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So you wanna be a hero...

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mcatdog

11-08-2006, 04:45 AM Post subject: So you wanna be a hero...

#1 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 3,654

A couple of days ago, Fnord wrote a post that said that if you want to beat the increasingly tougher and more aggressive games, you need to be capable of a heroic call every once in awhile.

I agree with him and it's been proven this week for me. I played a long session yesterday and another one today and I faced a number of overly aggressive players. I found myself calling them down with some fairly weak hands, here are five examples. The first two hands (which I posted in the order that they happened) both feature the same villain. He was a major donk that never seemed to want to let go of a hand. He'd been caught three-barreling on multiple occasions. Also, at some point between the two hands he potted the river for $60 with a pair of deuces, I folded and he showed. The last three hands all involved different villains whom I didn't have as good of a read on, but I could tell that they were splashing around a lot and I suspected that they were making big bluffs from time to time.

Hand 1
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

SB ($292.35)
BB ($295.90)
UTG ($112.20)
Hero ($225.30)
CO ($255.95)
Button ($149.30)

Preflop: Hero is MP with T

, A

.
1 fold, Hero raises to $8, 1 fold, Button calls $8, 2 folds.

Flop: ($19) Q

, 5

, 2

(2 players)
Hero bets $14, Button calls $14.

Turn: ($47) 8

(2 players)
Hero checks, Button checks.

River: ($47) 2

(2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets $10, Hero calls $10.

Final Pot: $67

Hand 2
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

CO ($216.50)
Button ($248.60)
SB ($171.95)
Hero ($292.35)
UTG ($264.05)
MP ($101.05)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9

, K

.
1 fold, MP raises to $4, 1 fold, Button calls $4, 1 fold, Hero calls $2.

Flop: ($13) 8

, T

, K

(3 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $2, Button folds, Hero calls $2.

Turn: ($17) 4

(2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $10, Hero calls $10.

River: ($37) 5

(2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $34, Hero calls $34.

Final Pot: $105

Hand 3
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

MP ($195.45)
Hero ($278.45)
SB ($401.55)
BB ($608.55)
UTG ($200)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J

, Q

.
UTG calls $2, MP calls $2, Hero raises to $12, 2 folds, UTG folds, MP calls $10.

Flop: ($29) Q

, T

, 4

(2 players)
MP bets $22, Hero calls $22.

Turn: ($73) A

(2 players)
MP checks, Hero checks.

River: ($73) 3

(2 players)
MP bets $42, Hero calls $42.

Final Pot: $157

Hand 4
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Button ($418.80)
SB ($429.25)
BB ($121.75)
UTG ($176.70)
Hero ($200)
CO ($199)

Preflop: Hero is MP with A

, J

.
1 fold, Hero raises to $8, CO calls $8, Button calls $8, 2 folds.

Flop: ($27) 6

, 2

, J

(3 players)
Hero bets $20, CO folds, Button calls $20.

Turn: ($67) 6

(2 players)
Hero bets $50, Button raises to $100, Hero raises to $172, Button calls $72.

River: ($411) 9

(2 players)

Final Pot: $411

Hand 5
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($205.10)
UTG ($157.90)
Hero ($227.10)
Button ($224.45)
SB ($160.50)

Preflop: Hero is MP with A

, Q

.
1 fold, Hero raises to $8, 2 folds, BB calls $6.

Flop: ($17) T

, Q

, 5

(2 players)
BB bets $6, Hero raises to $20, BB raises to $34, Hero calls $14.

Turn: ($85) T

(2 players)
BB bets $36, Hero calls $36.

River: ($157) 5

(2 players)
BB bets $127.1 (All-In), Hero calls $127.10.

Final Pot: $411.20

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Phantaroth

11-08-2006, 07:06 AM

#2 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 505

Hand 2 - I don't like... even if he was being aggressive with the draw he just caught it.. what did you think he has here?

Genitruc

11-08-2006, 08:47 PM

#3 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Posts: 4,463

Genitruc is an unknown quantity at this point

these seem way too feel-dependant to comment on

when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?

NLHE lahooozaher

11-08-2006, 09:05 PM

#4 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jan 2006

Posts: 916

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phantaroth

Hand 2 - I don't like... even if he was being aggressive with the draw he just caught it.. what did you think he has here?

I was gonna post the same thing and also say that your title makes me want to say "save the cheerleader" since it's on every single nbc commercial for heroes.

biondino

11-08-2006, 10:15 PM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2005

Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars

Posts: 3,170

Amazing how much this looks like sub $10NL donkery

IowaSkinsFan

11-09-2006, 12:10 AM

#6 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Oct 2004

Posts: 7,148

IowaSkinsFan will become famous soon enough

3 and 5 are good, IMO the other three are ridiculous.

Check out the new blog!!!

Numbr2intheWorld

11-09-2006, 12:47 AM

#7 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Aug 2006

Posts: 3,561

Numbr2intheWorld will become famous soon enough

I think hand 1 was fine, he checked behind on the turn which is really weak, and i doubt the 2 helped him. Hand 2 is terrible, hand 3 is borderline, hands 4 and 5 i don't like.

Check out my blog http://suited-aces.com

nutsinho

11-09-2006, 03:19 AM

#8 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: flattin ur 4bets, makin u tilt

Posts: 3,280

$200nl FR today
Folds to my SB, I make it 6 with K7hh
BB calls
Flop Qs Jh Ts
I bet 12, BB calls.
Turn 7c
I check, BB checks.
River 2d
I check, BB bets 35, I call.

