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Numbr2intheWorld
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11-13-2009, 02:39 AM
Post subject: $33 rebuy final table, simple call spot
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#1 (permalink)
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,561
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This is actually a hand from a friend of mine and i didn't know what he should do:
Alright, i didnt have hud on but i this was the only tournament i was playing so i had pretty solid reads on everyone. Although he was the chipleader, villain in this hand was playing pretty snug. The player to his right was playing hyper aggro, raising every button and he had not shoved over his raise once. Also, this is the 2nd time he's opened.
I feel like any action here is justified, shoving, stop-n-going (one of the rare situations i think this is an alright play), even folding? If it makes a difference i felt i was the best player at the table and most were playing weak/passive.
No-Limit Hold'em, $16000.00 BB (6 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
CO ($269069)
Button ($186387)
SB ($214732)
Hero (BB) ($167564)
UTG ($487887)
MP ($828861)
Preflop: Hero is BB with 3 , 3
1 fold, MP bets $37500, 3 folds, Hero ????[/QUOTE]
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drmcboy
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DrButtInski
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 9,601
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I'd fold. it's hard for me to believe we have any fe
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revolvingiris
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,139
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Yeah, I agree with Dr. IMO a stop and go would be kind of tough being we aren't 100% sure what is in villains range. I mean yeah thats the point of a stop and go but if the board comes like AQx are we really going to feel comfortable open shoving into a tagg?
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baudib
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,233
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pretty standard fold imo.
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Playing big pots at small stakes.
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fjuanl
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,446
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This would be close with 77.
At first glance it seems like a bad spot for MP to be opening wide, but maybe he should? The others prob arent going to get it in wide, especially 180k and 160k stacks that know they have 0 fold equity.
Would it ever be optimal to raise/fold to those 10bb stacks?
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drmcboy
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DrButtInski
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 9,601
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my first instinct was that MP should probably just have open shoved but I guess it's probably worth it to see how the other table reacts to a raise or two. it also gives them a chance to call and fold the flop.
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mcatdog
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 3,654
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by drmcboy
I'd fold. it's hard for me to believe we have any fe
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by drmcboy
my first instinct was that MP should probably just have open shoved
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You aren't thinking deeply enough about MP's options with his entire range of hands IMO. He can profitably open shove at least 40% of hands here, and if he has a hand in that range (that isn't so strong that it's actually looking for action) then yes he probably should have open shoved. But, what if he has a total crap hand like 85o? Shoving is a losing play for him, but that doesn't mean he has to fold. All these short stacks will be playing pretty tight, a small raise planning on folding to any action would still be +EV most likely, given the description of how weakly the table was playing. I think it's definitely possible that we have some fold equity here.
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drmcboy
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DrButtInski
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 9,601
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but if he thinks that way why is this only the second pot he's opened? I feel like he either has the big hand or he has something like KT and wanted to give himself a chance to 'play some poker' but has resigned himself to calling at least our/BU shove.
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Numbr2intheWorld
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,561
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i agree that this is a good place to open wide for him. But, he had been gaining chips, not losing them. I doubt anyone here would feel the need to steal and with my reads on him i think it would be unlikely (not impossible). Idk maybe assign a 15% bluff range to him?
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chardrian
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I rarely,if ever, get pms
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,524
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meh - this is where reads matter. So often we start assuming that our opps actually realize things like stack sizes and how they "should" be playing, when they really have no idea.
how and how recently did villain get his stack?
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G2G
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 13
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The play i make is def going to be read based "villain in this hand was playing pretty snug" based on this limited info i probly do muck in this spot. I realize you only have circa 10 bbs but highly doubt you have any f/e vs this player with the size of his stack, calling your 3 bet shove and losing will change nothing for this player. He will still have the big stack and still be in great postion to win this tourney. While calling and winning here knocks another player out and gets the him closer to the goal of winning the tourney.
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