***Official 2011 NFL Thread***

[lolzzz_321]

something about the chiefs beating minnesota

[baudib]

!

team could easily be 4-0 or 0-4, not really sure what to think. Pretty optimistic about Dalton long term. AJ green also seems awesome.

regardless, it is nice to have some comfort for the wounds OSU inflicts each Saturday

Somehow I've always felt that the promise of a young team was more fun than when you actually expect to do something. But I suppose that goes with the territory with a team (Eagles) who have been supremely talented and good to very good for 30 years without winning it all.

I've been in your spot though; the brief moments where Bobby Hoying or even Ty Detmer looked like a real player were a lot more exciting than the veteran competence of Rodney Peete or Jeff Garcia leading you to 10-6. I like Dalton a lot actually.

This is a really weird season.

[Lukie]

they just cost themselves andrew luck?

[Lukie]

Somehow I've always felt that the promise of a young team was more fun than when you actually expect to do something. But I suppose that goes with the territory with a team (Eagles) who have been supremely talented and good to very good for 30 years without winning it all.

I've been in your spot though; the brief moments where Bobby Hoying or even Ty Detmer looked like a real player were a lot more exciting than the veteran competence of Rodney Peete or Jeff Garcia leading you to 10-6. I like Dalton a lot actually.

talking about the andy reid era, it seems like every qb they plug in back there plays well.. mcnabb, aj feely, koy detmer (being generous here), jeff garcia, kolb, vick

maybe a few others

[baudib]

The only guy who was bad was the kid from Rutgers.

Andy Reid is the big, hulking lineman who always wanted to be a finesse skill player. There's no doubt he knows how to develop QBs.

[Jack Sawyer]

I want to see suh and fairley together on the front line

That's all i want

[bikes]

I want to see suh and fairley together on the front line

That's all i want

I look forward to the never ending flags from this combo.

[Roid_Rage]

I look forward to the never ending flags from this combo.

Essentially this, but its going to be entertaining watching how many QBs leave the game because of massive hits. Totally worth the total domination that will result the 2nd time the we meet up with the Bears this year. Mebbe in the first!!

[Roid_Rage]

Barry Sanders Highlights - YouTube

[bikes]

no moar al davis tho

[Hawk]

My most (only) fond memory of Al Davis was the time my wife asked me "Who is that old lady they keep showing?" when watching a raiders/hawks game.

[bikes]

WHAT CHOOO KNOW ABOUT DEM FOOTSISSYS

[Lukie]

RIP Al Davis

here's a point I have been making in regards to the importance of having a franchise QB. here's a list of the last 8 AFC champion QBs:

Brady
Big Ben
Manning

in light of recent news we can say that the last 10 AFC champions have been:

Patriots
Raiders baby
Steelers
Colts

[baudib]

The Eagles' meltdown is pretty awesome. It's very reminiscent of 1994, when they started out 7-2, including beating the eventual Super Bowl champion 49ers 40-8 on the road, then proceeding to lose their last 7 games.

Three times this season, a wide receiver has coughed up the ball on a late drive to tie or go ahead. In today's game, the Bills line up on fourth-and-1 with 1:23 left, everyone in the stadium knows they're just trying to draw the Eagles offsides. Juqua Parker, an 11-year veteran, obliged. He later said the hard count threw him because he thought they were going to run a play. This shows such a mind-boggling lack of situational awareness that most of the blame simply has to be placed on the coaching staff.

Midseason firings are rare in the NFL, and when it comes to a guy who has 13 years tenure, you expect that the guy will be allowed to leave on his own terms. But there's really no excuse for this nonsense week after week in a year the front office declared they were "all-in."

[Lukie]

Aaron rodgers's escapability and ability to throw on the run are amazing.

[Roid_Rage]

I hope Green Bay's plane crashes on their flight home to Wisconsin.

[bigred]

I hope Green Bay's plane crashes on their flight home to Wisconsin.

Can't wait for you to lose tomorrow night

[Hawk]

Woooo Seahawks!!

