J8s - Good or bad play?

This post to celebrate that I am now finished with my studies and can play more poker

First hand in a NL $20+2$ SnG, Blinds 20/10,
All 10 players with 1500$ in chips

PRE-FLOP
Hero (SB) posts $10 :Jd:
BB posts $20
UTG calls $20
UTG+1 calls $20
5x folds
Button calls $20
Hero calls $10
BB checks.

FLOP


Hero bets $80
BB folds
UTG raises to $160
UTG+1 folds
Button folds
Hero calls $80

TURN
:Js:

Hero bets $350
UTG calls $350

RIVER
:Qh:

Hero bets $300
UTG raises $970 and is all-in
Hero

1) Do I call here?
2) What do you put UTG on?
3) Was my play in the hand good or bad?

I smell AA/KK... (others agree/disagree?)

I don't think AA/KK. But I don't like getting too involved this early with this hand. I also check/fold the river.

1) Do I call here?
2) What do you put UTG on?
3) Was my play in the hand good or bad?

1) No i fold
2) UTG has 22 or 44 (or AA-KK)
3) Nothing too bad until the river. if you werent willing to call an AI reraise there, I would just check (and fold). Leading the flop is fine with me...trying to do a blocking bet where you can see a cheap river is good also. I might have tried for 250-300 though.

I feel PF is fine, especially getting great odds.

On the flop, I'm not too confident in your hand, as its essentially a jack-high flush draw and one overcard (that may not even be good). Therefore, being first to act, I check and see what develops. If it is bet, I call if the odds are good.

The rest of the hand really depends on what happens on the flop.

The way you played it, I think the turn bet was too big, and I would check/call a reasonable river bet/fold to bigger bet on the river.

preflop is fine

postflop
dont build a big pot with a marginal hand.

Thanks guys

Here's my reasoning during the hand.

PRF
1) Good odds to see a cheap flop so I call from SB

Flop
2) A flush draw for me and a flop that quite possibly didn't hit anyone. So I will bet my draw.

3) A miniraise from UTG and down to one opponent means my odds are great for another call. What does his raise mean? Very often with a set people tend to slowplay and just call a flop bet, but a miniraise with a set is also possible. On this level many people also make a weak raise when they have some kind of hand, but feel it's a bit to weak to bet more (=bad play). I decided it is very likely that he is holding 55-88 or A9 - T9. He might also be on a draw, but I think he would only have raised a draw if he also had a pair, such as A9. A higher pair or AK-AQ is not likely with no PRF raise.

Turn
4) Basically I think the J is a very good card for me here. I now have hit my overcard to the flop and still have a draw to a flush. Given my reasoning on the flop I'm pretty sure I might now be ahead of a lower pair or a paired 9. J9 would be bad, but is less likely given that I hold a J. A set is still possible, but I think more often than not he doesn't have it after that weak raise. Still, I do not want him to river two pair or a set and I can't be sure he isn't drawing to a higher flush. Therefor I bet to end the hand putting 350 into the 420 pot.

5) He called and I am no suspecting that he might actually be on a draw or that if he holds a 9 it's A9. I also reason that he might now put me on a draw since I just called his miniraise and that he does not expect the J to have helped my hand.

River
6) The Q is an overcard that I don't fear that much. Q9 is possible and also QX, but not very likely. After a little thinking I decide to trust my reasoning that I have the better hand and go all the way. I therefor bet 300 for value or to induce a bluff and I call his All in raise without much hesitation.

7) He shows and I double up.

Any weakness in my reasoning? Was I too optimistic and just getting lucky?

Preflop is fine.

I don't even really mind the flop bet so much, and you had odds to call the min raise. This early though I am not looking to build the pot with hands like this until I hit them.

The turn I don't like the big bet. You have top pair weak kicker.. when you stay in preflop with a hand like J 9 you want to hit a straight/flush/2 pair before you go building the pot. I check the turn.

As for the river you put out a value bet which again I don't like. You missed your flush, missed a 2 pair, and are now left with a lone top pair bad kicker. I would never bet here and if I am ever in the situation I beg for a showdown.

Regardless of the result of this hand, I would say the way it was played you would be beat more than you would win. Play suited connectors for what they're for this early on..

Originally Posted by givememyleg

Preflop is fine.

I don't even really mind the flop bet so much, and you had odds to call the min raise. This early though I am not looking to build the pot with hands like this until I hit them.

The turn I don't like the big bet. You have top pair weak kicker.. when you stay in preflop with a hand like J 9 you want to hit a straight/flush/2 pair before you go building the pot. I check the turn.

As for the river you put out a value bet which again I don't like. You missed your flush, missed a 2 pair, and are now left with a lone top pair bad kicker. I would never bet here and if I am ever in the situation I beg for a showdown.

Regardless of the result of this hand, I would say the way it was played you would be beat more than you would win. Play suited connectors for what they're for this early on..

Generally I aggree with you on connectors
But I do not really aggree that more often than not he will have me beat on a 2d 4d 9c Js board, that's my point here. Two pairs are not likely, while X9 or a medium pair is highly likely in my opinion. I have to see what cards are in play, not only that my holding is marginal. isn't the clue to decide if you have the better hand or not?

Still, I see that maybe I should have kept the pot smaller. Check the turn then and call a small bet and fold to a larger bet? How much would you check-call on the turn? A friend of mine would have bet even more on the turn and checked the river if the big turn bet was called.

Originally Posted by Borax

Generally I aggree with you on connectors
But I do not really aggree that more often than not he will have me beat on a 2d 4d 9c Js board, that's my point here. Two pairs are not likely, while X9 or a medium pair is highly likely in my opinion. I have to see what cards are in play, not only that my holding is marginal. isn't the clue to decide if you have the better hand or not?

I disagree. Later on, maybe. But early on fight your battles with your big guns.

Originally Posted by Borax

Still, I see that maybe I should have kept the pot smaller. Check the turn then and call a small bet and fold to a larger bet? How much would you check-call on the turn? A friend of mine would have bet even more on the turn and checked the river if the big turn bet was called.

Basically, it is the first hand, you have no reads and a modest hand. Even if he doesn't have you beat, you can find a MUCH better spot than this to get all your chips in.

I would check call a small bet on the turn, enough to give me at least 4:1, mabe 3:1. You chould be drawing to just 9 flush cards... you could even be drawing to a J/8 only. I understand it isn't as likely but for me, it just isn't worth the risk.

ok, thanks.
I should say that usually I play very tight until blinds reach 100/50, but I go for it when I can see a cheap flop and I am pretty sure that I'm ahead, like in this hand. I'll remember your comments and pick my spots with care