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believe him and fold? or push?

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konahead

12-29-2005, 05:46 PM Post subject: believe him and fold? or push?

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: san fernando valley

Posts: 945

2nd hand at this table. Tourney chip leader is in bb. 2xbb preflop by other player took down blinds last hand so min-raised to ensure action. Checked flop since it was fairly harmless, assuming opp called with a value hand.

Do you believe him and fold, or push? (I don't think calling is a good option.)

#Game No : 3280199343
***** Hand History for Game 3280199343 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:18702232 Level:8 Blinds (150/300) - Thursday, December 29, 13:20:33 EDT 2005
Table Multi Table(553765) Table #10 (Real Money)
Seat 6 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: garypmoss ( $290 )
Seat 2: konahead ( $6887 )
Seat 3: tz1111 ( $6470 )
Seat 4: force999 ( $5770 )
Seat 5: indrick05 ( $9634 )
Seat 6: TomNY123 ( $9076 )
Seat 7: detached1 ( $6452 )
Seat 8: sloopjockey ( $15618 )
Seat 9: ezedie ( $4675 )
Seat 10: justhitmyset ( $11361 )
Trny:18702232 Level:8
Blinds (150/300)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to konahead [ As Ad ]
ezedie folds.
justhitmyset folds.
garypmoss folds.
konahead raises [600].
tz1111 folds.
force999 folds.
indrick05 folds.
TomNY123 folds.
detached1 folds.
sloopjockey calls [300].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 5h, Jc, 2d ]
sloopjockey checks.
konahead checks.
** Dealing Turn ** [ Jd ]
force999: A5 NUTS
sloopjockey bets [800].
konahead raises [1600].
sloopjockey raises [3000].
konahead ??????

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Easy17

12-29-2005, 06:30 PM Post subject: read

#2 (permalink)

Join Date: Dec 2005

Posts: 78

i guess depends on your read - sorry i know that answer sucks but

i would lean towards folding with the second J on the board. I would usually only make this push if i had a good read that the guy was bluffing.

hmm yeah i dont know, his smallish bet on the turn Jack and then coming over the top kinda smells like a bluff/steal but all the same unless i had a really good read i would fold.

ZenOffsuit

12-29-2005, 07:15 PM

#3 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Apr 2005

Location: Reading, ma

Posts: 293

If he had a J, woudn't he have bet out on that flop? I would lean more to a possible set. Typical call of a pre-flop raise w/ a small pair.
But, reads are important on determining this. What do you think he thinks of you as a player?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprayed

When are you going to write the ultimate johnny_fish strategy manual? I'm tired of seeing your wins and then cleaning my shorts.

konahead

12-29-2005, 07:27 PM

#4 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: san fernando valley

Posts: 945

again, this was the 2nd hand at this table - I had just moved there...

WildBobAA

12-29-2005, 07:36 PM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2005

Location: lol i dunno

Posts: 1,811

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenOffsuit

He might have been waiting to check raise.

ZenOffsuit

12-29-2005, 08:49 PM

#6 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Apr 2005

Location: Reading, ma

Posts: 293

Yes, but with what? Lets say he called w/ A/J or K/Js
He isn't going to wait to check raise that flop is he? That is why I dont think he is holding a Jack but probably flopped a set....

What do you think he may hold that he would check raise here?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprayed

When are you going to write the ultimate johnny_fish strategy manual? I'm tired of seeing your wins and then cleaning my shorts.

drmcboy

12-31-2005, 02:39 AM

#7 (permalink)

DrButtInski
Administrator

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 9,601

slow playing second hand of the table... gets you here. WIth you checking the flop he may think ANY PP is good.

Your play is designed to make him think he has the best hand. He thinks it.

12-31-2005, 03:43 AM

#8 (permalink)

Guest

Posts: n/a

{This post has been removed}

lambchopdc

12-31-2005, 11:06 PM

#9 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jul 2005

Posts: 350

Ok....this info needs to start being included in all hand history posts....and yes is does matter.

Site? (By the HH i can tell this is party)
Buyin? (This info is needed.)
Type of tourney? (Obviously a FO this time by the stack sizes)
Tourney Start Time (EST)? (By the time on the hand I'm guessing this was a Noon tourney.)

Believe it or not i can't even respond with any ideas without this info.

I'll say more when I know the buyin level, but already I can say....giving free turn cards when you didn't improve (No set) on the flop is -EV. Bet the flop for info.

Sprayed

01-01-2006, 12:07 AM

#10 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Nov 2005

Location: GO BUCKS!

Posts: 3,057

Kone you gotta bet the flop. Don't slow play AA. If you take it down on the flop that's cool.

01-01-2006, 01:11 AM

#11 (permalink)

Guest

Posts: n/a

He has a mid pocket pair that he feels has turned to gold since the board paired, giving you less chance of holding the jack.

Therefore, I push and hope for a call.

outphase

01-01-2006, 08:16 AM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Apr 2005

Posts: 949

What's up with all the minimum bets/raises?

Quote:

Originally Posted by lambchopdc

Lets stop talking ABC poker and move on to D, E, and F.

THaC

01-01-2006, 03:27 PM

#13 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: Carey, Ohio

Posts: 389

That's what minraising preflop will do. You leave him open to any pocket pair. He doesn't have a Jack, or he would've bet the flop. Why did you check behind him?! That killed it, you showed weakness, he picked up on it. Bet harder preflop, and hard on flop.

Miffed22001

01-01-2006, 03:41 PM

#14 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!

Posts: 8,181

Im covering rippys line
He bets if he has the jack, he cant expect you to have hit that. Being check raises while holding the jack isnt so bad as it looks. Id have bet here anyway on the flop. Id have cold called the turn and called the river providing it wasnt a daft amount. I think this is far too aggressive to be a jack. Opp puts you on nothing and therefore thinks he can buy it so long as he has something on the flop. Cold calling the turn gives him something to think about if he doesnt have the jack. Then he has to make a choice oop how he plays the river. A very tough choice

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believe him and fold? or push?

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