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QQ Under the Gun

View Poll Results: What should hero do?

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  • Fold

    0 0%
  • Flat

    0 0%
  • Reraise Pot

    0 0%
  • Shove

    1 100.00%
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Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. #1

    Default QQ Under the Gun

    San Manuel Casino, 2-5 NL, $150 stack, everyone has me covered, 9-handed, no reads as it is my first hand. Prior four pots were raised 15-20, that I did see. Some pros, some Joes, villain is right behind me and is unknown. I sit down UTG, no post required, look down at :Qh: :Qd: and flat, expecting a raise so I can go all in. Villain flats, everyone else folds to my surprise.

    So I am heads up OOP and don't know anything. Pot is 5+5+5 from the BB, me, and villain, SB folded his 2 and the rake is 4 so effective pot is 13.

    Board comes J-8-4 rainbow. I donk with 15 and villain makes it 40. BB folds and I conclude, perhaps erroneously, I am up against the following range: AA, KK, JJ, 88, 44, J8s, J8o, T9s, T9o, AJ, KJ, and who knows. "Feels" like I should shove but my gut says "way ahead or way behind", not sure I want to shove the first hand.

    What do you guys think?
  2. #2
    rpm's Avatar
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    just raise like at least 4bb's preflop, this is live poker, you'll get action. i don't really know what to do now. but if we do think our hand is good enough to get the money in with, i probably call flop and check/shove turn. few turn cards scare us and we block 1/4 of the turn cards to the only draw he could have
  3. #3
    I like raising pre as well, especially if it's your first hand. Even better if you're young/look drunk
  4. #4
    MadMojoMonkey's Avatar
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    Why so shallow? Only 30bb deep when you sat down?

    Seems to me like QQ might as well be AA pre-flop with this stack size. I don't like the limp UTG, although I understand you're going for a limp/jam... which pretty much screams QQ+ from UTG, so you'd be on the bottom of your range...

    Clearly, you're trying to trap here. There are so many more ways to trap live, though. You just need to look weak... it doesn't have to be your bet that is weak.

    I think jam is good here. It puts a dangerous image out there whether or not it gets called, and an overpair is not horrible to bet/jam the flop. Plus, you force Villain to pay for any drawing hands.

    { JJ, 88, 44, J8 } is a reasonable range that is trouble, and JJ is likely going to raise pre with position and a new fish at the table (you, not necessarily a correct read, just Villain's ego).
  5. #5

    Default Interim Response

    Thanks for the thoughts so far. I have been appreciating and considering the three responses so far.

    With 55+ views and but three responses to date, maybe the other readers concur with what's been said, but I would appreciate other input.

    Mojo: "Why only 30bb?" That $2-$5 game has a $100 min-$300 max buying and had been going for some time. My $150 stack came from another game I was in, awaiting the $2-$5 seat. I took the seat and the UTG hand with "great expectations" thinking $150 was "enough to sit down".

    Pascal: "Young/Drunk": Too bad I am 65 and look most if not all of it <wry smile>.

    RPM & Pascal: Raising pre in retrospect - flatting UTG is a risk i took when i didn't raise pre, didn't work out as I expected!

    All: With nothing else to go on, my decision was, stripped to essentials, "how likely is it villain to have me beat already". My 15 post flop was basically "pot" and so was his making it 40.

    I did ask Pokerstove (newbie at that) here's the range I am probably facing, what's my equity, within a few points of 50-50. But I would put more weight on your personal opinions that on Pokerstove!
  6. #6
    MadMojoMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NozSr View Post
    Mojo: "Why only 30bb?" That $2-$5 game has a $100 min-$300 max buying and had been going for some time. My $150 stack came from another game I was in, awaiting the $2-$5 seat. I took the seat and the UTG hand with "great expectations" thinking $150 was "enough to sit down".
    In general, I'd say sit with the max buy-in or stay at the lower stakes where you probably have a bigger edge, and a deeper stack.
    If your read says the table is juicy enough to sit down light, then you are OK with this.

    Quote Originally Posted by NozSr View Post
    Some pros, some Joes, villain is right behind me and is unknown.
    If more than 1 or 2 of the villains is unknown, I'd say the read that the table is juicy is not solid enough to jump. Watch the table for another 30 minutes or so.
    So here's the $300 question... is Villain a pro or a Joe?
    If they're a pro, you can jam, since they're going to be pushing you with draws, and not limping w/ AA or KK.
    If he's a Joe, then maybe fold, since he's only raising a strong hand and could limp w/ AA or KK. The fold option is really only there if this is your only gambling money. If you can re-buy, then there's no reason to play tournament-tight.

    Quote Originally Posted by NozSr View Post
    I sit down UTG, no post required, look down at and flat, expecting a raise so I can go all in. Villain flats, everyone else folds to my surprise.

    So I am heads up OOP...
    Wait... so the BB folded to no bet? Juicy table indeed. I understand your eagerness to get in this game.
  7. #7
    "Tournament tight" Excellent read - on me! Some friends and I had just played the Morongo tournament that morning. I was well capitalized but you're right on, I was still in "tournament" mode looking at that decision.

    No read if he was Joe or pro, would have been good to know that.

    Those who responded have been kind. Any of you could have said "why did you sit down if you're not automatically going to jam your post flop overpair on that board with an SPR around two? Why are you thinking?".
  8. #8
    I would shove here because I do not see anybody limping with KK or AA so you are probaly good.
  9. #9
    Gotta ship it. You got his J crushed.
  10. #10
    Fnord's Avatar
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    Raise pre-flop.
    All the money goes in on the flop.

    Shallow money, live players.

    If you lose this hand, REBUY!
  11. #11
    Tom1559's Avatar
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    Why flat with Q's to start with. This surely had to be a raise. Someone fla calling you tells you nothing at all about his hand so you have given yourself a really tricky problem working out what he might have. I doubt he had you dominated to start with otherwise he would have raised so I am guessing he called to see the flop with a makeable hand. Could be J with anything from A to 8. The only two hands that have you beat on the flop are JJ and J8. I would read this as him having the J with a decent kicker or a straight draw. I would reraise if for no other reason to make him do the thinking. If he pushes you fold but you might just find it is enough to force the fold from him. If he calls I think your danger is then the straight or him getting lucky with two pair.
    Scottish Cowboy
  12. #12

    Default Shipping it post flop

    Really dont like the Flat Call from the Pocket Ladies. Position sucks bu you gotta thin the field. But be it as it may your gonna probably need to put your chips in the middle now.
  13. #13
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    Raise it up 4x pre & look to get it in on the flop.
  14. #14
    I think you raise 3x or 4x the big blind... But on the flop, you should shove.... I think your looking at Jack with a high kicker most likely or J10???

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