Hell of a win today, and we blew several BIG opportunities early in the game. That could easily have been a blow out.

We just might not be as bad as we looked early on.

FUCK 'SUCK FOR LUCK'!

[lolzzz_321]

i am a huge matt cassel hater, and by hater i mean i say what i see, but he made some real good throws today

[Roid_Rage]

Can't wait for you to lose tomorrow night

Unlikely, since I'll be there. And since Jesus loves me, he won't dare let my Lions lose.

[WildBobAA]

I wouldn't be shocked if the Bears win tonight. Lions should be 2-2 right now. Both teams seem to be fairly inconsistent. If the Bears give the ball to Forte 25 times like they did last week then they will probably will win. But if Martz goes all Martz and throws it 50 times then the Lions will probably win. Also, wishing for a teams plane to crash, even jokingly is pretty bad.

[WildBobAA]

Also, Mario Williams might be out for the season, sorry Lee

[bigred]

Unlikely, since I'll be there. And since Jesus loves me, he won't dare let my Lions lose.

Well I didn't know you and Jebus would be in attendance!!

[kingnat]

SUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

[WildBobAA]

wow that was the worst first quarter of NFL football I have ever seen

Calvin Johnson is such a beast

[Lukie]

to borrow a word from tom heckert about buster skrine

jahvid best is 'fast fast'

[ensign_lee]

Also, Mario Williams might be out for the season, sorry Lee

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

First Andre and now Mario?

[WildBobAA]

The Lions are pretty good when they show up for the first half (LOL 1st quarter)

[bikes]

Maclin snipes at reporter, can’t figure out reason for turnovers - Shutdown Corner - NFL Blog - Yahoo! Sports

haven't lol'ed this hard reading a sports column in a long time

[Roid_Rage]

Totally worth the sore throat and hoarse voice today. Every TD Detroit scored came right at the end zone I was sitting in.

SOOOO LOUD IN THEREERERERERERERERE!!!! Broke the attendance record for the stadium including SuperBowl. So sick.

[baudib]

Do you actually say "so sick" in real life to non-poker players?

[Roid_Rage]

Can't remember. Wasn't a whole lot of time for talking, what with the Lions beasting and the roar of the crowd every play.

[bikes]

I get berated for using poker terminology and I live in a fucking grind house =(

[bigred]

I get berated for using poker terminology and I live in a fucking grind house =(

sick beat

[baudib]

BTW, the Reggie White/Jerome Brown Football Life program was excellent. They anchored easily the greatest defensive line I've ever seen. I would put Reggie and Jerome on my all-time NFL defensive line, along with Joe Greene and Bruce Smith. I've yet to see another DT that really reminds me of Brown; Suh will probably be as good/better but no one else is really comparable, maybe the other Miami DTs -- Warren Sapp and Cortez Kennedy -- but they weren't nearly as active as Brown.

The injury to Randall in 1991 and the death of Jerome really altered the NFL landscape. Before Brown's death neither Aikman nor Emmitt ever had a big game against the Eagles; Smith snapped the Eagles' 4-year long streak of not allowing a 100-yard rusher and the Cowboys went on to glory that year.

It was a fascinating team of incredible talent and remarkable levels of underachievement.

Also, Sara White's memory of how Reggie left Philadelphia doesn't really jive with my memory, but Norman Braman was a lying scumbag so it's hard to figure out who to believe.

[Roid_Rage]

Lions were just all around bad today. Only bright spot was defense at times, but even they were pretty weak vs the run today.

Stafford had bags under his eyes and looked like a total chump.

Not super pissed, but really disappointed in how they executed. Come back next week hungry, please.

[Lukie]

another sunday, another great and entertaining day of NFL football



and the browns still suck

[bikes]

TOM BRADY

[baudib]

Eagles still look like ass, thank god for Rex Grossman.

[Lukie]

"Minnesota, FUCK YOU" haha I love Schwartz

Also this:

Jim Schwartz - LEARN THE F*****G RULES! - YouTube

lol

just don't act like that when you beat the lions

[baudib]

Will the Lions start resting players now that the undefeated dream season is over?

