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Spewing chips with marginal decent hand..

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Juked07

06-21-2008, 06:15 AM Post subject: Spewing chips with marginal decent hand..

#1 (permalink)

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Join Date: Apr 2008

Posts: 83

Table had been playing a lot of multiway pots which i think makes drawing hands better. I limped pre looking for odds to draw to the nut flush, but this happened instead..

Villain is 33/28 over 121 hands. The rest is a situation I struggle a lot with. When I have a hand with mediocre value, like AX on an A high board, I definitely can't fold that cbet.. On the turn, I'm not sure, but I thought I was still ahead of a typical lag's 2 barreling range. But calling leads to crappy river spots like this one.

Pretty sure my play on this hand (and ones like it) is pretty spewy. Help?

PokerStars Game #18277205538: Hold'em No Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2008/06/21 - 02:02:03 (ET)
Table 'Lundia' 6-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: ploinko ($14.65 in chips)
Seat 2: Phuzzlecash ($26 in chips)
Seat 3: Juked07 ($38.80 in chips)
Seat 5: aznbluff1029 ($48.55 in chips)
Seat 6: bet124 ($23.25 in chips)
bet124: posts small blind $0.10
ploinko: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Juked07 [Ad 8d]
Phuzzlecash: folds
Juked07: calls $0.25
aznbluff1029: folds
bet124: raises $1 to $1.25
ploinko: folds
Juked07: calls $1
*** FLOP *** [3d Ac 3h]
bet124: bets $2
Juked07: calls $2
*** TURN *** [3d Ac 3h] [Ts]
bet124: bets $4
Juked07: calls $4
*** RIVER *** [3d Ac 3h Ts] [Jh]
bet124: bets $8
Juked07: folds
Uncalled bet ($8) returned to bet124
bet124 collected $14.05 from pot
bet124: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $14.75 | Rake $0.70
Board [3d Ac 3h Ts Jh]
Seat 1: ploinko (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 2: Phuzzlecash folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Juked07 folded on the River
Seat 5: aznbluff1029 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: bet124 (small blind) collected ($14.05)

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jyms

06-21-2008, 06:38 AM

#2 (permalink)

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Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 4,837

You limped pre OOP with what you claim is a drawing hand and flop TP. Then call two bets with what you think is a best hand and then fold to the river? This is spew x 10.

Never play Axsooted again unless there are three players in the pot in front of you. You may raise it or open on the button but stop playing drawing hands OOP. Any hand that you put money into the pot without knowing what most others are going to do is spew.

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Juked07

06-21-2008, 06:46 AM

#3 (permalink)

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The initial limp may have been bad, but I thought I had a reason for doing it. The table had been very limp happy and I thought limping Ax suited was +EV in that situation...

But once they fold and SB opens, I have A8s IP vs a LAG.

Is preflop really that bad?

Hawk

06-21-2008, 10:36 AM

#4 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Sep 2007

Posts: 367

Yes. If you are going to play that hand, you really should be raising preflop. You really shouldn't be limping much of anything at all really.

You may want to try playing raise or fold preflop with everything for a little while. After you get more comfortable you can limp in some spots, but those won't come up too often.

Juked07

06-21-2008, 05:51 PM

#5 (permalink)

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Thanks for the advice guys. I was running about 21/14, limping only PP, SC, and sometimes suited aces. I'll try raising more.

What do you think about post flop. Fold turn?

Galapogos

06-21-2008, 05:53 PM

#6 (permalink)

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Location: The Loser's Lounge

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Juked07

Thanks for the advice guys. I was running about 21/14, limping only PP, SC, and sometimes suited aces. I'll try raising more.

How do you run 21/14 limping all those hands??

Quote:

Originally Posted by sauce123

I don't get why you insist on stacking off with like jack high all the time.

jyms

06-21-2008, 05:54 PM

#7 (permalink)

Tilting Mod

Join Date: Feb 2006

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Fold the flop or raise the flop. What do you think he has that you want to call?

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Juked07

06-21-2008, 05:54 PM

#8 (permalink)

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Posts: 83

Well I open all those hands from CO and BU... I think most of my limps are UTG and MP. I never really thought about it that much. I guess limping a out of position is a pretty serious leak.

And on flop, my reasoning was that he cbets pretty much any cards, so I should definitely be ahead, but his range for calling a raise is probably ahead of mine. I felt that raising the flop folded the hands I beat and built a pot for the ones I was behind... I would like to know why this is wrong, because I flat a lot IP with hands like TPNK, especially against villains who cbet a lot.

On the turn, I thought very hard about folding, but I thought that flatting 2 streets would slow him down if I was ahead (which I thought should happen a lot because a lot of lags sort of default to 2 barelling when they miss...), and then I could c/f the river.

Obviously there are problems with my reasoning, and I know it. I just wanted to explain what I thought so you guys could tell me why I'm wrong so I can play better. Thanks =)

nutsinho

06-21-2008, 06:12 PM

#9 (permalink)

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Location: flattin ur 4bets, makin u tilt

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jyms

Fold the flop or raise the flop.

don't do either of these. also don't open limp out of position. postflop i think this is played well.

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dsaxton

06-21-2008, 06:19 PM

#10 (permalink)

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Location: Arlington, VA

Posts: 2,667

Quote:

Originally Posted by jyms

Fold the flop or raise the flop. What do you think he has that you want to call?

Raising this flop with A-8 is pointless spew.

jyms

06-21-2008, 06:29 PM

#11 (permalink)

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Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 4,837

You guys are probably right. I just see no need to call this flop and turn then fold on this river bet. I think I'm trying more to make him think about his opponents hand. I just don't see where this hand can be played properly after pre flop other than taking it down. Best you can hope for here is getting a better A to fold I would think.

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speedcake

06-22-2008, 07:05 AM

#12 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Sep 2007

Location: Tampa

Posts: 434

I see too many hands I'm way behind by the turn to call that bet if my plan is to just fold to a 3rd value town barrel on the river if I don't hit my two outer.

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Spewing chips with marginal decent hand..

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