Select Page
Poker Forum
Over 1,291,000 Posts!
Poker ForumTournament Poker

$6.50, turn 2 pair

Results 1 to 10 of 10
  1. #1

    Default $6.50, turn 2 pair

    Shove over turn, or flat and shove river?

    I just wondered at the time if he'd call the turn shove, but may think river looked more like a bluff. Pretty sure he had turned a queen and if he did (say with AQ,KQ,QJ) would he think about folding to shove over on turn.

    As played I wanted my hand to look as much like busted spade draw on river so figured shove was most +$EV play. Comments?

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $6.00+$0.50 Tournament, 75/150 Blinds (5 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

    UTG (t2780)
    MP (t4825)
    Button (t2110)
    SB (t1505)
    Hero (BB) (t2280)

    Hero's M: 10.13

    Preflop: Hero is BB with 2, Q
    UTG calls t150, 3 folds, Hero checks

    Flop: (t375) 3, 8, 2 (2 players)
    Hero checks, UTG checks

    Turn: (t375) Q (2 players)
    Hero bets t270, UTG raises to t540, Hero calls t270

    River: (t1455) 4 (2 players)
    Hero bets t1590 (All-In), UTG calls
    This is not my signature. I just write this at the bottom of every post.
  2. #2
    I don't like to get fancy here, if he does have one of the hands you mentioned I doubt he's folding if you shove over, and if he is semi-bluffing you give him a chance to hit. Thing is he might call a shove with a draw, I think there's a high likely hood he will with a Q.

    I think we're beat here a very low % of the time and there are plenty of hands villain will call a shove with, I lean towards shoving.


    Don't complain; Just work harder - Randy Pausch (The Last Lecture)
  3. #3
    Why minraise a draw on turn? Just always think of that play as buying free card, but he only needs to flat to see board in full
    This is not my signature. I just write this at the bottom of every post.
  4. #4
    fulksy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    1,412
    Location
    Edmonton,Canada
    i think theirs no possible way villian here is folding any of the hands you mentioned
  5. #5
    I like your line a lot but I think shoving the turn is fine, too.
    Playing big pots at small stakes.
  6. #6
    yah I think he has a Q like 85% of the time here, so the min raise really doesn't mean a draw usually... but I have seen it happen before, he is trying to represent a big hand.

    I thought about this hand a little more and have some questions:
    What do you do if the River falls a spade? If hes willing to call a shove when a spade falls its very likely he will call a shove on the turn. If he's not willing to call a shove when a spade hits on the river, then we've actually lost some value, because he may actually put you on a draw when shoving the turn and call with a Q.


    Don't complain; Just work harder - Randy Pausch (The Last Lecture)
  7. #7
    I shove over on the turn without a very very solid read that opp plays a set like this. If you shove over, most Qx hands that opp would be in the hand with would call your shove. A draw probably calls your shove too but unless he has two overs to go with his draw or something wacky like 54 spades he's getting pretty bad odds to call.
  8. #8
    I just worried that shoving over turn looks very strong but shoving (non spade) river looks weaker. A spade may kill me, but don't you think a shove over on turn looks more like a set from me?

    I ran half the time bank deciding whether or not to shove turn, and thought it would look weaker on river, then (after reading replies) I thought he'd call most bare Q's on turn, looking again now I think if I had Qx (a good queen), I'd be more wary of the turn shove than the river one so I'm back to liking my line.

    They're probably both positive expectation plays and the interesting question is which maximises EV
    This is not my signature. I just write this at the bottom of every post.
  9. #9
    Did you have a read/stats on him? Unless you know he makes retarded bluffs on the turn, he doesn't have anything he'll fold to a shove. Your line isn't repping a spade draw imo.
  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by gingerwizard
    I ran half the time bank deciding whether or not to shove turn, and thought it would look weaker on river, then (after reading replies) I thought he'd call most bare Q's on turn, looking again now I think if I had Qx (a good queen), I'd be more wary of the turn shove than the river one so I'm back to liking my line.
    The other issue that you have is that there are a lot of river cards that you don't want to see (8s, 3s, spades, maybe even Ts, Js, Ks and As if opp limped preflop with Q-broadway), but your line means that you are pretty much pot committed given how many of your chips you've put into the pot on the river even if those scare cards come. That's one of the reasons I would prefer to play this hand fast on the turn (plus I don't think that opp would ever fold a Qx hand that he would have limped preflop with (think QT, QJ, KQ). Plus if he's really bad, he'll call your turn shove with a FD but as you played it would obviously fold to your river shove if the draw did not come in.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •