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minSim
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05-13-2010, 10:59 AM
Post subject: Some micro HU SNG strat Q's
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Deventer
Posts: 1,512
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I played some 5,25 HU SNG's at Stars again yesterday and today, as I have done some times before. I feel like basically all players are big fish one way or the other. I have very little HU experience or knowledge myself though. I'm quite confident I have a big postflop edge against most players, but I'm not comfortable in my preflop game.
Basically the only preflop knowledge I have is that I should be able to raise 100% of buttons somewhere somehow. That's basicaly what I try every match lol. Besides that I'm going in with a few years 6max experience and trying to adjust.
I hope you people can give me some starting guidelines. Just some numbers and adjustments to my thinking so I'll be a little more confident in my preflop game.
1. First thing I encouter is that effective stacks are 75bb in these SNG's, and they're getting smaller ofcourse. Once the blinds go up one level we're at max 50bb, etc.
I feel like opening 100% of buttons isn't the optimal strategy now, unless my villain is folding a huge ton pre or on the flop, but that's easy to spot.
a. What's a good raising range (rough number is fine as well) to start with considering btn opening range at the start with 75bb?
b. How does it change with 50bb?
c. And 10-20bb?
2. Raising size. I minraise a lot because of the 'small' stacks. If I'm tightening my opening range, should I increase my opening to 3x? (assuming villains calling/3betting range will not adjust)
3. Could you guys give me some rough guidelines on starting ranges for 3betting and calling OOP against a 40% opener and a 80% opener? (things like 3bet/call/fold 86s, A5s, K7s, A8o, T9o). I know it's all player dependant and we should adjust and so, but I'm just looking for a start.
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FlyingSaucy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Watching the kids
Posts: 1,603
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I'm not experienced in HU sngs. I'd start by reading every post ISF ever wrote on here. 
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IowaSkinsFan
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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If you are going to play SNGs of any kind seriously, you need to dl SNG Wizard or something comparable. That program can essentially answer all your questions.
General Advice: Hand reading is tough to adjust to because the SNG guys play so differently and you are generally going to have to play looser.
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revolvingiris
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,139
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You don't have to raise every button but you probably should a lot. In the little bit I dabbled with HU raising every button caused some issues. Players are just so bad that they aren't really paying attention if your are un-exploitable or not so its kind of like burning chips with some players.
As far as ranges go, think about the game and what those chips represent in the match. As the blinds increase the chips in play become more and more valuable (I don't mean ICM). The player with the larger stack has the advantage so it should seem somewhat your goal to get that stack.
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andy-akb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Maine
Posts: 1,836
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revolvingiris
You don't have to raise every button but you probably should a lot. In the little bit I dabbled with HU raising every button caused some issues. Players are just so bad that they aren't really paying attention if your are un-exploitable or not so its kind of like burning chips with some players.
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Meh, thats more of a reason to raise 100% of buttons. You raise that much because it is profitable against most players because they dont pay attention enough or adjust enough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by revolvingiris
As far as ranges go, think about the game and what those chips represent in the match. As the blinds increase the chips in play become more and more valuable (I don't mean ICM). The player with the larger stack has the advantage so it should seem somewhat your goal to get that stack.
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This is also not true, in a HUSNG chipEV = $EV, while a larger stack is going to win more often, additional chips dont have a greater value. In HUSNGs, a chip is a chip
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revolvingiris
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,139
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The reason I don't like raising 100% against every opponent is some call way to wide and then your just building a pot vs a station with a shit hand.
In sngs chipEV does not =$EV, in husng they are the same and I think thats what you meant to say. I was talking about the advantage you have when you have your opponent covered. The sheer fact that you can survive more AIs is a huge advantage.
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minSim
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Deventer
Posts: 1,512
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revolvingiris
The reason I don't like raising 100% against every opponent is some call way to wide and then your just building a pot vs a station with a shit hand.
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This happens a lot at the small SNG's. So your adjustment is to open a little less hands? Do you open even less when stacks get shallower then 75bb?
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andy-akb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Maine
Posts: 1,836
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revolvingiris
The reason I don't like raising 100% against every opponent is some call way to wide and then your just building a pot vs a station with a shit hand.
In sngs chipEV does not =$EV, in husng they are the same and I think thats what you meant to say. I was talking about the advantage you have when you have your opponent covered. The sheer fact that you can survive more AIs is a huge advantage.
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Yea, I meant husng and while you definitely have an advantage of having more chips, this simply means that your chance of winning while a big stack is greater than as a small stack, but does not mean that the additional chips are worth more
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revolvingiris
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minSim
This happens a lot at the small SNG's. So your adjustment is to open a little less hands? Do you open even less when stacks get shallower then 75bb?
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Its really opponent dependent but if I am facing a complete station then I will limp more in position vs raising. I think a lot of people starting out in HU think you just always have to raise. Creating a limping range is pretty beneficial.
As far as the whole shallow stacks thing. Just look to put yourself in good spots vs the type of opponent you are facing. I really wont widen my opening range until the blinds become "worth it" to me.
HoldemResources.net: HeadsUp Nash Equilibrium
Idk if you have seen the above or not but it should help determining shove spots.
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Raiseandfold Manager
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High Card
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4
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IowaSkinsfan gave you solid advice and I concur.
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siltstrider
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
If you are going to play SNGs of any kind seriously, you need to dl SNG Wizard or something comparable. That program can essentially answer all your questions.
General Advice: Hand reading is tough to adjust to because the SNG guys play so differently and you are generally going to have to play looser.
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I find this really surprising from you. I've never seen any other high-stakes winner recommend this and I thought the general consensus was thatwasn't really worth using for HUSNGs. How has SNGwiz helped your HUSNG game?
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siltstrider
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revolvingiris
The reason I don't like raising 100% against every opponent is some call way to wide and then your just building a pot vs a station with a shit hand.
In sngs chipEV does not =$EV, in husng they are the same and I think thats what you meant to say. I was talking about the advantage you have when you have your opponent covered. The sheer fact that you can survive more AIs is a huge advantage.
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It's not an advantage that should change your strategy, though, unless your opponent is bad and changes HIS strategy because of it.
You should play the same when you have 500 chips to your opponent's 2500 as you would play when you have 2500 chips to your opponent's 2500. EV+ decisions are EV+ regardless of who has the bigger stack.
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PokerWiz
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 52
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I don't think you should play the same regardless of stack size. I think you should change the way you play depending on it instead.
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