Confessions of a Professional Shortstacker

www.wannabebigforums.com a rather good forum

Got 7k hands in today for ~$4.5k. I normally will not be updating my profit because I typically only check once I week, but with the new changes to my strategy I am sorta forced to check it when I look at other things that are important.

If I finish the month out with 7k hands [going to Bali for a few days on the 28th, so not a full month], I will hit my goal. The problem now is that the one other poker player from my school is also in Thailand and is visiting Bangkok this week so I will be going out with him a bunch. Also, I have a good friend from back home studying in Hong Kong who is also visitng Bangkok, so I will again be going out with him.

This doesnt sound like a huge deal, but my current sleep schedule has me going to bed at 2pm and waking up at 11pm so that I can play during US peak hours. Im probably going to switch to a semi-normal sleep schedule for this week and shoot for ~5k hands a day and then make that up on Sunday by playing something stupid like 15k hands. Overall, Im not too worried and no that I can do it, but I also know it will be easy to just say fuck it and not do it. Im confident I can stick to these goals and think that partying a bit will help give me a decent break.

Also, thanks for all the links guys, im definitely going to read up on a bunch of them

bump. Waking up at 11pm, wtf!?

i wanna hear more about 15k hand days

haha, im going to update later today. had a fucked up past week and a half and ended up going back to the states for about 5 days.

will post story as well as new goals once im done getting hands in for the day and get back from the gym [prob noonish my time, midnight EST]

I sat on stars yesterday and would have been two seats to your right... so I left the table.

thanks for ruining the table for me

WARNING: TLDR

Alright, so last week a friend from school was in Bangkok with a bunch of other 2p2ers he lives with in Phuket, so I went out a few times with them and had a blast. I distinctly remember meeting up with them on night in one of the sketchiest parts of Bangkok called Patpong, also one of its biggest red light districts. We werent really feeling the place, but decided to have some beers and play pool before going out to the clubs. On the way out we kept being approached by these guys with basically a sex show menu. One item stood out in particular, "ping pong show" [search urban dictionary for more information]. So, we didnt end up checking it out that night, but one of my roomates, Roomate 1, and I vowed to never leave Bangkok until we saw it.

Another buddy of mine from high school was studying abroad in hong kong and traveling around southeast asia on his spring break and told me he had a 15 hour layover in bkk. He came over and crashed for awhile and then we took him out to lunch before his flight. I ordered a pitcher and the waitress kindly informed me that it was 2-for-1 pitchers. This never ends well for me.

We went through 2 pitchers and lunch, got my friend in a cab and then went back for 2 more pitchers. Afterwards, we didnt want to call it a night [it was about 3pm, when we are typically all heading to bed] and Roomate 1 and I spent about 10 minutes convincing the friend I came to Bangkok with from home, we'll call him Wallstreet, and Roomate 2 that it was the perfect time for a ping pong show.

We get to Patpong and it is dead. We go to one of the bars, order some drinks and then ask the bartender about ping pong shows. She tells us that they dont start until 7pm, so we have about 4 more hours. I suggest doing a pub crawl to pass the time, Roomate 1 insta-agrees, but the others arent going along so easily but finally oblige. Shots flew back and time flew by and before we knew it, it was 730 and we were hammered playing pool with what were probably hookers in some random pack alley pool hall that looked like a dungeon from the outside.

We left and went aimlessly looking for the show. Found some random guy outside of a club who tried to bring us inside, we asked if they had ping pong shows, he said yes, so we went in. We grabbed some beers and sat down by the stage and braced ourselves. Biggest. Disappointment. Ever. Without going into many details, just know that this was not anything like South Park described. The balls were not “shot” over long distances but merely dropped into a jar with only about a 60% accuracy rate. Lame.

Clearly tilted, we ventured back into the streets to find the real deal. This is when things start to get hazey. Roomate 1 and I went one way, and Wallstreet and Roomate 2 went the other. We ended up at the seediest place I have ever been. It had no lights except for some neon pink ones over the stage, had about 20 girls working but no customers until we walked in. Had I been anywhere else in the world, this would have been an amazing sight. Here, however, this usually means some sort of trouble.

Roomate 1 and I took seats by the stage and were immediately swarmed by literally every girl in this place. We were given two drinks which we, stupidly, quickly polished off. The girls start all yelling at me asking me to buy them drinks. At this point my vision is incredibly blurred and I have no idea what is going on. I remember seeing what looked like 20 diet cokes in front of us for all the girls and when I told them I wasnt paying for it, all hell broke loose. I threw on the stage whatever money I was able to randomly grab out of my pocket and got the fuck out of there, figuring Roomate 1 was right behind me, stumbled down some street and jumped in the first cab I saw.

The next thing I remember is walking down some random side street that is sorta near our house. I dont have any idea what happened between getting in the cab and walking down the street, but my ass doesnt hurt and I still have my kidneys; however, I have absolutely no money in my pockets. Whatever, at least I’m not dead. I walk for about 30 minutes until I get back to our house and when I walked inside, everybody was there and immediately started freaking out at me. I just got drugged, robbed, and then walked half an hour, so I flip out at them.

Turns out that Wallstreet and Roomate 2 found Roomate 1 passed out at some counterfeit movie stand outside of the club and then they all went looking for me. Wallstreet went to the doorman and said “Where’s Andy?!” the doorman told him that I was inside having a good time and didnt want to leave. Wallstreet interpreted this to mean that he knew who I was [Note: Wallstreet was also hammered]. Wallstreet started yelling at the guy, telling him to go get me, the guy flips out and suddenly has a gun to Wallstreet’s head.

Wallstreet, with ninja-like instincts, somehow takes the gun away from the guy. I wasnt there and have no idea how or why this happened, but it did in fact happen. He tells the guy to get out of his way and then goes through the club looking for me. Realizes I’m not there, tosses the gun and meets up again with Roomate 1 and Roomate 2 outside. The look around a little more for me but realize that when you get a gun pulled on you in Bangkok, you probably shouldnt stick around much longer, so they head back to the house where I eventually show up.

All of us sit around and talk about how ridiculous what just happened was and go over the details for awhile until we all calm down. I let Wallstreet know how much I appreciate his loyalty, but to never again try to disarm a crazy person with a gun. We figure we need to relax so we walk down the street to “Angel Massage” and get a nice massage before heading to bed.

Moral of the story: There is no such thing as free beer.

After that fiasco, we take most of the next day off to just recover, I grind a bit, but really just a much needed lazy day. Wallstreet suddenly finds out that there is some family stuff back home he really needs to get back to and I know how much 24 hour traveling sucks, especially when you have stuff on your mind, so I decide to go back with him for about a week.

I get back, nearly give my dad a heart attack [didnt tell anybody I was coming home], see my family and friends and just have a good week of normal, college life. Wallstreet stayed home with his family and I came back a few days ago. My other roomates [Ill eventually think of nicknames for them] are currently in Bali for at least a couple more days, so Ive just been chilling by myself at our house.

I had a really tough time leaving home again, probably harder than the first time actually, but now that Im back it isnt so bad. I miss my family and friends and the girls and just normal life where Im always comfortable, but I know that being comfortable is what I wanted to get away from, because I was stagnating in that environment.

My new plan is to grind 10k hands/day for the rest of the month [started 2 days ago], keep up with the gym and diet, make a bankroll crushing cashout for taxes on April 1st, and then continue the 10k hands/day grind but have it split up with trips to keep me sane.

After the first week of april I plan on going to Ko Tao to take a SCUBA course for about 5 days, then after another week of grindage make a trip to Ko Pha-Ngan for their famous full moon party. The week after that my visa expires and Im not all that sure what Im going to do. Im definitely headed home, but not sure if I am going to take a trip anywhere along the way, but I have plenty of time to decide. My summer plans are basically the same as what I posted before. I think that home is a good place for me to be and that as long as I keep my perspective, I can still be productive and comfortable.

My game is the best it has ever been, and Im working on getting some new stuff developed to take it even further. Im excited for this last month.

Haha, again very entertaining! Keep up with the crazy life! Great entertainment!!

awesome story, thailand sounds so sketchy imo

thread delivers

stop by Montreal on the way home if you're not too sick of travelling

Originally Posted by Alexos

thread delivers

+1

Originally Posted by Alexos

thread delivers

stop by Montreal on the way home if you're not too sick of travelling

yea, i think thats the plan now, around April 24th Ill be getting in to Montreal and prob meeting up with some of my friends from school. Hopefully you guys are around then.

dude, guess you know already, but try and avoid getting blind/out of control when you're beyond where you should be, where you're safe, or where you understand.
It happens though, I had a couple of late-night interesting times in the seedy parts of La Paz and backstreet Buenos Aires - and hope to never experience that again.

Stay awake, eyes open, and now go grind and make those $$
I'll keep an eye out for stars/ftr gear when i next pass through thailand...

After watching your vids on FB wow. You sir are a balla!

Damn dude, sounds like you are making the most of your travels. I'm also on the road right now and reading your most recent adventure (empty wallet etc..) reminds me of a couple nights ago in Amsterdam. Nothing worse than being in a taxi and realizing you have no money and no idea where you are and you're too drunk to remember the name of your hotel lol. I get back in Montreal the 20th of April so if you stop by the 24th we can all get together for an FTR night that doesn't involve guns and sketchy dungeon-hookers.

Gl with everything.

so just got all my tax stuff from my accountant and made the wire out of stars to cover last years taxes + first quarter 09s estimates + 401k contribution and yea, that hurts.

Im leaving to go get SCUBA certified in Ko Tao [island in Thailand] on tuesday, so the plan is to get in ~30k hands of 2/4 and 3/6 between now and then. Once Im back, I have about 2 weeks until I go home to the States and am shooting for 150k hands in that time period. Once home Im going to work on balancing poker and a real social life, but still keep up a very solid grind. Shooting for ~250k hands in May.

Now that taxes are over with, Im going to really work on managing my money better. My plan is to make a cashout for Vegas at the end of May, but after that not cashout until I hit 100k online [what I figured out the "optimal" br to be, spread across several sites]. Then Im going to make a sizeable cashout specifically for taxes. The next large cashout after that will be to buy a car [hopefully a Jeep SRT8] which will happen when I can make the cashout and still maintain 100k online. After that, I am planning of rebalancing my accounts [so one site doesnt have a disproportionate % of the br] and cashing out everything over $100k. A certain % of that will go to a savings account solely for taxes, another % will go to a standard savings account will I will use to invest in real estate [hopefully sooner, rather than later], and then the excess will go into checking unless it is too much, then I will put more money into the real estate savings accountl.

I think money management is hugely underrated in poker, but often misapplied. The issue with what happened in February for me [dropping 20k at 10/20+] was that I hadnt put enough money away for taxes, so I was forced to move down significantly as to not jeopardize that. I didnt plan ahead properly and that was a mistake. Know what your expenses are going to be and make sure to put that money aside or at least have a structured plan of how and when you will do that.

However, beyond putting away 6 [or so] months expenses, I think making regular cashouts is a mistake for the vast majority of players. Saving money is hugely important, and thats obvious, but most people do not think about it rationally. While saving may be good, we need to weigh that option against the other possibilities, namely, leaving it in our poker account to speed up the process of moving up stakes. Yes, we need to make sure we have enough for taxes and other things that come up, but we should not be auto-cashing out sizeable portions of our br until we are at a point where the extra money is nearly meaningless to have in our br, i.e. we have hit our "ceiling" [i hate the term, because i dont think we have inherent ceilings, but ill use it anyways to basically mean we have reached the point where we arent putting in more effort to get better and are content with staying at the current level].

last year, i didnt really follow this advice. i made a lot of money and spent a lot of money and i had the absolute time of my life throughout it all, but by not paying attention to the opportunity cost of my spending and forgetting my long term goals, i put myself that much further away from achieving them and now that i have taxes behind me, im going to change that.

Originally Posted by Ravageur

Damn dude, sounds like you are making the most of your travels. I'm also on the road right now and reading your most recent adventure (empty wallet etc..) reminds me of a couple nights ago in Amsterdam. Nothing worse than being in a taxi and realizing you have no money and no idea where you are and you're too drunk to remember the name of your hotel lol. I get back in Montreal the 20th of April so if you stop by the 24th we can all get together for an FTR night that doesn't involve guns and sketchy dungeon-hookers.

Gl with everything.

id love to hear about your travels, unfortunately i dont think im going to make it to montreal at the end of april, but will almost defintiely be going up mid may. you going to vegas this summer?

Just got back from getting SCUBA certified in Ko Tao only to find out that bangkok is apparently in a state of emergency. Looks like it does any other day to me.

Ill give a more thorough update after my session

for the next little while maybe you should lower your variance and avoid armed confrontations?

Originally Posted by andy-akb

Originally Posted by Ravageur

Damn dude, sounds like you are making the most of your travels. I'm also on the road right now and reading your most recent adventure (empty wallet etc..) reminds me of a couple nights ago in Amsterdam. Nothing worse than being in a taxi and realizing you have no money and no idea where you are and you're too drunk to remember the name of your hotel lol. I get back in Montreal the 20th of April so if you stop by the 24th we can all get together for an FTR night that doesn't involve guns and sketchy dungeon-hookers.

Gl with everything.

Boo too bad about Montreal, but I am going to try to get down to Vegas via a promotion so I have yet to book anything definite but I intend to be down there aroud the same time as Griffey/Alexos. Hopefully we can all catch up down there.

gl gl
id love to hear about your travels, unfortunately i dont think im going to make it to montreal at the end of april, but will almost defintiely be going up mid may. you going to vegas this summer?

ugh my reply got messed up, but to reiterate:

Boo too bad about Montreal, but I am going to try to get down to Vegas via a promotion so I have yet to book anything definite but I intend to be down there aroud the same time as Griffey/Alexos. Hopefully we can all catch up down there.

gl gl

Originally Posted by andy-akb

Now that taxes are over with, Im going to really work on managing my money better. My plan is to make a cashout for Vegas at the end of May, but after that not cashout until I hit 100k online [what I figured out the "optimal" br to be, spread across several sites]. Then Im going to make a sizeable cashout specifically for taxes. The next large cashout after that will be to buy a car [hopefully a Jeep SRT8] which will happen when I can make the cashout and still maintain 100k online. After that, I am planning of rebalancing my accounts [so one site doesnt have a disproportionate % of the br] and cashing out everything over $100k. A certain % of that will go to a savings account solely for taxes, another % will go to a standard savings account will I will use to invest in real estate [hopefully sooner, rather than later], and then the excess will go into checking unless it is too much, then I will put more money into the real estate savings accountl.

Probably a mute point at the moment with interest rates so low, but have you considered keeping most of your online bankroll in an interest bearing account (should be very quick to make deposits if needed), possibly put a small amount in month term deposits.

Out of interest what are you using Monte Carlo for? Most non-path dependent problems can be solved faster using binomial trees or finite difference grids.

Thailand Trip Coming to a Close


So I am going back home in a few days and my "vacation" is coming to a close. My goals coming into the trip were:

-Poker:
1. 40 hours/week of grinding
2. Find optimal # of tables
3. Multi-site as much as possible to increase average stake
4. Work on HUSNGs
-hit SNE this year

-Health/Fitness:
1. Work out _hard_ 6 days/week

I have not made much progress in #3 because my BR doesnt really have much room to be split up right now, and HUSNGs need to be put off until the end of the year, if not indefinitely. However, even though I have experienced the worst variance of my life and didnt make all the manies, I proved to myself that I have the drive needed to succeed. I stuck to my schedule of poker and working out and following my diet. Not everything was followed to the t, but I made a ton of improvement in all areas and Im very happy with that. In poker, I have worked more on my game in these past few months that I probably have in my entire career up until this point.

I learned never to settle for anything and always fully apply yourself towards your goals. Before when working with my mental game coach, Jared Tendler, I always hit a sticking point in terms of motivation; I thought I had most of the game figured out and that while there may be more out there, it was incredibly marginal and just not worth my time. It turns out, I just wasnt looking hard enough. If you arent doing everything in your power to make yourself better, then you have no right to complain about your results. If you are, then you have no time to complain.

I read a good amount of incredible books and am really starting to take full advantage of them. I have always been an avid reader of self-improvement books on many different topics, but never did much with them. When I came here I started to take notes on documentaries I watched and on the books I read, but again, while that helped, I still wasnt doing a lot with them. Then while I was getting SCUBA certified, I read How to Read a Book and it really opened my eyes to how I should approach a book. I applied this on the most recent book I read, Getting Things Done, by noting the book as I read it and then fully outlining the book and also outlining a clear plan on how to implement it. Im going to use that plan to tie up loose ends here in Thailand and then fully implement it once I get home. While books can make you think, I believe they are a waste of time unless you actively try to implement what you learned from them and I can honestly say that How to Read a Book, no matter how elementary the title may sound, has started me on that path of doing so.

Taxes caused a huge hit on my bankroll and that took away nearly all of my momentum, but I still kept learning. I wont make the same mistakes again with money management once I build my roll back up, which shouldnt take very long.

Overall, this trip has been the best thing for me in terms of my self-development. It has made me realize that the only thing holding anybody back is truly themselves. With this “new” mindset, I know that this summer for me is going to be a huge success.

Summer Outlook:

Most of my summer plan is similar to what I have said before, so hopefully this isnt too redundant.

I get home in a couple of days and will be there until I leave for Vegas for my birthday at the end of May. While home I am going to shoot for 8 hours/day of poker, with a few days off for graduation and other events like that. Im also going to continue working out 6 days/week. This will give me time to build my BR back up and be in great shape for the summer.