[WildBobAA]

Meh, I'm not too worried about the Lions, mainly because I think (thought this before today) that they are going to finish 10-6. Their schedule gets really tough in the 2nd half.

[Roid_Rage]

Yea, don't get me wrong, I was kind of upset that they lost, but it had to happen sometime. And I'm pretty secure in the fact that I know they can win games now so I don't rage like the fkn Hulk when they blow a game.

[fulksy]

Eagles still look like ass, thank god for Rex Grossman.

god he is so terrible, i wanted to break my tv watching yesterday.

[baudib]

yeah, he threw so many picks at our safeties it guarantees we won't have to see Jarrod Page's dumb ass for a while.

[Lukie]

early in game, 3rd and INCHES at opponent's 40, the correct combination of plays is not pass + punt

actually, the pass is fine, but certainly not if you're going to punt if it's incomplete

on 4th and inches, get behind your freaking center who you thought highly enough to draft in the 1st round and sneak it hyachachach

[baudib]

yeah i've complained about kicks on fourth-and-short all over this thread.

[baudib]

I thought Al Davis was the guy fucking up the Raiders. Two first-round picks for Palmer?????

[fulksy]

yeah, he threw so many picks at our safeties it guarantees we won't have to see Jarrod Page's dumb ass for a while.

uhg it was hard to watch.

[Hawk]

I thought Al Davis was the guy fucking up the Raiders. Two first-round picks for Palmer?????

This is completely insane. I had kind of hoped the Hawks would have picked him up in the offseason, but wouldn't have paid more than a 3rd-4th round pick or so.

[drmcboy]

I thought Al Davis was the guy fucking up the Raiders. Two first-round picks for Palmer?????

yeah loooooool. 2005 carson was maybe worth it, no idea what they are doing here in 2011 after the knee/elbow problems and his apparent mental collapse. Even if he magically becomes 2005 carson again it's still a great deal/free roll since that guy doesn't seem to exist in Cincy so whooo deeeey!

[baudib]

I mean it makes me feel like we got ripped off for Kolb, who isn't even that good.

Would you rather have Vince Young or Palmer? I think it's close. I'd give up Young for a middling backup linebacker and a 4th-rounder.

[drmcboy]

For team X (X =! Cincy) I'd take Palmer because he had some years where he looked like a top 5 nfl QB even if they seem to be behind him. But I really haven't seen VY play in 5 years.

That said I always thought a team that already had no QB but was good elsewhere should sign 3-5 guys like Young, Vick (right after prison), Tebow (obv not after taking him in round 1), Troy Smith, Dennis Dixon, Prior, lots of other guys I'm forgetting, to low ball deals and just run a read option type look just to see what would happen. Give them all equal reps in practice so you can sub them in and out and aren't too exposed to injuries. At some point we have to admit there are only (maybe) 10 QBs in the league you can win a super bowl with and if you don't have one you should either be sucking for Luck or getting creative. Plus you save money and drama since you don't need big name WRs.

[Roid_Rage]

I dont think trading a 1st rounder for him is out of the.question, but two is def overkill. I was mid blunt this.morning when I seen the news on sportscenter and obv mind was blown. Raiders have a legit.shot at doing some shit.this.year.

Im definitely going to be interested in how the bengals use their 4 1st rounders in the next two years. Their offense should be insanely potent 2-4 years from now.

[Lukie]

The 2nd pick will most likely be a 2nd rounder. As I understand it, the Raiders have to advance to the AFC championship game this year for the '13 pick to upgrade to a 1st.

From the Bengals perspective this was a no brainer, the epitome of great value.

The Raiders ostensibly paid way too much but what choice did they really have? If they didn't get a decent vet QB an otherwise promising season would be lost. Two high picks is an outrageous price to pay for an aged Carson Palmer, but I guess we'll see how it all works out. Rock/hard place

[Lukie]

I mean it makes me feel like we got ripped off for Kolb, who isn't even that good.

