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Bad call?

  
 
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arkana
Old 06-28-2005, 10:05 AM     Post subject: Bad call? #1 (permalink)  
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The reason I didnt reraise preflop was that everyone had pretty much folded and I felt that isolation had been achieved (ok ok i wanted to slowplay).

I just dont understand his all in on the flop!??! I thought he might have QQ or maybe top pair with a flush draw. I just dont understand this play with top set. Sure you want to protect against the flush draw but why not just reraise? Did he put me on a strong hand because I led out on the flop and therefore he was sure I would call?

PokerStars Game #1983992088: Tournament #9360980, Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2005/06/27 - 14:41:49 (ET)
Table '9360980 41' Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: guavito (1700 in chips)
Seat 2: jim7777 (2730 in chips)
Seat 3: aplaya07 (2970 in chips)
Seat 4: mozart (1460 in chips)
Seat 5: MrNoPulp (910 in chips)
Seat 6: BRichards (860 in chips)
Seat 7: ItsMyWorld (1630 in chips)
Seat 8: arkana (3050 in chips)
Seat 9: cernig (1960 in chips) is sitting out
arkana: posts small blind 10
cernig: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to arkana [Ac Ad]
guavito: folds
jim7777: calls 20
aplaya07: folds
mozart: raises 60 to 80
MrNoPulp: folds
BRichards: folds
ItsMyWorld: folds
arkana: calls 70
cernig: folds
jim7777: calls 60
*** FLOP *** [5c Jh 2c]
arkana: bets 120
jim7777: calls 120
mozart: raises 1260 to 1380 and is all-in
arkana: calls 1260
jim7777: folds
*** TURN *** [5c Jh 2c] [9c]
*** RIVER *** [5c Jh 2c 9c] [2d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
arkana: shows [Ac Ad] (two pair, Aces and Deuces)
mozart: shows [Jc Js] (a full house, Jacks full of Deuces)
mozart collected 3140 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 3140 | Rake 0
Board [5c Jh 2c 9c 2d]
Seat 1: guavito folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: jim7777 folded on the Flop
Seat 3: aplaya07 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: mozart showed [Jc Js] and won (3140) with a full house, Jacks full of Deuces
Seat 5: MrNoPulp folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: BRichards folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: ItsMyWorld (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: arkana (small blind) showed [Ac Ad] and lost with two pair, Aces and Deuces
Seat 9: cernig (big blind) folded before Flop
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lovemachine
Old 06-29-2005, 07:50 AM #2 (permalink)  
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always reraise preflop with such low blinds
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DWDuck
Old 06-29-2005, 12:54 PM #3 (permalink)  
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With a preflop raiser, I'd definately want to get a bit more money in preflop... But honestly, I don't think you're escaping here. KK, QQ and sometimes TT, AJ will make this play. Even if you had reraised him preflop you're likely doubling him up here.

Darkwing
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drmcboy
Old 06-29-2005, 01:05 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 yeah, raise pre flop, then go broke anyway.

I would guess with you leading out and a call in front he figured someone had TP or better and would be unable to get away. If he makes a smaller play maybe the flush draw sticks around with tasty pot odds.... also if the flush gets there, even if you don't have it, it may kill his action from the TP/overpair/lower set.
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DimitriT
Old 06-29-2005, 07:05 PM #5 (permalink)  
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I will never be the last caller with AA pre-flop. Just keep reraising it until your all in. Slowplay when they are done calling.

You are dead on that flop. Nothing you can do. He went allin in
case you had a flush draw.
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Toasty
Old 06-29-2005, 07:40 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Letting AA become 3-way is inviting bad-beats. Try to get it HU. As for your opp he probably decided there was enough in the pot to take down and not risk the flush landing. Also with a big bet and a caller he probably expected a call.

even if you re-raised pf sometimes you are going to lose even if you play the hand right (which you didn't).
Poker is all about the long long long long long long long term . . .
Barney's back . . . back again . . .
 
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gabe
Old 06-29-2005, 08:03 PM #7 (permalink)  
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i bump it up to 200 and play from tere
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Estrop
Old 06-29-2005, 08:26 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabe
i bump it up to 200 and play from tere
Or at least double his bet? I agree with Toasty, AA 3 way isn't nice. Not easy to get away from that hand as he could just as easily had KK/QQ. Also with such a large reraise, I wouldn't suspect JJ there more like an overpair or AJ.
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arkana
Old 06-29-2005, 08:36 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Ok I generally agree with the reraise preflop, but in this case I was in the SB and there was just the limper and the BB left to act behind me. If I reraised preflop I was declaring the strength of my hand, I thought by just calling I would get an extra continuation bet off the PF raiser. He had been playing very tight and I felt he would slow down to any sign of strength so thats the reason I didnt reraise preflop. Yes it was a risky play but I was expecting a 3 way flop at the worst and AA doesnt get outflopped that often vs 2 players (its not all in preflop so not 5 cards only 3 - I was planning on taking it down on the flop).

I wasnt necessarily dead on that flop DimitriT, he could have easily made that play with AT, QQ, or KK. I just dont understand his play with the set, but maybe its not that bad since he must have realised that the possibility of a flush draw is quite high when the second guy called.

This isnt my standard play but I do believe in mixing things up once in a while...
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Estrop
Old 06-29-2005, 08:44 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arkana
This isnt my standard play but I do believe in mixing things up once in a while...
Which is good, just so happens he caught. If the board came all rags, and he liked his hand he would probably of paid you off.
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Toasty
Old 06-30-2005, 06:55 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arkana
Yes it was a risky play
Nothing wrong with adding risk for more reward but you have to be more willing to let the big over pairs go post flop to heavy betting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arkana
This isnt my standard play but I do believe in mixing things up once in a while...
It's only worth doing if someone is going to notice, otherwise it's just wasting chips / $$. I prefer advertising, people remember being flashed good cards more easily than fancy play.
Poker is all about the long long long long long long long term . . .
Barney's back . . . back again . . .
 
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arkana
Old 06-30-2005, 07:34 PM #12 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toasty
Quote:
Originally Posted by arkana
Yes it was a risky play
Nothing wrong with adding risk for more reward but you have to be more willing to let the big over pairs go post flop to heavy betting.
I totally agree with that, except that the betting made me think I still had the best hand - thats what Im really getting at: do you fold your overpair to that push? To me it looked like TPTK or an overpair protecting against the flush. I am not used to people pushing all in with top set.
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drmcboy
Old 06-30-2005, 07:36 PM #13 (permalink)  
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 No way I'm folding to the push. That's poker.
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