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[FTR Quick Tip 011] Playing Suited Connectors

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  1. #1

    Arrow [FTR Quick Tip 011] Playing Suited Connectors

    Suited connectors are great hands to play in order to mix up your range and to not be predictable. Yet all suited connectors do not have the same value. Find out the best way to play these troublesome hands in order to increase your winrate in NL Hold'em cash games.

    Questions? Discuss below!
  2. #2
    Good quick tip presentation, but Only preflop selection, not actually playing suited connectors,
    eg what happens next with the 97 calling the multiway pot. Is it just hit a monster on the flop or fold, what do you do if you just catch a pair?
  3. #3
    Hey Chemist. Yeah, I can't really go into too much detail in each video, due to the short length of each one. But I do think I perhaps should have included at least one example hand against a competent reg where we go postflop. The problem is then that we have so many options on different flops, and then more options on the turn, that the whole video could end up being just about one specific hand. I guess it's not a problem, in itself, to have a whole video about one hand, and maybe in the future I could do something like that.

    Regarding the 97s call, there are a couple of things that make it, in my mind, a profitable call. The first is that the raiser only made the raise 3x, even after there were some limpers ahead of him. Not only does he make the limpers get odds to call pretty much with anything they have, but other players behind him (like us) can call wide and are getting pretty sick odds. If all the limpers call, then we're getting about 4.5-1 effective odds on our call. Of course, something bad might happen like a limp-reraise or someone 3betting behind us, but on the other hand, someone in the blinds may come along as well, making our effective odds even better.

    If we call and all the 3 limpers call when it comes back to them, the pot will be about $3.75 on the flop, or 15 big blinds. The SPR will be a relatively low 7ish, so it's not a great spot for bluffing or semi-bluffing, especially multi-way. I think we'll have to kinda just play the strength of our hand. But it should be pretty easy to get paid off pretty well when we do flop a monster. If someone bets out 2/3 pot, that's already 10bb of value and if someone else calls, we've already gotten 20 bb from our big hand, in addition to the 12 bb that we get from the pot that our opponents had put in preflop. If we just get another 2/3 pot of value on the turn or river half of the time, I think it makes our preflop call profitable.

    Then we do have some equity from our draws that we will flop. We can't really bluff-raise or float, I think, against such a large field. But, there are so many players in the pot that by the time it comes to us, we may be getting enough odds to profitably chase our draw, especially if it is an OESD. Consider that many of these guys probably don't know much about betsizing, so we may draw for a very cheap price. Or, even if someone cbets 2/3 pot on the flop, he may get scared and make a little 5bb bet on the turn, which we can call very profitably when we have a good draw.

    If we flop just a pair, we'll have a tricky spot, for sure. If someone leads 3/4 pot and someone else calls and it's on us, and let's say we have flopped a 9 for top pair and no draws, I really have no problems just folding here, unless the betsize is really small. It's hard to get value multiway, even in position, with a low top pair and a bad kicker. It's also probably wrong to bluff-catch multiple streets against fish. So, even though we'd probably call in position against two players in that spot if we could somehow be all-in, the fact that we have a stack behind and reverse implied odds makes it a close fold, imo.

    Different things could happen though where we DO want to play top or middle pair. We might have top pair + gutshot + BDFD and the betsizing into us is pretty small. In that case, our hand probably has enough possibilities that we can at least call and see the turn. Or maybe all the limpers fold preflop and the original raiser checks to us. Then we have different options and we can play "what if?" all day. But over the sum of all possibilities, I think perhaps 85%+ of the time, we're gonna be playing pretty face up on the flop against these guys. But it doesn't matter. They don't know what they are supposed to do, and they have already made such big mistakes preflop that I think it's OK to play face up, and we should still show a good profit here.
  4. #4
    Thanks for the detail.
    You're right post flop, turn etc does provide too many options, but that is why it is so much harder and why I am more interested in that gap in my game.
    I like the idea about the dedicated video, I will look forward to it.

    Regarding calling limpers and a raise, I like to do that but I find that frequently something bad does happen. I think any good player behind would put in a large raise to exploit the likely weakness of limpers and callers.

    ( If you were making the video, what action would you recommend to the last limper if everyone else had called?
    Any HUD statistics people have on me are useless as I am very inconsistent, so in that position, in my passive moments I would just call, but in my aggressive moments I would shove all in.
    Perhaps your ranges wouldn't have got you in to that position but my inconsistent early limping range could have been anything ).

    Getting back to the original call hoping for follow on calls the 'what ifs' are too many of course, thanks for the interesting thoughts on some of the possibilities. But I think the most important point you make is 'they have already made such big mistakes preflop'.
    Also as a general rule I think 'face up' probably is the best way to play with inexperienced players who 'don't know what they are supposed to do'.
  5. #5
    I think it is true that if you just call, some people behind you might 3-bet. But in the situation in the video, there were only 2 people left to act, and 1 of them was a nit. Even solid regulars won't 3-bet all the time. And if they do, then the way you can exploit them is to just call someone's open raise with all your JJ+/AK and when the reg 3-bets behind you, then you can 4-bet him. But honestly, as much as I talk about 3betting as a bluff and capitalizing on dead money, I rarely am 3betting more than about a 12% range at most, even in very favorable situations. And I don't think other regs can really 3bet much more than that, either (except if they are playing heads-up, or in some weird situation).

    If everyone calls and the action is on the last limper, then I think he should call as well. His odds are so great at that point that he can pretty much call with any two cards. Maybe fold offsuit disconnected stuff like T2o or 82o, if he has them in his range. He will be closing the action and had decent position. His error was limping in to begin with, but with such a small raise size, I think it would be profitable to call when it gets back to him.

    I disagree that any stats people have on you are useless because you are inconsistent. You still have frequencies of actions, which is what HUDs tell people about. I think shoving all in with some marginal hand is not very good there. It's a very weird move that people will remember for a while, so you probably wouldn't be able to do it again at the same table. I don't think it's really profitable even the first time you do it, either. You're going to risk 100 bb to win ~15. And the original raiser can still act and maybe has a monster himself.

    Also, I strongly caution you against having an early limping range. 90%+ of the time, it is wrong to limp in early position. I don't think the tables are passive enough, even in microstakes, that you can open-limp some stuff like A2s or 87s. I think the almost surely have to raise or fold if you are the first one in the pot. An exception might be if there are some really aggressive players that you can exploit with a limp-reraise. But that's a rare situation.

    You are right that is is correct to play face-up against inexperienced players. They are not trying to exploit you; mostly they just are worried about their own cards.

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