Would you rather have Vince Young or Palmer? I think it's close. I'd give up Young for a middling backup linebacker and a 4th-rounder.

I wouldn't touch VY with a 10 foot pole. In fact, any team that wanted him could have easily had him in the off-season. 1 year/4m isn't exactly a big investment.

The reality is VY was coming off his best season in 2010, but the dude is so messed up in the head that Munchak, who had been in Tennessee for VY's whole career, wanted nothing to do with him.

[baudib]

Wouldn't put too much weight on that, VY had obviously worn out his welcome. It was clearly time for Fisher to go but he was an institution; he's Andy Reid without the smugness and fat. When you're a punkass who clearly has emotional issues and you're seen costing the local institution his job, you get pretty much blacklisted.

Think about how many personnel moves and coaching moves happen because of networking. Don't have to tell you how many star players were unwanted at some point in their careers, you can start with 12-13 starting QBs in the league right now.

That said, Palmer probably has a pretty decent chance at a Dave Krieg/Jeff Garcia/Kerry Collins-type ending to his career. VY is seen as a boom-or-bust guy, not exactly a stable person you want to invest a lot of money/years to, but clearly better than at least 20-30% of the guys starting in the league.

[Lukie]

- Reasonable and emotionally stable people will never need the police called on them for fear that they are 'going to hurt themselves'. As I recall, this happened twice with VY a couple years ago. Nevermind all the other hilarity he put the Titans organization through.

- Re: networking, I think that is especially true for coaching, e.g. coaching trees. As well, a lot of coaches like bringing in their own guys so to speak, but I think that's perfectly reasonable for coaches to bring in their own players given the business and doesn't carry the same sort of negative implications that it might in other professions.

- Who are the 12-13 starting quarterbacks who were unwanted at one point in their careers? I don't count nearly that many, but I'm also not counting the ones who were traded for significant compensation or who signed somewhere else as a free agent after being a starter for an extended period.

- I can't help but wonder if even the Eagles regret signing him due to the 'dream team' moniker, the 1 pass for 1 interception, and the fact that it was Kafka, not Young that actually was the backup in weeks 2/3. That said VY may have been hurt at the time. I can't remember.

That said, I definitely agree that he is better than some of the starting quarterbacks in the league. And by pure physical ability, he is miles ahead of most.

I am reminded of this fact every Sunday, when I watch Colt McCoy and his inability to consistently throw a spiral (people think I'm joking about this), inability to hit receivers in stride even on short routes that high school quarterbacks are expected to hit, all while looking completely lost and clueless as to where to actually go with the ball. The last one can be excused by being a youngish QB in a new scheme, the others can't.

I'd still rather roll the dice in the draft than get a below average starting QB with all that baggage.

[baudib]

Vick
Romo
Beck, or Grossman, who could probably be had for next to nothing right now
McNabb, no longer starting
Brady
Fitzpatrick
McCoy
Collins
Cassel
Hasselback
Orton or arguably Tebow
Alex Smith, who was obviously a high pick but you could have had him for almost nothing sometime in the past 5 years

[Lukie]

You and I were coming at this from different angles. I was kind of under the impression that you were suggesting that said QBs were unwanted and only got their positions because of networking, from this quote (which I probably mis-interpreted)

Think about how many personnel moves and coaching moves happen because of networking. Don't have to tell you how many star players were unwanted at some point in their careers, you can start with 12-13 starting QBs in the league right now.

Yeah, you can certainly find QBs from the scrap heap, but outside of Brady and perhaps Fitzpatrick and a couple others, I question how many of those QBs are stars.

[baudib]

uh, it's semantics I guess. In a league where you have ~1500 players or so, being a starting QB has to put you in the top 15% of the league in terms of trade value/salary/visibility.

clearly there are probably never 12 "franchise" QBs in the league, in their prime, at any given time.

[a500lbgorilla]

2-14 Eagles season one time!

