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ATs against nitty reg and AA hand

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Sasquach991

08-03-2010, 05:36 AM Post subject: ATs against nitty reg and AA hand

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2008

Location: Rat Cheer

Posts: 1,012

No idea what range to put him on for turn and river?
The plan was to play an effin hand as I was card dead all night.
The real plan was 2pair, str8 draw or at least hit a FD. I planned to get to sd with TP. If turn Ten didn't come I was just trying to get to SD.

I'm getting sick of this shit. Do I have to fold every hand on the damn river?

$0.10/$0.25 No Limit Holdem
8 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com
10/8/3 over 3k
5% 3bet

Stacks:
UTG ($25)
UTG+1 ($43.54)
MP1 ($30.26)
Hero ($26.30)
CO ($29.11)
BTN ($49.96)
SB ($21.79)
BB ($25)

Pre-Flop: ($0.35, 8 players) Hero is MP2

1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $1, 1 fold, Hero calls $1, 2 folds, SB calls $0.90, 1 fold

Flop:

($3.25, 3 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero checks

Turn:

($3.25, 3 players)
SB checks, UTG+1 bets $2, Hero raises to $5, SB calls $5, UTG+1 folds

River:

($15.25, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $5, SB goes all-in $15.79, $10.79 to Hero ($15.3)?

Trying to value bet this one and trying to play an effin hand too...

$0.10/$0.25 No Limit Holdem
8 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com
16/10/1.7 over 200
2% 3bet

Stacks:
UTG ($39.39)
UTG+1 ($25.35)
Hero ($25.35)
MP2 ($25.31)
CO ($23.87)
BTN ($25)
SB ($26.58)
BB ($24.30)

Pre-Flop: ($0.35, 8 players) Hero is MP1
2 folds, Hero raises to $1, 3 folds, SB calls $0.90, 1 fold

Flop: ($2.25, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $1.50, SB calls $1.50

Turn: ($5.25, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $3.50, SB calls $3.50

River: ($12.25, 2 players)
SB bets $12.75, $12.75 to Hero ($19.35)?

One more for the hell of it

$0.10/$0.25 No Limit Holdem
8 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com
50/10/0.9 over 20
17% 3bet

Stacks:
UTG ($4.65)
UTG+1 ($11.45)
Hero ($12.50)
MP2 ($4.35)
CO ($13.52)
BTN ($16.52)
SB ($14)
BB ($4.75)

Pre-Flop: ($0.35, 8 players) Hero is MP1
2 folds, Hero raises to $1, 3 folds, SB calls $0.90, 1 fold

Flop: ($2.25, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $2, SB calls $2

Turn: ($6.25, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $4, SB calls $4

River: ($14.25, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero ($5.5)?

"Just cause I'm from the South don't mean I ain't got no book learnin'"

Quote:

Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla

...we've all learned long ago how to share the truth without actually having the truth.

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!Luck

08-03-2010, 05:52 AM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Feb 2004

Location: Under a bridge

Posts: 1,367

Hand #1 auto fold pre? Sucks on the river, but his range consist almost entirely of pocket pairs that boated. Unless you think he can do this with jj-qq and some random bluff.

Hand #2 meh. seems like a fold to me. But his range seems very narrow, like AJ or maybe QJ, but he seems to tight to have QJ in his blind defense range.

Hand #3 Shove

spoonitnow

08-03-2010, 06:55 AM

#3 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: IRC Chat Room

Posts: 5,406

{Moved from BC}

With permanent redirect.

Just sayin.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ripptyde

I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.

Rule # 1: don't ask questions

Rule # 2: don't ask questions

I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.

surviva316

08-03-2010, 01:47 PM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Feb 2009

Location: Confusing people with my liberal biblicisms

Posts: 1,625

surviva316 will become famous soon enough

hand 1: fold pre. only reason i'd flat is if there's a big fish left to act (especially if said fish is in the blinds), and i think the reg is gonna play straight forward in a 3-way pot

as played, raise turn bigger so you don't have to PSB shove the river which looks super strong.

as played, betting this size/folding doesn't really make that much sense to me. i would only bet this size to induce (ie, b/c). i think we can value bet a normal size here because the only hand we're worried about is 77 (MAYBE 22), and this is a really weird way to play 77 on this board. even if he only calls with AA, we have <50% equity. fwiw, we also have the very very tippity top of our value range in a spot where we may bluff, so if balance means anything then we should be snap vbetting a sensible size here.

as played, call. again, he's only repping 77 and maybe 22 and it's a really weird way to play a flopped set. not exactly sure what worse he would play this way, but surely JTs/AKhh makes as much sense as checking the flop and bet/calling a tiny raise on the turn when we have a ton of draws in our range with a flopped set

hand 2: !Luck, villain is 16/10 which is a huge VPIP/PFR split, so he has all sorts of J's in his range. i don't expect villain to ever donk this huge with something like AQ, and it's a weird line to take as a bluff when 1) the J strengthens our range like woah and 2) we have every nut hand in our range. seems liek a pretty standard fold really.

hand 3: obv the second worst card in the deck, but it's still a shove. why you 1/2 stackin' dawg?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BooG690

I just wanted to share singing vaginas.

Sasquach991

08-03-2010, 02:19 PM

#5 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2008

Location: Rat Cheer

Posts: 1,012

Why the redirect?

I was tilted but are these coolers?

If so, then I feel better.

I'll look at the responses in more detail later.