My bankroll is the amount of money I would spend or lose before I got a job. It is calculated by adding my net worth to whatever I can borrow.

mcatdog

11-09-2006, 09:13 AM

#9 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 3,654

You guys are pretty good, I don't know what's wrong with me in these situations. It seems I simply always make the wrong decision against maniacs! Here are the results.

Hand 1: He had 43 for the missed draw.

Hand 2: He had K8 of course. I really should have folded the turn and the river but his betting pattern looked exactly like two or three bluffs he'd run earlier with nothing. I have trouble folding even mediocre one-pair hands to aggro-donks, it's really not good.

Hand 3: He had complete air, 85 suited (not hearts).

Hand 4: He had A6. Lately, I've been seeing a lot of minraise bluffs from donks on the expensive streets. I guess I just saw it once too many times, and had seen this guy splashing around too much, and decided I didn't believe him. Thinking about my session against him as a whole though, he wasn't really the type of donk that would pull off a minraise bluff.

Hand 5: He had QJo and I can't say his play was that bad because I came damn close to folding on every street. I'm not sure I would've been able to call had the turn and river not been such perfect cards for me, making a bluff more likely on his part because there were less actual hands he could have had on the flop.

Numbr2intheWorld

11-10-2006, 04:16 PM

#10 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Aug 2006

Posts: 3,561

Wow, the villan in hand 5 is retarded, buddy list him!

Check out my blog http://suited-aces.com

IowaSkinsFan

11-10-2006, 05:14 PM

#11 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Oct 2004

Posts: 7,148

Quote:

Originally Posted by Massimo

Wow, the villan in hand 5 is retarded, buddy list him!

As I said, 3 and 5 were good. I still think hand 1 is bad, if you put him on a bad hand i raise the river even though it is an obvious bluff. And hand 5 isn't retarded by villan, he is trying to push opp of a higher kickered Q. And seeing the title of this thread he probably would've suceeded.

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mcatdog

11-10-2006, 07:14 PM

#12 (permalink)

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Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 3,654

Quote:

Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan

Hand 5 isn't retarded by villan, he is trying to push opp of a higher kickered Q. And seeing the title of this thread he probably would've suceeded.

Correct. I'm pretty sure that the villain in Hand 5 the only one of these villains who's a winning player. Massimo, if you would've folded that hand easily then how can you say his play is bad?

Memeon

11-10-2006, 08:21 PM

#13 (permalink)

Join Date: Nov 2006

Posts: 39

Hand 1:

The raise and the continuation bet are standard, however I don’t like your check on the turn on a weak board. I think you are giving your opponent too much credit thinking he won’t fold to another bet. You also have your ace, clubs and most likely your 10 to make good in this hand.

The pot on the turn is around $47, I would bet around $35-40 and represent a strong/made hand. There are not many hands that can withstand this bet, and without doing the maths you will win the pot uncontested the majority of the time, make this a +EV bet.

When you check Fourth Street and Villain bets $10, why do you call? I don’t understand any reasoning behind this for both Hero and Villain.

Hand 2:

I hate K-9 so I will try and not be biased in this hand.

I think one of the biggest mistakes many online poker players make is cold calling top pair. Again I think you are giving your opponent too much credit for a hand. By cold calling top pair you are opening the possible hands that could be dominating you.

I raise the minimum bet on the flop to around $15. If my opponent calls ill lead for 2/3-pot sized bet and fold to any re-raise.

Hand 3:

This hand isn’t as bad as hand 2, but again I think you missed the raise on the flop. After calling the bet from MP, why did you check the ace on the turn when Villain handed you the pot?

You can’t give him credit for QK/AQ as majority of players at $200 NL would open raise pre flop with such a hand, he has already shown weakness by calling OOP. Unless you think Villain is capable of opening on the flop with a set of fours.

I would raise the flop (fold to re-raise), bet the turn (fold to re-raise) and check behind on the river. I think you missed some important streets here.

Hand 4:

This hand was played fine until Fourth Street; even then they are arguments to how this could be played. Personally I would check-raise my opponent, not giving my opponent credit for betting trips. If he checks behind I would check and call small bet on Fifth Street.

Hand 5:

Defiantly the most interesting hand out of the five showed. I think its possible to put Villain on a draw; semi-bluffing the raiser seems to be the donkey-ish thing to do lately. I think i would have to have a better then average read on my opponent here.

I would raise maybe a little more then you on the flop, and call his re-raise the same to induce the all-in on the turn. What would have been interesting is if a 9/K/A showed on Fourth Street… did he show his hand out of curiosity?

Memeon

http://memeon1.blogspot.com/ - Updated Daily

mcatdog

11-10-2006, 08:27 PM

#14 (permalink)

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Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 3,654

Memeon,

If you read a few posts down, I said what all of these players had. I lost Hand 2 and Hand 4, and won the other three.

Memeon

11-10-2006, 08:30 PM

#15 (permalink)

Join Date: Nov 2006

Posts: 39

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcatdog

Memeon,

If you read a few posts down, I said what all of these players had. I lost Hand 2 and Hand 4, and won the other three.

Doh! Sorry MC.

Interesting to learn he had JQ, defiantly in the range of possible hands he could have, but i think i would of leaned more towards the draw.

Nice wins

http://memeon1.blogspot.com/ - Updated Daily

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