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| Eric |
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I agreed to do the Part 3 Reading the Table questions today since zook is out. 1. Harrington says, Quote:
Do you agree? If not then list what else should be considered. 2. Harrington mentions 4 things to watch for when reading the table. Which do you feel is the most important and why? Quote:
3. We need to ask ourselves questions to determine our image. Harrington lists 3 questions, which do you think is the most important and why? Quote:
4. Do you multi-table when playing online? How much do you think this hurts in terms of reading the table? 5. Throughout online mtts players are moved from table to table frequently(sometimes more early on). Do you spend more time reading the table later in the tournament or are you fairly consistent? Do you concentrate more on reads at the final table? |
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| stormshelterdave |
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As no one else has replied, I might as well kick off. 1) In online situations I agree. However if you are playing live it doesn't matter how well you hide your betting patterns; if you cannot hide your physical tells you are not going to be a regular winner. 2) Pre-Flop: I would say A and then C. A to help determine what range of cards they might have. C to help me decide what to raise by. Flop: D will help in how to play the hand (should I check or raise). Turn/River: B - again this will help in how I play the hand... Are they likely to be a calling station and catch a lucky card? 3) For me they are almost equal (but thinking about my image is a new thing for me). 4) I do not multi-table enough to answer. 5) Again I do not FT MTTs enough to answer. However, before I get knocked out  , I do make as many notes as I can (you never know when you will meet them again).
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| zook |
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Great questions Eric. Little disappointed that there's only one reply... is HOH a bad choice for Book Club? Too straightforward? 16 people voted for it, and I wasn't one of them, so where is everybody??? 1. Online, I agree. And with the caliber of players Dan usually plays with live, it's probably true too. 2. I think B is the most important in terms of winning significant money from someone. I gain the most information when I see a player showdown a hand and then go back to the hand history and see how he played it all the way through. You don't have this luxury live, but online I think it's the best tool you have. 3. I think A & B are more important than C, because at 50NL I don't think there are very many keen observers. Players push back at you if you've been playing and raising a large percentage pre-flop, so my VPIP and PFR% are the first things I think about when trying to evaluate my table image. 4. Yes. It hurts a lot. I currently 5- or 6-table and try to take notes, but a lot of the action moves too fast. I'm sure this hurts me, but I'd like to think I make up for it in winrate. Hard to know though. 5. In the few MTTs (~10) I've played I've tried to take notes throughout. Most of them turn out to be useless, but a few times I've ended up at tables late in the tourney and been really glad to have notes from earlier. I'll post some questions on Part 4 later this week. It would be really nice to get more discussion going. Especially questions from people other than me and Eric, and hand histories! |
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| Eric |
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Here are my thoughts: 1. It depends on the definition of "betting patterns". If the definition is broad enough and takes enough variables into account then yes, 99% of the time. The 1% no is because we are not computers or robots, we are human beings. It reminds me of the Matrix when Neo has a choice. Even though our "betting patterns" show that we've made a certain move hundreds of times in the past, it does not guarantee that we will make the same move the next time the opportunity comes up. 2. How many hands my opponents play(A) is the most important read for me. 3. How many hands have I been playing(A) is the question I ask myself when trying to determine what my opponents think of my play. 4. The most I play is 4 tables at once. Yes, playing more tables makes it more difficult for me to pick up detailed reads on any single table. 5. I concentrate more on reads as I get closer to the money and closer to the final table. |
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| Eric |
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Quote:
We should stay on schedule and post the part 4 questions soon. 
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| zook |
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I'm learning a lot re-reading it too. And HOH2 was better than 1, imo, so I'm looking forward to that. Now if I could only find time to play some tourneys Part 4 questions up in a few hours...
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| cardplayer52 |
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1. i think betting patterns are probably the most important thing to look at. i remember one of my first live events. certain betting patterns i recognized from my on-line play happened before me live. i didnt need to look in his eyes or ask any questions(good thing at that point i wouldnt have a clue what anything meant) i knew what his likely cards were by the way he bet. also i good live player may be able to hide tells but he still got to bet. and if he doesnt hide his betting patterns well then i find this can be a huge leak in there game. 2. i couldnt honestly think of one more important than the other. they all got there use in different spots. but after reading the posts here i'm going with B. because of the fact how much info it gives up. you can view the hand history see how they played the hand. and if you really think about it this (B) also can give you info on (A),(C),+(D) as well. 3. most important i think B i think people remember what they see and again seeing the cards you play can say so much about the player you are. also knowning if they are really keen (or are they mutli tabling) is important as well. 4. yes i mutli table. as for my ablity to read a table i think this has a huge (-neg) effect on it. also has a -neg effect on how i play. i take less advantage of cerain traits a player may have. i almost never take notes. i also play more robotic and have more predictable play. 5. 1st thing i do in a MTT during that 1 minute till start time. i note the date/buyin amount/tourney name/time of event in a players box then copy it and paste it to everyone at the table. paste it to new players as they come or new tables etc. this will at the very least tell me if ive played this guy before(if so i'll have a hand history on him). often a player i put notes on earlier in the tourney will show up at my table later. then i add the "regular" notes to that. so to get back to the question i always am taking note though out. it helps me pay attention to the players at my table. but i will say i will make more plays based on my notes later in the tourney. |
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