In Vegas I am going to probably play a couple of WSOP events and grind a couple hours a day online, but I mean, it is Vegas so Im still going to be going out regularly and just having fun. Afterwards, I will be living outside of Boston with a good friend of mine and will be getting back on the grind. I plan on the same schedule as before, 8 hours/day of poker and gym 6 days/week, but again, it is the summer so I will be partying a good amount as well and there will be several trips thrown in there for several days and weeks off.

Originally I planned on learning HUSNGs near the end of summer and making a push with those for SNE; however, now I think that my time is going to be much better spent getting into sports betting. I am not going to try to learn to handicap, but instead will be dealing primarily with arbitrage and derivatives. I think this has a lot of potential and is similar to shortstacking in that the bulk of the work is in getting the formulas down, the rest is more maintenance. I could be off on this, but I have done a decent amount of research and think I have what it takes to be successful at it. There is also a website that I recently had an idea for that I think has huge potential and I will be putting a lot of time and money into getting it developed around this time as well.

In the fall I plan on taking a very light course load of interesting classes, cutting down poker to ~20 hours/week and shifting my focus towards real estate investment. Everybody says they want to get into real estate, but nobody really knows wtf they mean. I want to buy houses and rent them out for a positive cash flow. I have already done a ton of reading on this subject and will do a ton more before I begin, but I am very confident that this is possible and I actually imagine it is more likely to be successful than the sports betting path; however, I will work at it until they both are a success.

I will manage the apartments myself until I have enough units that it is feasible to hire a fulltime manager. I will not be hiring a manager at the start simply because there arent any decent ones in the area and if I learn it myself I will be able to better train my manager and hopefully make the process as efficient as possible. When I have a large enough cash flow from my properties to cover a mortgage of my own as well as expenses, I will purchase a house for myself. I believe I can do all of this within a year of starting.

Long term I want to build my real estate portfolio as much as possible within my area and then decide what route to go; either continue in a larger market or focus on other forms of investments, namely value investing in the stock market. Throughout all of this, I will maintain a decent level of poker [~20 hours/week] and sports betting. Essentially my goal is to have multiple streams of income and then have separate ways to invest that income for as high a return as possible.

I have ideas nearly every day for what I think would be successful businesses and eventually I want to be able to have the security of trying them. The first I plan on attempting is the website which wont take a ton of time on my part as I wont be developing it, but will cost a significant amount of money to be done correctly. It may not work out and may be a huge loss on my part, but I think it has huge potential and I am confident that I will try and do everything I can to make it work. If it doesnt, then it is on the to next idea. Paraphrasing Taylor Caby, who was paraphrasing somebody else, you cant control your luck, you can only put yourself in more situations to get lucky. If I keep trying, luck will eventually be on my side, but if I leave it all up to luck, I have no control.

All of this can and will change, but it is important to have these long term goals so that I know what I am working towards. I will be constantly re-evaluating these goals and ideas and adjusting my short and long term actions to fit those goals. But whatever they end up being, Im sure I will eventually reach them.

Originally Posted by Genitruc

for the next little while maybe you should lower your variance and avoid armed confrontations?

Yeaaaaaa, prob not a bad idea

Originally Posted by Ravageur

ugh my reply got messed up, but to reiterate:

Boo too bad about Montreal, but I am going to try to get down to Vegas via a promotion so I have yet to book anything definite but I intend to be down there aroud the same time as Griffey/Alexos. Hopefully we can all catch up down there.

gl gl

Ill be in MTL on the 25th for one night of degeneracy. Get to Vegas on the 29th of May so you are there in time for my 21st Bday. When Im in MTL I fully plan on convincing Alex to change his flight and hotel so he is there as well

Originally Posted by DemonDaze

Probably a mute point at the moment with interest rates so low, but have you considered keeping most of your online bankroll in an interest bearing account (should be very quick to make deposits if needed), possibly put a small amount in month term deposits.

Out of interest what are you using Monte Carlo for? Most non-path dependent problems can be solved faster using binomial trees or finite difference grids.

Meh, as a US player it isnt that easy to quickly deposit money, especially large amounts. If I were playing at only one site this would definitely be an option, but when my BR ideally needs to be spread between several sites and I cannot quickly deposit money, it just doesnt work that well. So not a moot point, it just isnt very practical for me.

As far as the simulations, I dont have much knowledge in programming or math really [not at that level] so I just worked with the tools I had available or the ones that could easily [and for a reasonable cost] be modified

Just found this op, only read half of it so far. Hope it's all going well.
I've taken two trips to Thailand, been all over the country - lots of areas where I was 1 of probably 6 or less people that spoke english for 100 miles, loved it completely.

bump. Update?

Originally Posted by kevster

bump. Update?