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|~|ypermegachi
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11-26-2004, 08:14 PM
Post subject: WLLH by Lee Jones vs. SSHE by Ed Miller
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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i just read through both books, and basically this is the difference:
WLLH - find a reason to fold
SSHE - find a reason to bet/raise
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xbones
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Isle of Man, GB
Posts: 264
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So which book would people reccommend most?
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YNWA
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koolmoe
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Drowning in prosperity
Posts: 1,279
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I have never read WLLH, but I highly recommend SSH.
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mike4066
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,943
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For someone who has never played holdem, WLLHE.
For someone who understands the mechanics of the game, SSHE.
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xbones
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Isle of Man, GB
Posts: 264
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OK, I've read WLLHE a couple of times, but thought what hyp said, that it seemed a bit weak at times, might give SSHE a look.
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YNWA
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bcauldwell
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Red Bank, NJ
Posts: 10
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I'm a noob at poker but I've been reading and re-reading the Lee Jones book and I think it's great. Of all the books I've read it's what has improved my game the most.
What's the full title of the Ed Miller book?
Does anyone else think the Hellmuth book is complete garbage?
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a500lbgorilla
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JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: This room is a good place to be
Posts: 8,379
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Yah, I read it. His NL/PL section is a joke. His limit game is section is alright. I guess it's a good first step if you're cracking into poker.
-'rilla
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Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
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mike4066
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,943
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by bcauldwell
What's the full title of the Ed Miller book?
Does anyone else think the Hellmuth book is complete garbage?
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Small Stakes Holdem
Winning Big With Expert Play
Hellmuth? I ebayed his book 2days after buying it.
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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playing marginal hands aggressively sets SSHE apart from the rest. i believe WLLH mentions somewhere in the postflop that if you don't have better than top pair on the flop it's not worth continuing. they do want you to play your flush and OES draws aggressively which is common to both books.
i don't think i found anywhere in WLLH to recommend checking to the button who bets, and you raise in the SB with a marginal hand to try and drive everyone out, but that's a recurring theme in SSHE.
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koolmoe
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Drowning in prosperity
Posts: 1,279
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by hypermegachi
i believe WLLH mentions somewhere in the postflop that if you don't have better than top pair on the flop it's not worth continuing. |
Anyone who understands the dynamics of small stakes games, especially B&M games, should recognize this as horrible advice. It is easy to construct an example where you would choose not to continue despite flopping top pair and situations where you would choose to check-raise with second pair.
The section in SSH on postflop play is easily one of the most valuable pieces of poker literature that I have ever read. The funny part is that when you play that way, learning how to properly value and protect your hand, your semi-skilled opponents will think you don't know what you're doing. Meanwhile, you're taking their money.
The SSH approach is not for the timid or under bankrolled player.
Interestingly, $5/$10 6max often plays like a SSH game, though a lot of online players don't consider that a "small stakes" game.
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xbones
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Isle of Man, GB
Posts: 264
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Well SSH can defo go on my xmas list, I think I need to be less timid.
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YNWA
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jbmagic
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 90
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if you read WLLH first, and then start reading SSH after..
do you forget what you read in WLLH and just follow what SSh says what to do? because i am sure the starting hands, etc fot each position will be different, etc..
thanks
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jbmagic
if you read WLLH first, and then start reading SSH after..
do you forget what you read in WLLH and just follow what SSh says what to do? because i am sure the starting hands, etc fot each position will be different, etc..
thanks |
don't forget...understand the material. know WHY each author is recommending what they are. know WHO the audience should be. the major breakthrough for me after reading SSH was not merely "doing the right thing" but added an extra level of thought "i am doing this BECAUSE..."
WLLH is simplistic by nature...its audience is mainly beginners. SSH is more advanced and goes beyond.
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astrodon
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Straight
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Eastern Oregon
Posts: 133
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Quote:
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Anyone who understands the dynamics of small stakes games, especially B&M games, should recognize this as horrible advice. It is easy to construct an example where you would choose not to continue despite flopping top pair and situations where you would choose to check-raise with second pair.
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This is of course, true. However, you had better get used to being beat up on the river a lot; particularly because of a lot of nimrods hanging on to a single face card to the bitter end just because it is a face card. Now this would be ok except the majority of the table is made up, seemingly, with these soon-to-be-broke and certain-to-remain-that-way, morons.
Additionally, the pair had better be in your hand. Another cliche' that is important to consider QUITE OFTEN is "no set - no bet".
Of course all of this depends on your feel for the table and its players.  Which is more to the point that was being made. You will most CERTAINLY play tighter in a SSLHE game than in almost any NLHE game.
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