Sitngo losing streak

Patience Patience Patience Patience

Variance is part of the game. I would continue to do whatever it was that got your BR up to 600 plus. Tight early is always good....look at the other players. See who you can make a play on.....

I just came off a bad run....out of the money in about 20/22.

There are some great threads here that deal with variance and what you can do to break out of it. Maybe drop down to the $5 or $10's again and get a few money places to build confidence.

I find when I play with confidence everything works better.

GL....

Ok, ill keep that in mind. I don't think my play is that bad, but when i was on a winning streak it was like I couldn't lose. Maybe I'll play some ring games for a bit and go back to sitngos. I also checked out my streak, lost 22/26 and the 4 ITM's were 3 third place finishes and 1 2nd place. With one streak of 11 lost in a row.

I just played a sitngo after posting this and the second hand I played had KK , hit my set and bet out. Got reraised and we ended up both all in. He had a set of 5's and hit quads on the river. Its like the software is out to get me.

Originally Posted by sk8r_daniel

I don't think my play is that bad.

this is a leak.

seriously you probably do suck, such a downswing is possible and since its your first few posts here id say you probably havent ever studied the game.

Sounds to me like you've lost you "rythm" (for lack of a better way to describe it). I 'd been spending my playing time doing 5$/10$ SnGs on Stars with reasonable success. I was by no means an expert but I had a style that was consistently doing well for me. After that summer I didn't play much with university demands taking up alot of my time. Now I'm working my way back at the game and need to rediscover that comfortable system. When in rythm I would find I would know what moves I was making and why I was making them. As a result I was more confident playing pots and being apropriately aggresive at later stages in the SnG. Finally, i'd be in a good state of mind so if on the 2nd one of the day AA got cracked by A7, then I lose the next hand to runner-runner busting me out, I could just play more without doubting myself and being on tilt.

To summerize: You've got leaks, we all do and its always good to work on them. That being said if you did have a system that was working well and you felt comfortable with it, try and redescover that. It might get you back in the confident midset...while likely plugging leaks you didn't even notice. Good luck with it.

Originally Posted by Da GOAT

seriously you probably do suck, such a downswing is possible and since its your first few posts here id say you probably havent ever studied the game.

what do you do when "studying the game"? out of curiousity

As a rule, it is always safer to assume you have major room for improvement until you prove to yourself otherwise.

99% of the players on this forum have yet to prove that, if they're being honest with themselves.

How are you losing?
100% suckouts like this one:

=====
No Limit Texas Holdem ($100/$200 NL)
Table UB - Low Buy-in
April 23, 2007 - 04:35:30 (GMT)

1} Jack Sawyer $3,545 As 6s
2) Jack Pott $3,640 Kh Kc
3) Zeno $2,135 9s 5h
4) Megan * $1,730 3d Qd
7) Harmony $2,165 7s Jh
10) Oliver Chips $1,785 6c Js

Harmony posts small blind $100
Oliver Chips posts big blind $200
Jack Sawyer raises $500
Jack Pott calls $700
Zeno folds
Megan folds
Harmony folds
Oliver Chips folds

FLOP: 2s Ah 5s
Jack Sawyer checks
Jack Pott bets $600
Jack Sawyer raises $2,245 (all-in)
Jack Pott calls $2,245
Jack Sawyer shows As 6s
Jack Pott shows Kh Kc

TURN: 2s Ah 5s 3h

RIVER: 2s Ah 5s 3h Kd

Jack Pott wins $7,390 with Three of a Kind, Kings
=======
If its suckouts, be happy you got your money in when you really had the best hand, and blame lady luck (a.k.a. damned, evil variance) for your losses.

Or are you getting outplayed? Like Teddy KGB did to Mike McD in the opening scene of Rounders? If you are getting outplayed, revise your game from the button up. There is no specific formula for winning in a SnG, you need to develop a keen eye and a feel for the game.

Are you going allin with AA, KK, QQ, JJ, TT etc. every time you get them? Remember, if these are a 5 to 1 favourite, they are expected to lose once every 6 hands. No two cards are invincible in holdem, nor are no two cards totally crappy. Expect the bad beat, but be sure to somehow cover the one who will be dishing it out to soften the blow. If not, tuff luck, rebuy (in a brand new one) and try again.

