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some semi interesting folds 200NL

  
 
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 02-12-2008, 09:35 PM     Post subject: some semi interesting folds 200NL #1 (permalink)  
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 Villain in this hand is Terry Schiavo (sp?). He's running 24/20 and is a solid player. He's not excessively spewy but probably bluffs in some spots (ldo). I've 3-bet him a few times before, and we have history so he probably thinks i'm capable of just 3-betting retardly wide ranges, and it's not deep enough into the sesh for him to realize i'm running like 16/13. I'm not sure if he realizes i'm 16 tabling either.

From the action i'm pretty sure he thinks i almost never have a 6 here.

he also thought on the river for 10 seconds or so. Also the reason i called the turn is that i think he was c/f his entire range on a blank besides an A or a 6, and hands that weren't A's or 6's were enough of his range.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($163.95)
UTG ($200)
Hero ($283)
Button ($242.30)
SB ($202)

Preflop: Hero is MP with K, Q.
UTG raises to $6, Hero raises to $20, 3 folds, UTG calls $14.

Flop: ($43) 5, 4, 2 (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks.

Turn: ($43) 3 (2 players)
UTG bets $30, Hero calls $30.

River: ($103) A (2 players)
UTG bets $150 (All-In), Hero folds.

Now this hand is against a loosish passivish player i haven't seen before.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (4 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Button ($65.90)
SB ($201)
Hero ($243.60)
UTG ($217.15)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8, 7.
2 folds, SB raises to $7, Hero calls $5.

Flop: ($14) 9, 6, 9 (2 players)
SB bets $10, Hero raises to $28, SB calls $18.

Turn: ($70) 8 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

River: ($70) T (2 players)
SB bets $40, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $70
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IowaSkinsFan
Old 02-12-2008, 09:38 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 I probably call both bout both are definitely marginal.
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IowaSkinsFan
Old 02-12-2008, 09:42 PM #3 (permalink)  
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 Like the turn float on hand 1 btw
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wufwugy
Old 02-12-2008, 09:46 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 1. Not much to do other than fold.
2. Why are you raising flop if you're gonna fold to this kind of river?
 
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will641
Old 02-12-2008, 10:33 PM #5 (permalink)  
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 i probably call hand 1. the only thing you are losing to is 66 basically right?

hand 2, against most villains i would call, but the fact that hes loose passive makes me want to fold. i always talk myself into calling here.
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 02-12-2008, 10:38 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 ugh on hand 2 i didn't realize in the moment the kind of pot odds i was getting.
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Marshall28
Old 02-12-2008, 10:57 PM #7 (permalink)  
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1st hand i dunno how i feel about the float, its like, why didn't you c-bet the flop? im guessing because you figured villain wouldn't give you any credit and checkraise u -- meaning u felt he had a stronger hand. u kinda tell him u think he is stronger than u when u check behind, so his bet on the turn looks like it's to protect his hand, i think if i were villain and u floated this turn to bet the river when it comes like 89TJKQ like, i wouldn't give you any credit at all. Maybe on a K Q or J possibly, but only because it appears that you are floating since you didnt bet the flop. otherwise, why are you just calling the turn, if you didnt bet the flop, it meant u were slowplaying or u were weak, if u were slowplaying when the board gets this draw heavy you would certainly not waste any time to make a move. i just think if u r gonna check this flop, this turn is a really bad one for your range and a great one for his range, id just give it up there.

yeah hand 2 is a clear cut call, against some villains it's actually a raise because they are so bad they'll stack off w/ just trips or a weird played AA.
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 02-12-2008, 11:01 PM #8 (permalink)  
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 ok pretend the villain bets $60 on hand 2
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Marshall28
Old 02-12-2008, 11:08 PM #9 (permalink)  
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if you've ever played w/ me you'd know im the biggest calling station alive, so i snap. a good player on the other hand might fold.

