    Huh? Do you struggle to see this woman is of African descent?



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    lol every person who asks where she's from is a racist.
    Reductio ad bananum.

    Enough people who ask that question are doing it to make a point about race that it becomes a sore spot.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    Fuck me poop you're so desperate for racism to exist that when someone says "wacism" you're licking the dirt off their boots.
    It's more like you're so desperate for it not to exist that you'll look for any excuse to justify what is at best, highly insensitive, and at worst, racist.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  69. #2769
    Quote Originally Posted by poop
    Huh? Do you struggle to see this woman is of African descent?
    I privately assume she is of African descent but I don't know if she is African, Afro-Caribbean, I don't know what culture her attire belongs to, and if I were interested in her while making small talk these are question I might ask.

    Of course I'm socially aware enough to know if the conversation is riveting or awkward, so these questions I'd ask once. If that convo you posted is accurate then that to me is obviously awkward and should also be obvious to an experienced royal hanger-on who presumably has attended many of these events and met many people of all cultures during her time. But if it's Fulani's account of the conversation then huge pinch of salt required.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  70. #2770
    you'll look for any excuse to justify what is at best, highly insensitive
    I have to assume you're taking as fact that presentation of the conversation.

    From my pov, where that convo is not necessarily factually accurate, "at best" this woman asked a normal question that is asked at parties everywhere and Fulani has taken offence. At best neither party have malicious intent and this is a huge misunderstanding taken way out of context. That's the "at best". I don't think that's likely though. I think Fulani is milking this. You think the old lady is an areshole. Neither of us are looking at this from an "at best" pov.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  71. #2771
    I mean "at best" Fulani has snapped and unloaded years of pent up aggression against an old lady who asked her the wrong question at the wrong time. The straw that broke the camel's back. I could understand that from Fulani's pov.

    But if that were me in Fulani's shoes, I'd quickly recognise I'd overreacted and would seek to play down the incident and would want to have a private clear-the-air talk with the old lady. I'd know it's not fair to hold one person to account for the cumulative actions of many people over many years. I'd know it's even less fair on an elderly lady. That would keep me awake at night, assuming that I'm not a nasty piece of work happy to ruin other peoples' lives to boost my own profile.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  72. #2772
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I mean "at best" Fulani has snapped and unloaded years of pent up aggression against an old lady who asked her the wrong question at the wrong time. The straw that broke the camel's back. I could understand that from Fulani's pov.
    She's not being aggressive about it at all, she's just expressed disappointment that this kind of thing can happen at a royal event.



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    But if that were me in Fulani's shoes,
    You'll never understand what it's like to be in her shoes mate. I think that's part of the reason so many white people think she's being unreasonable or an attention whore or was asking for it by wearing African clothes and letting her hair cover her name badge or whatever other ridiculous excuses people are coming up with.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I'd quickly recognise I'd overreacted
    She posted the convo on twitter with a tone of disappointment. Not sure how that's an overreaction.

    https://twitter.com/Sistah_Space/sta...54380115767296




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    and would seek to play down the incident
    I mean ok she didn't have to make it public, fair enough. But if it was offensive enough to her that she did, that should count for something. It's not like this Fulani woman has a history of whipping out the race card (afaik) every time someone looks at her sideways.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    and would want to have a private clear-the-air talk with the old lady.
    Indeed, I would think Lady TE would be keen to straighten things out with her, if she really felt she'd been misunderstood. Haven't heard that that's happened though. Maybe it has.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I'd know it's not fair to hold one person to account for the cumulative actions of many people over many years.
    Where is she doing that?




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I'd know it's even less fair on an elderly lady.
    Won't someone think of the old people...I mean we can all feel sympathy for her, and obviously the palace is to blame for having someone working there who didn't know how to behave.



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    That would keep me awake at night, assuming that I'm not a nasty piece of work happy to ruin other peoples' lives to boost my own profile.
    lol, like she planned the whole thing.

    Fulani: "Imma gonna make up some shit an old lady working at the palace said to me, and get me some TV time. Yeehaw!"
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  73. #2773
    Quote Originally Posted by poop
    She's not being aggressive about it at all, she's just expressed disappointment that this kind of thing can happen at a royal event.
    Not being aggressive? Well she didn't slap her, but she's moaning on twitter and going on talk shows to say she has been abused. That's aggressive in my book.

    You'll never understand what it's like to be in her shoes mate.
    No I won't, because I'm not a professional victim exploiting my skin colour for sympathy and profile. I'm a normal person who tries to give people the benefit of the doubt rather than assuming everyone is out to insult me. And if someone does insult me I'll tell them to fuck off and find someone else to talk to, rather than continue the conversation for five minutes and then complain. So no how silly of me to think I can put myself in Fulani's shoes.

    Being asked where you're from is not a form of abuse. She is not a victim, at least not here, not unless there's actual evidence that this old lady was being malicious or at the very least completely oblivious to the offence she was obviously causing. So you saying "you can't know how she feels" is yet more unconscious racism directed at me for being white. Like white people are incapable of empathy when it comes to being annoyed by other peoples' lack of social awareness. Utter nonsense.

