2nd nuts, limped pot, how crazy do we get here?

I have around $1800.

SB is LAgg. Lots of naked aggression and some stubborn calls for a couple hundred here and there. However, he's not in every pot and is capable of laying down hands. My image is pretty Tight and I haven't really been caught getting out of line.

3 limpers, SB (LAgg) completes, I check with :Td:

5 to the flop ~$45 in the pot.

LAgg checks, I bet $40, total station calls (ANY pair ANY draw, heck maybe even overs), LAgg makes it $140, I think.... call, station calls.

~$460 in the pot 3 to the turn

LAgg checks! I bet $300, station folds, LAgg tanks hard... calls.

~$1060 in the pot, heads-up

LAgg checks, I bet $500...

How'd I do? Comments on the flop appreciated.

4th nuts on the river, no? Flop looks fine to me.

Originally Posted by pocketfours

4th nuts on the river, no? Flop looks fine to me.

2nd nut on the flop unless you count JTs with and without a backdoor redraw as different hands.

On the river my hand is pretty much the nuts against the range of hands I can resonably expect to continue, even against this clown. If he's got a better backdoor flush, he gets my stack.

Thinking back on it, WTF is my re-raise range here? WTF is my re-raise range in pretty much any limp pot? 3rd bet = nuts because live players suck too hard to polarize with bluffs?

Yeah, just wanted to make sure you posted it correctly. I don't 3bet any hand on the flop.

While I don't think we have to worry about pushing LAgg off his hand on the flop with a 3bet (reads like 2pair or a set), we want station to continue to donate and 3betting may push him out. By just calling, you can hopefully extract more out of them both if the turn is a brick, and I guess there's the side benefit of the pot being smaller if the turn is a 10 or the board pairs.

NH!

looks like he flopped the third nuts as he doesn't seem like the type to c/r <set.

Our flop call is interesting, but don't we dislike half of the deck?

the rest is played fine

I think this was very well played.

It's a fascinating hand because it demonstrates the difference between a concealed made hand and an unconcealed one.

Your straight on the flop is unconcealed. You put out a pot size bet, which one might make with top pair or two pair, and you are raised. If you re-raise at this point, I think anyone is going to put you on the straight. So you just call.

The turn card actually makes your straight even less concealed. There's now four cards to the straight on the board. But what is concealed is the VALUE of your straight. You have a 10-high straight, and a villain may put you on a 9-high straight. Your 2/3 pot-size bet may be interpreted that way, or it may be interpreted as an attempt to buy the pot in case nobody has the straight.

But now the river comes and you make your backdoor flush. At this point, your hand is totally concealed. If anyone else has a straight, even with JT, they are calling you. They may also be calling you with a set or two pair. Your half-the-pot bet tells them nothing about your hand.

This is an almost dream scenario, to have callers on a board where you have a much better hand than the villains are likely to put you on.

Originally Posted by LawDude

I think this was very well played.

It's a fascinating hand because it demonstrates the difference between a concealed made hand and an unconcealed one.

Your straight on the flop is unconcealed. You put out a pot size bet, which one might make with top pair or two pair, and you are raised. If you re-raise at this point, I think anyone is going to put you on the straight. So you just call.

The turn card actually makes your straight even less concealed. There's now four cards to the straight on the board. But what is concealed is the VALUE of your straight. You have a 10-high straight, and a villain may put you on a 9-high straight. Your 2/3 pot-size bet may be interpreted that way, or it may be interpreted as an attempt to buy the pot in case nobody has the straight.

But now the river comes and you make your backdoor flush. At this point, your hand is totally concealed. If anyone else has a straight, even with JT, they are calling you. They may also be calling you with a set or two pair. Your half-the-pot bet tells them nothing about your hand.

This is an almost dream scenario, to have callers on a board where you have a much better hand than the villains are likely to put you on.

It's an interesting scenario, sure, but it ultimately doesn't really factor here unless the guy has TJ, right?. On the flop is where the concealed hand remained concealed, and after that the guy can either beat a 9-high straight (with TJ) or he can't, in which case it doesn't matter that the flush is also concealed. With the read that was given, I don't see this guy calling the river bet with 2-pair or a set; he either has TJ and is definitely calling, or is throwing away probably any other hand.

Either way, I agree that it was well played.

Originally Posted by Taicho

Originally Posted by LawDude

I think this was very well played.

It's a fascinating hand because it demonstrates the difference between a concealed made hand and an unconcealed one.

Your straight on the flop is unconcealed. You put out a pot size bet, which one might make with top pair or two pair, and you are raised. If you re-raise at this point, I think anyone is going to put you on the straight. So you just call.

The turn card actually makes your straight even less concealed. There's now four cards to the straight on the board. But what is concealed is the VALUE of your straight. You have a 10-high straight, and a villain may put you on a 9-high straight. Your 2/3 pot-size bet may be interpreted that way, or it may be interpreted as an attempt to buy the pot in case nobody has the straight.

But now the river comes and you make your backdoor flush. At this point, your hand is totally concealed. If anyone else has a straight, even with JT, they are calling you. They may also be calling you with a set or two pair. Your half-the-pot bet tells them nothing about your hand.

This is an almost dream scenario, to have callers on a board where you have a much better hand than the villains are likely to put you on.

It's an interesting scenario, sure, but it ultimately doesn't really factor here unless the guy has TJ, right?. On the flop is where the concealed hand remained concealed, and after that the guy can either beat a 9-high straight (with TJ) or he can't, in which case it doesn't matter that the flush is also concealed. With the read that was given, I don't see this guy calling the river bet with 2-pair or a set; he either has TJ and is definitely calling, or is throwing away probably any other hand.

Either way, I agree that it was well played.

How about T6? Is he throwing that away? 6x?

For what it's worth, he folded to my river bet.

so he couldn't beat a straight or a flush... interesting, probably had A/9 !!!! lolol