i dunno it really depends on how villain perceives you, does he think you're the type to try to make a hero call, or does he think you're the type to be forced to call a smaller bet based on the great pot odds you're getting. its all in the context of previous hands so its really difficult to give u a "correct" answer.
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Genitruc
Old 02-12-2008, 11:20 PM #10 (permalink)  
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 can t lie Max, I call both and I call #1 rly rly fast. i might fold if the pot was 30$ and he was overbetting 5x pot or something... also it's the best spot ever for him to check a 6 to you. the only think I can think of is that he has 67 and hopes you with your light rr range have 6x, but that s pushing it I think

#2 is bleh. I don t like a fold cuz it s so hard to put him on a hand
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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Genitruc
Old 02-12-2008, 11:21 PM #11 (permalink)  
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 if villain bets 60 in hand 2 I timebank shove
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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Genitruc
Old 02-12-2008, 11:22 PM #12 (permalink)  
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 cuz that s what ppl get for taking it one level too far
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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Alexos
Old 02-13-2008, 12:37 AM #13 (permalink)  
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 I think both pots are big enough that folding is a big mistake. I dont get #2 either...i mean i might even raise here lol
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meeloche
Old 02-13-2008, 12:43 AM #14 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Genitruc
if villain bets 60 in hand 2 I timebank shove
The fact that we timebank then act makes our hand look stronger or weaker?



 
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nutsinho
Old 02-13-2008, 12:45 AM #15 (permalink)  
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 #1 is really close but #2 is a very easy call
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 02-13-2008, 01:01 AM #16 (permalink)  
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 he has to have a 6 less than 25% of the time on hand 1 for it to be a call if you guys didn't realize (i really hope you did)
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Alexos
Old 02-13-2008, 01:07 AM #17 (permalink)  
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 lol
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nutsinho
Old 02-13-2008, 01:16 AM #18 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Massimo
he has to have a 6 less than 25% of the time on hand 1 for it to be a call if you guys didn't realize (i really hope you did)
the fact that he bets the turn is very strongly correlated with him having a 6 b/c you are so likely to have a wheel. at the same time, he prob can't play any hand with a 6 in it profitably vs your reraise preflop and he should be aware of this. thats why i think this is a sick spot.
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Genitruc
Old 02-13-2008, 05:08 AM #19 (permalink)  
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 i don t think it matters (the timebank thing) but sometimes vs thinkers I like doing strange stuff where they think I'm levelling them

also in general on that wheel board I just think it's pretty +ev to play superaggressively when neither one of you is likely to have it and your range has more 6's in it than his.
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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Genitruc
Old 02-13-2008, 05:08 AM #20 (permalink)  
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 dbl post
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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griffey24
Old 02-13-2008, 04:49 PM #21 (permalink)  
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 I haven't read the other posts so sorry if its repeated.

hand 1 - I don't really get the fold. He raised UTG, and the you repopped him and he called OOP. I agree that from the action that you rarely have a 6 here, but from the action I also think he rarely has a 6 here? I call this.

hand 2 - wow .. pot odds! lol I agree that if he had a 9, those turn and rivers sucked and he probably filled up. But he could be potentially value betting with A9 or something like that here even.

I think its good that you are capable of folding though. Maybe I should learn that lol
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Kagey
Old 02-13-2008, 05:46 PM #22 (permalink)  
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Hand 2 has to be a snap call.
Hand 1 is +ev for him whatever you do since you don't have any sixes in your range.
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gabe
Old 02-13-2008, 07:16 PM #23 (permalink)  
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i hate hate hate the turn call in 1, i think you and i put him on difference ranges
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 02-13-2008, 07:41 PM #24 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabe
i hate hate hate the turn call in 1, i think you and i put him on difference ranges
yeah maybe. I was just obsessed with the fact that call turn bet river is soooo an A.
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gabe
Old 02-13-2008, 08:03 PM #25 (permalink)  
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yea, it looks like you have Ax on flop so why would villian fire turn with air?
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 02-13-2008, 08:25 PM #26 (permalink)  
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 you're right solid point
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