Also try not getting too many chips in unless you are sure you have your opponent beat. This is an indescribable feeling, but you'll know when you've had some mileage.

My 2 cents, as always, not very smart, but sure flashy!

I haven't lost a SNG in almost 4 months.

Originally Posted by DaNutsInYoEye

I haven't lost a SNG in almost 4 months.

teach me

Originally Posted by Fortune 500

99% of the players on this forum have yet to prove that, if they're being honest with themselves.

99% of the other 1% are lying. None of us are Phil Ivey or even Greg Raymer. There's always improvements to make. For instance, I'm convinced that to the uber-balla-SnG-Masta, tight-is-right-early is wrong. I'm not uber enough to abandon the concept yet though. Give me 6 months of working on cash play and I'll check back.

Originally Posted by DaNutsInYoEye

I haven't lost a SNG in almost 4 months.

Playing 1 a month are we? I'm half-joking; I did have one month with 100% ITM.

Still, are you playing enough for that to sound as awesome as it does? If so, where?

Originally Posted by Bidip

How are you losing?
100% suckouts like this one:

=====
No Limit Texas Holdem ($100/$200 NL)
Table UB - Low Buy-in
April 23, 2007 - 04:35:30 (GMT)

1} Jack Sawyer $3,545 As 6s
2) Jack Pott $3,640 Kh Kc
3) Zeno $2,135 9s 5h
4) Megan * $1,730 3d Qd
7) Harmony $2,165 7s Jh
10) Oliver Chips $1,785 6c Js

Harmony posts small blind $100
Oliver Chips posts big blind $200
Jack Sawyer raises $500
Jack Pott calls $700
Zeno folds
Megan folds
Harmony folds
Oliver Chips folds

FLOP: 2s Ah 5s
Jack Sawyer checks
Jack Pott bets $600
Jack Sawyer raises $2,245 (all-in)
Jack Pott calls $2,245
Jack Sawyer shows As 6s
Jack Pott shows Kh Kc

TURN: 2s Ah 5s 3h

RIVER: 2s Ah 5s 3h Kd

Jack Pott wins $7,390 with Three of a Kind, Kings

Fold preflop. Why are you raising 3.5x BB from UTG on a 6-handed table with A6s? As played, I agree it was a bad suckout, he had 2 outs.

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

For instance, I'm convinced that to the uber-balla-SnG-Masta, tight-is-right-early is wrong. I'm not uber enough to abandon the concept yet though.

Can you elaborate a little on this? Or are you just throwing out a possible speculation? Not chastising, just curious at what you are saying.

Originally Posted by Roco415

Originally Posted by Da GOAT

seriously you probably do suck, such a downswing is possible and since its your first few posts here id say you probably havent ever studied the game.

what do you do when "studying the game"? out of curiousity

for SNGs or Cash??

i take you are asking about SNGs for now??

Ive read HoH 1&2 alot, cant even remember how many times. the covers are well worn. as are all the other books i got (got pelnty of books). I read a poker book for about 30-45 minutes a day coz i gotta go work that bit earlier to get parking so i read in the car which i dont mind doing.

First tool i got was SNGPT and i didnt multitable more than 6 tables ever before i switched to cash so i hand alot of time to review each and every HH.

I WAS very active i think in this forum before moving on.

THis all made me an average player. stopped playing at $16 turbos with some $27 turboes too

Originally Posted by Sprayed

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

For instance, I'm convinced that to the uber-balla-SnG-Masta, tight-is-right-early is wrong. I'm not uber enough to abandon the concept yet though.

Can you elaborate a little on this? Or are you just throwing out a possible speculation? Not chastising, just curious at what you are saying.

Not to steal JGB's thunder, but I'd say that this is because at high levels most players understand push/fold ICM very well, so you need to find an edge another way to beat the rake. If all the other players are playing super tight, then lagging it up a bit early in the game could be a way to gain this edge IF you are good at (relatively) deep stacked postflop play.