    She posted the convo on twitter with a tone of disappointment. Not sure how that's an overreaction.
    She's talking about it on talk shows for fuck's sake. It's not like her one single tweet went viral and she's trying to calm things down.

    It's not like this Fulani woman has a history of whipping out the race card (afaik) every time someone looks at her sideways.
    And nobody is suggesting Lady Oldface has a history of racism. So something is amiss, right?

    Where is she doing that?
    She is arguing she has experienced abuse. That's a very strong word to throw at someone who asked where you're from.

    If we assume that Fulani regularly gets asked this question and this is the final straw, then she's unloading years of frustration on one old lady. That's not fair.

    Won't someone think of the old people...
    Yeah think about old people who can die of stress. Imagine highlighting this for mockery.

    lol, like she planned the whole thing.
    At the very least this seems highly opportunistic. I don't believe she planned it, but I do think she carped those diems.
    Last edited by OngBonga; 12-03-2022 at 11:52 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
    ongies gonna ong
  74. #2774
    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I'm not a professional victim exploiting my skin colour for sympathy and profile.
    Unless something affects you directly, it's not a problem. Got it.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    I'm a normal person who tries to give people the benefit of the doubt rather than assuming everyone is out to insult me.
    She gave her the benefit of the doubt, until about the third or fourth time she pressed the issue. Seemed pretty patient and even-tempered to me.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    And if someone does insult me I'll tell them to fuck off and find someone else to talk to, rather than continue the conversation for five minutes and then complain.
    You can't have it both ways. Either you give someone the benefit of the doubt and assume they're not insulting you, or you decide they are insulting you and tell them off. You can't even decide which yourself, yet you're mad at this woman for not living up to your standards of behaviour.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    Being asked where you're from is not a form of abuse.
    Depends on the undertone of the conversation. A lot of POC say that when someone asks them that, it feels like they're doing it to put them in their place.

    Also, we were taught in sensitivity training not to ask students that at all. Seems our uni is ahead of the Palace on that one.





    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    So you saying "you can't know how she feels" is yet more unconscious racism directed at me for being white.
    Dunno, sounds an awful lot like your playing the victim card based on your race here to me. I thought that was something you never did.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    Like white people are incapable of empathy when it comes to being annoyed by other peoples' lack of social awareness. Utter nonsense.
    Who said it was only white people? It's not even every white person. But it's some of them.



    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    She's talking about it on talk shows for fuck's sake. It's not like her one single tweet went viral and she's trying to calm things down.
    She said she wanted to raise awareness of the problem that racism is still present at the highest levels in the UK.




    Quote Originally Posted by OngBonga View Post
    Yeah think about old people who can die of stress. Imagine highlighting this for mockery.
    Lol.
    I just think we should suspend judgment on Boris until we have all the facts through an inquiry, police investigation, and parliamentary commission.
    also,
    I'd like to be called Lord Poopy His Most Gloriously Excellent.
  75. #2775
    Quote Originally Posted by poop
    She gave her the benefit of the doubt, until about the third or fourth time she pressed the issue.
    So you're doubling down on Fulani's tweet being accurate? Ok, but that is not evidence a court would accept. What reason do you have to give Fulani the benefit of the doubt? What reason do you have to not give the old lady the benefit of the doubt?

    You can't have it both ways. Either you give someone the benefit of the doubt and assume they're not insulting you, or you decide they are insulting you and tell them off. You can't even decide which yourself, yet you're mad at this woman for not living up to your standards of behaviour.
    I'm not sure how you get here.

    My point is that if I felt insulted by a guest at a party, I'd find someone else to talk to and forget about the other person. This wouldn't be something I'd go running to the press about. Not unless I was seeking to boost my profile, anyway. A bit of race baiting will do that, as we can see by discussing a faux pas like it's international news.

    Depends on the undertone of the conversation. A lot of POC say that when someone asks them that, it feels like they're doing it to put them in their place.
    That's not the fault of the person making normal enquiries. If I ask you what your name is and you take offence, is that my fault? Should I have checked if asking your name will offend you before enquiring? What if asking you if it will offend you will offend you? Small talk is complicated.

    Also, we were taught in sensitivity training not to ask students that at all. Seems our uni is ahead of the Palace on that one.
    Oh well in this case hang the bitch. How dare she not have attended sensitivity training. She deserves everything she's getting.

    Dunno, sounds an awful lot like your playing the victim card based on your race here to me. I thought that was something you never did.
    I don't really feel racially abused, I'm half trolling and half attempting to point out that you're holding white people to a different standard to black people, which is the exact opposite of equality. But I don't really believe you're being unconsciously racist, I'm just stealing your phrase there for the sake of argument.

    She said she wanted to raise awareness of the problem that racism is still present at the highest levels in the UK.
    So she's choosing a normal question asked at parties and presenting it as racist abuse? This is doing more harm than good for such causes.
    Quote Originally Posted by wufwugy View Post
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