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standard situation: how to extract the maximum?

  
 
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Pingviini
Old 12-13-2005, 06:58 PM     Post subject: standard situation: how to extract the maximum? #1 (permalink)  
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2nd hand on the table, so no reads. Standard situation but how do I get the max here. After he re-raised me I thought about 3-betting but I didnt see that many hands worse than mine calling the bet. I remember villain from some previous session and he wouldnt call my AI on river with AJ, most likely would AK as well with these stacks.

So, 3-bet on flop, more on turn, more/AI on river. even CR at some point??
These are the spots where winnings are maximized and I did not play this hand well..

Saalis is at seat 1 with 394.00
jock000 is at seat 2 with 314.39
bumsen is at seat 3 with 71.60
thommy40 is at seat 4 with 219.77
Fantomet1 is at seat 5 with 587.09

jock000 posts the large blind 4.00
Saalis posts the small blind 2.00

Saalis: 4s, 4d
jock000: --, --
bumsen: --, --
thommy40: --, --
Fantomet1: --, --

Pre-flop:

bumsen: Fold
thommy40: Call 4.00
Fantomet1: Raise 12.00
Saalis: Call 12.00
jock000: Call 12.00
thommy40: Call 12.00

Flop (Board: 4c, Ah, Qd):

Saalis: Bet 24.00
jock000: Fold
thommy40: Fold
Fantomet1: Raise 48.00
Saalis: Call 48.00

Turn (Board: 4c, Ah, Qd, 3c):

Saalis: Bet 64.00
Fantomet1: Call 64.00

River (Board: 4c, Ah, Qd, 3c, 7s):

Saalis: Bet 120.00
Fantomet1: Call 120.00

Showdown:

Saalis shows: 4s, 4d (three of a kind, Fours)

Mainpot:
Saalis wins the pot of 509.00 with three of a kind, Fours

(3.00 rake were taken for this hand)
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twosevoff
Old 12-13-2005, 07:29 PM #2 (permalink)  
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What did he have? AK?

I like the flop play here--leading out then just calling is the best way to feign weakness (of course once you've done this once to someone they're sure to remember it so be wary of overusing it). Once you've let him take the lead in the hand though, I think you need to check the turn and let him bet, then check-raise him by whatever amt you think he's most likely to call (a push in this case may look to him like a bluff).
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storm75m
Old 12-13-2005, 07:43 PM #3 (permalink)  
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 You didn't play this hand bad at all... looks very good to me.... any other kind of play on the flop or turn may scare him off or you would be just getting too fancy.... one option could be to possibly check-raise the river all-in. If he has a strong ace he is definitely going to bet something on the river if you check to him, then may call your huge check-raise thinking it's a bluff. Or he may bet huge to try and semi-bluff at it himself. But the way you played it is probably the safest, no need to get too tricky...
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Pingviini
Old 12-13-2005, 08:11 PM #4 (permalink)  
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He wouldnt bet the river after that action with AK/AJ.. At least that is what I think..
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Fnord
Old 12-13-2005, 08:20 PM #5 (permalink)  
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I usually just 3-bet the flop, however I should consider running this line more often. Perhaps a $36 lead builds you the pot you really want to win here?
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Pingviini
Old 12-13-2005, 08:35 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I really rarely 3-bet on the flop here, it pretty much tells that I have either 2 pair or a set. Turn bet is the problem here, either bet more, like $86 OR check-raising him, problem here is that I do not remember him being that aggressive so he might try to keep this pot small with just AK..
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alias2211
Old 12-13-2005, 09:39 PM #7 (permalink)  
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i like the play betting on the turn again, i just hope you did it because your history w/ him might have induced him into calling down like that. it really looks like he decided that he'd reraise you on flop and that if you called he'd hope for a cheap showdown. from his call of the turn it appears that he's hoping for another smallish bet (relative to pot size) but then he called your 120 on the end so i'm not sure about that. the other thing that came to mind was that if he had you pegged for an aggro he might have just been playing catch w/ 2 pair like AQ hoping to mess you up with AK or AJ.
In answer to your question... it depends...
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DaNutsInYoEye
Old 12-13-2005, 09:39 PM #8 (permalink)  
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I don't like 3-betting the flop here either. I like your lead out on the turn as well. I think check-calling the turn and leading out the river is a decent option too, but you run the risk of him checking the turn as well. If you put him on a big ace though it's not likely he would check the turn. I agree with you that he is probably checking behind on the river if you give him the chance. Overall I think you played the hand very nicely.
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