Originally Posted by taipan168

Originally Posted by Sprayed

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

For instance, I'm convinced that to the uber-balla-SnG-Masta, tight-is-right-early is wrong. I'm not uber enough to abandon the concept yet though.

Can you elaborate a little on this? Or are you just throwing out a possible speculation? Not chastising, just curious at what you are saying.

Not to steal JGB's thunder, but I'd say that this is because at high levels most players understand push/fold ICM very well, so you need to find an edge another way to beat the rake. If all the other players are playing super tight, then lagging it up a bit early in the game could be a way to gain this edge IF you are good at (relatively) deep stacked postflop play.

Right, I figured as much if this is what he means. However, I have been watching some PXF SNG vids of sheets, inissint, and bax. These videos that they have done are for $225 and up. They have done a couple $1k SNGs as well. Their play doesn't really change that much. Not to mention the very bad players that still exist even at these levels.

According to these fine players, they suggest that you really don't play that different from the lower buy-ins. Yes, you adjust your calling/pushing ranges when playing against other well known players, but the early game is really not that different.

They rely heavily on making it to the bubble and playing correct bubble play. This they say is the key to moneying and winning SNGs.

i agree sprayed, having looked at some CR SNG vids that bored the shit out of me

Originally Posted by taipan168

Originally Posted by Sprayed

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

For instance, I'm convinced that to the uber-balla-SnG-Masta, tight-is-right-early is wrong. I'm not uber enough to abandon the concept yet though.

Can you elaborate a little on this? Or are you just throwing out a possible speculation? Not chastising, just curious at what you are saying.

Not to steal JGB's thunder, but I'd say that this is because at high levels most players understand push/fold ICM very well, so you need to find an edge another way to beat the rake. If all the other players are playing super tight, then lagging it up a bit early in the game could be a way to gain this edge IF you are good at (relatively) deep stacked postflop play.

This is actually why they are beatable, not to mention the play isn't as impressive as you make it out to be.

What tai said is mostly right. Maybe I've just faced some tougher-than-standard $200 tables, but most of the handful I've played were enough to make me question my edge.

And FWIW, I've seen a few video's of Bax playing some nice small ball poker in higher level SnGs.

I think that finding the right spots to pick up chips early in all tournaments (sure, live MTTs more than online MTTs and online MTTs more than SnGs, but true for all varieties on some level) can provide an extra edge. It's tricky because we're all used to playing our FE, and part of small ball (I think) is playing situations where FE is relatively minimal - you're just finding spots that minimal FE is enough.

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

What tai said is mostly right. Maybe I've just faced some tougher-than-standard $200 tables, but most of the handful I've played were enough to make me question my edge.

And FWIW, I've seen a few video's of Bax playing some nice small ball poker in higher level SnGs.

I think that finding the right spots to pick up chips early in all tournaments (sure, live MTTs more than online MTTs and online MTTs more than SnGs, but true for all varieties on some level) can provide an extra edge. It's tricky because we're all used to playing our FE, and part of small ball (I think) is playing situations where FE is relatively minimal - you're just finding spots that minimal FE is enough.

Isn't this why they are beatable? People make horrible plays everywhere. I think it's the buy-in that is intimidating and you may already assume everyone there plays perfect sngs.

Originally Posted by K2 the ArmA

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

What tai said is mostly right. Maybe I've just faced some tougher-than-standard $200 tables, but most of the handful I've played were enough to make me question my edge.

And FWIW, I've seen a few video's of Bax playing some nice small ball poker in higher level SnGs.

I think that finding the right spots to pick up chips early in all tournaments (sure, live MTTs more than online MTTs and online MTTs more than SnGs, but true for all varieties on some level) can provide an extra edge. It's tricky because we're all used to playing our FE, and part of small ball (I think) is playing situations where FE is relatively minimal - you're just finding spots that minimal FE is enough.

Isn't this why they are beatable? People make horrible plays everywhere. I think it's the buy-in that is intimidating and you may already assume everyone there plays perfect sngs.

Isn't the fact that people make horrible plays every why they are beatable? Sure. But I don't want to beat the game for a 5% ROI. That's, frankly, not worth my time. I want to crush it. Given what I've seen so far, I think I need a stronger edge than I currently have to do that above the $100 level. I think adding this element to my game would provide some of that, especially against players that I see a lot of (as I've had much more repeated run-ins in higher buyin tables).