[baudib]

I'll take it. To me, 2-14 or 12-4, the inevitable 9-7/10-6 season gets you nowhere.

[Trashcona]

I'll take it. To me, 2-14 or 12-4, the inevitable 9-7/10-6 season gets you nowhere.

I'm sure us Packer fans would point out that a 10-6 season could lead to a SB victory. Also, although a 2-14 record will get you a high draft pick, I can assure you that there is lots of value at the other draft postions for the front offices that have a clue as to what they are doing.

[baudib]

Well the key is to get a new front office/HC after the 2-14 debacle.

[Trashcona]

It's funny how a couple of months ago the Eagles were being praised for the way they had structured prior years contracts so that this year they had lots of room under the cap. Every body was happy with how they fleeced the Cardinals on the Kolb deal and now you have this mess. Does Philly have the patience for a draft and develope type of FO? I'm curious to see if more teams follow the lead of NE, PIT, GB and others who've had great success with this strategy.

[baudib]

The problem here is that this is pretty much the team Andy Reid would want to build if he had total control over the team.

The organization's philosophy of emphasizing edge players and speed has gotten them to the point where they take fast linebackers in the 7th round and make them starters, throw them together with safeties who can't tackle and line up the ends 5 yards off-tackle and don't care if you run on them.

It's not so much that the Reid-Banner-Roseman group isn't good at doing certain things, it's that they have notorious blind spots about various things and are incredibly smug about it. I mean, it's just amazing to me that you can take a playoff team, add like 4-5 Pro Bowlers and be demonstrably worse 9 months later because you failed to fill in the bottom of your roster with even vaguely fungible vet -- the linebacking group has to be the absolute worst in the league.

[baudib]

oh and when you have a historically bad red-zone defense and then you make your offensive line coach the DC and the red-zone defense gets worse, you are pretty much asking to be fired.

[bikes]

in fairness to the iggies, they did not have an offseason to teach anyone anything. now this can be said for everyone but the eagles brought in far more skill position new people than most any other team. there's too much talent on that team for them to not make a superbowl run still, give them time imo

[baudib]

That's certainly true but everyone knew there would be a lockout. There were a lot of issues for this team to address, including trading Kolb and trying to rework a deal for DeSean Jackson (I have a feeling they will let him walk); it was perhaps not the year to reinvent your O-line coach as a DC, bring in new offensive and defensive line coaches who have RADICALLY different ideas on how you even play football and a shitton of people from radically different systems.

Nnamdi is a guy who's played press all his career and he played mostly zone for the first 5 games.

Quintin Mikell and Stewart Bradley were two of their best defensive players and they played positions that the team is sorely lacking in experience or depth and they were let go.

The thing that bothers me really is that the offense just does not look in sync. They can move the ball at will between the 20s. LeSean McCoy is having an amazing year; I would honestly not trade him for any back in the league (a couple guys are arguably better, but no one fits the system better). It looks like the league has made adjustments on how to play them and Vick looks like he has regressed.

I feel like an 8-2, 9-1 run is not out of the question but it's been a long long time that the organization has been on the cusp

+1 for calling them iggies

[baudib]

Don't mean to hijack this into Eagles talk, so just have to say, the Harbaugh-Schwartz controversy is so lol.

[bikes]

LOL REX GROSSMANAMENTS

poor bastard

[ensign_lee]

"Poor bastard" should be reserved for Jason Campbell.

Finally resurrects his career in Oakland - life is good. He lays it all out on the line for one play for his teammates, breaks his collarbone, and...is now replaced a few days later. Not just for the season, but basically forever in Oakland.

No way that Oakland trades all that for Carson Palmer and then lets Campbell even compete the next year for a starting job. Oi.

[WildBobAA]

So apparently the reason Jerome Harrison failed his physical that voided the Ronnie Brown deal is because he has a brain tumor. W T F

[bigred]

So apparently the reason Jerome Harrison failed his physical that voided the Ronnie Brown deal is because he has a brain tumor. W T F

Damn, that's awful! Football and life badbeat.