Sasquach991

08-03-2010, 02:44 PM

#6 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2008

Location: Rat Cheer

Posts: 1,012

Hand 1: Yeah, prob a fold pre. I had played 25 hands and not vpip'ed yet. Like I said, card dead. The only hand that made sense to me for villian to have was 77. Small river bet was to induce a shove. Since this was moved to Tilt section, I'm showing villians hand

Villian had:
77

Hand 2: I didn't really think a J was in villians range and it wasn't. I still cannot fold AA unless it's obvious (4 flush board, obvious str8).

Villian had:
QQ

Hand 3: half stackin was hoping villian would raise but then again he's not aggro, luckily.

Villian had:
AK

surviva316

08-03-2010, 02:57 PM

#7 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Feb 2009

Location: Confusing people with my liberal biblicisms

Posts: 1,625

spoon moved it for phrases like "played ATs 'cause i was friggin card dead," "getting sick of this shit," and of course "do i have to fold every hand on the damn river?"

didn't bother to check if those were exact quotes, but you get the point. the fact that you called and were beat in all 3 hands prolly supports spoon's decision

Quote:

Originally Posted by BooG690

I just wanted to share singing vaginas.

!Luck

08-03-2010, 05:40 PM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Feb 2004

Location: Under a bridge

Posts: 1,367

I found that it is good to post both winning and losing hands. Because, if after a while we figure out that you only post when you lose, you might as well post the results, which would end up giving you bias replies.

Also, and don't take this the wrong way. I think you are trying too hard. Just step back relax. Maybe take a day or 7 off. Cause you are getting into the mindset that you deserve to win. If you continue to think like that you'll end up like me.... back at 2nl. This is a life long game, why frustrate yourself like this?

surviva316

08-03-2010, 05:56 PM

#9 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Feb 2009

Location: Confusing people with my liberal biblicisms

Posts: 1,625

me+luck+sasquatch=25nl FR sweat sometime in near future?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BooG690

I just wanted to share singing vaginas.

spoonitnow

08-03-2010, 06:33 PM

#10 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: IRC Chat Room

Posts: 5,406

I think you know why I moved this here, but I did the permanent re-direct anyway so it looks like it's in the BC where you posted it.

Hand 1: Fold pre. I think you know better than this, but did it anyway. There's a 4-letter word that could cause this. As played, what's up with the river bet sizing?

Hand 2: Flop bet size should probably be bigger. You aren't changing how he plays his range much by betting $1.50 instead of say $2.00. On the turn it's a little different, and I think the bet-size (as a % of the pot) might be more appropriate if you think he'll have a hard time coming along with bare Jacks. The river is pretty much an easy fold. He's not going to be betting non-Jx hands often enough for this to be a +EV call.

Hand 3: Pre-flop bet size could be smaller, that is if you decide to play this so far out of position at all. Flop bet size is good because he's probably not folding much of anything he would call with if you bet $1.50. Turn bet size is kind of tricky because of the SPR, but $4 seems about right. On the river I think this is a shove all day every day and twice on Sunday and it's not even close.

Basically on the tilt theme, I think you did a lot of weird stuff in these three hands that you wouldn't do normally.

spoonitnow

08-03-2010, 06:39 PM

#11 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: IRC Chat Room

Posts: 5,406

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sasquach991

I just read that in hand 2 that you didn't think Jx was in his range. I think that's the majority of his range after his river play. Sooooo what's the deal.

Sasquach991

08-03-2010, 08:16 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2008

Location: Rat Cheer

Posts: 1,012

@spoon
I do know better than the ATs and T9s hands and spew is the best phrase to describe my play. So I guess J's are in his range here? Would he call the turn bet with Jx? Obviously if he had QJ I guess but what about KJ, AJ?

"I think you did a lot of weird stuff in these three hands that you wouldn't do normally."

^this, esp the ATs and T9s hands. The AA hand I played pretty much the way I always play it. I just though that maybe once I wouldn't get sucked out on.

@Luck
biggest winning hand of the session was $8. AA, 2/3 cbet, 2/3 cbet, villian folds. Most were like this. I'm winning small pots with big hands and losing big pots with so so hands on wet boards.

"I think you are trying too hard. Just step back relax. Maybe take a day or 7 off. Cause you are getting into the mindset that you deserve to win. If you continue to think like that you'll end up like me.... "

^this. That's what my wife told me (which is sad) both the trying too hard and the deserving to win part. Daven essentially told me the same thing the other night in IRC. I keep waiting for things to turn around but it's nowhere in sight. Dropped almost 8 BI's in July and that assuming I play in 100bb games exclusively which I don't. I've tried dropping tables, adding tables, and somewhere in between. I was down a BI last night when these hands happened and the first 2 were within 4 hands of each other. Prob the main reason for the masive tilt. This is the first time I've had major tilt in quite a while. I think it's the "deserve" thing mostly.

@surviva
"me+luck+sasquatch=25nl FR sweat sometime in near future?"

I'm definitely up for this but maybe I should take a break for a day or so. I would like to do it in the next week or so as my son starts back to school Monday and I won't have as much free time as I do now.

I was thinking of doing a hand history review video and posting it in my op. I reviewed hands for about an hour last night before starting my session so I thought I was in the right mindset. Maybe I thought I deserved to win because I did the review.

I would like to take the rest of the discussion to my OP if possible and get it out of the tilt forum if Mr. Spoon would oblige me.

I posted a tilt hand in this forum a while back and said I would never do it again. Then spoon forced this on me.

/rant

Operation-Once A Week Is Plenty

Monsieur_chat

08-05-2010, 11:53 PM

#13 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Dec 2008

Location: London

Posts: 254

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sasquach991

I posted a tilt hand in this forum a while back and said I would never do it again. Then I brought this on myself

FYP.

And I say that with nothing but empathy. I've been through the same cycle.

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