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

Originally Posted by K2 the ArmA

Originally Posted by JeffreyGB

What tai said is mostly right. Maybe I've just faced some tougher-than-standard $200 tables, but most of the handful I've played were enough to make me question my edge.

And FWIW, I've seen a few video's of Bax playing some nice small ball poker in higher level SnGs.

I think that finding the right spots to pick up chips early in all tournaments (sure, live MTTs more than online MTTs and online MTTs more than SnGs, but true for all varieties on some level) can provide an extra edge. It's tricky because we're all used to playing our FE, and part of small ball (I think) is playing situations where FE is relatively minimal - you're just finding spots that minimal FE is enough.

Isn't this why they are beatable? People make horrible plays everywhere. I think it's the buy-in that is intimidating and you may already assume everyone there plays perfect sngs.

Isn't the fact that people make horrible plays every why they are beatable? Sure. But I don't want to beat the game for a 5% ROI. That's, frankly, not worth my time. I want to crush it. Given what I've seen so far, I think I need a stronger edge than I currently have to do that above the $100 level. I think adding this element to my game would provide some of that, especially against players that I see a lot of (as I've had much more repeated run-ins in higher buyin tables).

Sounds like you're trying to read players better and make proper plays against them accordingly? Me too - hard stuff. I think 10% roi at the higher levels is near-crushing number if you're playing a lot of sngs... You could always single table.

Originally Posted by taipan168

Originally Posted by Bidip

How are you losing?
100% suckouts like this one:

=====
No Limit Texas Holdem ($100/$200 NL)
Table UB - Low Buy-in
April 23, 2007 - 04:35:30 (GMT)

1} Jack Sawyer $3,545 As 6s
2) Jack Pott $3,640 Kh Kc
3) Zeno $2,135 9s 5h
4) Megan * $1,730 3d Qd
7) Harmony $2,165 7s Jh
10) Oliver Chips $1,785 6c Js

Harmony posts small blind $100
Oliver Chips posts big blind $200
Jack Sawyer raises $500
Jack Pott calls $700
Zeno folds
Megan folds
Harmony folds
Oliver Chips folds

FLOP: 2s Ah 5s
Jack Sawyer checks
Jack Pott bets $600
Jack Sawyer raises $2,245 (all-in)
Jack Pott calls $2,245
Jack Sawyer shows As 6s
Jack Pott shows Kh Kc

TURN: 2s Ah 5s 3h

RIVER: 2s Ah 5s 3h Kd

Jack Pott wins $7,390 with Three of a Kind, Kings

Fold preflop. Why are you raising 3.5x BB from UTG on a 6-handed table with A6s? As played, I agree it was a bad suckout, he had 2 outs.

1 miserable out. Ks gives me the nut flush.

The only card in the whole board to save him, was the Kd. And that's just what he got on the river.
I'm definitely not angry, however. It has to happen 1 in 46 times, therefore the other 45 times in that situation I'll probably win.

Originally Posted by taipan168

Why are you raising 3.5x BB from UTG on a 6-handed table with A6s?

I sometimes do such plays to throw people off. I had chips to throw around.

Your not throwing anybody off by raising a6 utg. A sng isnt long enough to need to mix it up, and the players arent paying enough attention in the first place.

Originally Posted by Bidip

Originally Posted by taipan168

Fold preflop. Why are you raising 3.5x BB from UTG on a 6-handed table with A6s? As played, I agree it was a bad suckout, he had 2 outs.

1 miserable out. Ks gives me the nut flush.

Ah yes, it did too, bad on me for not reading the board carefully enough

Originally Posted by Bidip

Originally Posted by taipan168

Why are you raising 3.5x BB from UTG on a 6-handed table with A6s?

I sometimes do such plays to throw people off. I had chips to throw around.

As dsmrolla said, it's not worth it. You really need to be preserving your chips early, and raising from UTG when blinds are so low at low buyin SNGs just invites lots of players to call after you leaving you OOP with a marginal hand on the flop even if you do hit an A.