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JeffreyGB
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07-17-2007, 04:52 AM
Post subject: Preflop: 4-bet vs smooth call
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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My typical line preflop has been to smooth-call a 3-bet with QQ+/AK, looking to keep from losing value against JJ/TT/99/misc. I adjust this against laggy players to 4-bet with the normal calling hands and smooth call with the 99-JJ range. So far, one of two results has been prevalent: I get all the money in behind postflop when the board looks safe, but lose (typically the same result as would happen if I 4-bet) or I end up getting folds/taking down a smaller pot than I'd like.
I still think that against most tight players, smooth calling with QQ/AK is likely to hold more value. I'm starting to think that reraising with AA/KK is better, however, since they aren't 3-betting light enough to get away. Thoughts?
I'd love answers for both when you have a TAG image and when you have a LAG image.
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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Also, how low a pair and/or suited connectors do you call a 3-bet with, if you ever do? How good do you need your odds to be compared to their stack to make the call?
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IowaSkinsFan
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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low pairs and sc's i most cold call. I think if someone fourbets you light enough GB you should five bet all in with JJ-99 because you essentially put in half your stack pre.
fourbetting AA/KK pre i only do if it seems absolutely necessary (size and callers already).
I will also fourbet people with AA/KK who will stack off with JJ+/AK pre.
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Jager
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Full House
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 754
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
I will also fourbet people with AA/KK who will stack off with JJ+/AK pre.
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So this is almost every decent regular at stars 1/2 or 2/4?
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zook
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,676
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I generally don't 4-bet in position. I smooth call TT+/AQ+ and other stuff depending on my reads about how they play 3-bet pots and whether I'm going to be able to take it away from them if I whiff with Axs/sc/small pp.
OOP I don't call 3-bets unless there's another caller already. I 4-bet QQ+/AK 100% and then throw other stuff in (22+/AQ/Axs/sc's) sparingly depending on the 3-bettor.
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by zook
OOP I don't call 3-bets unless there's another caller already. I 4-bet QQ+/AK 100% and then throw other stuff in (22+/AQ/Axs/sc's) sparingly depending on the 3-bettor.
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Could you expand on that?
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zook
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,676
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Sure. The key word is sparingly. Light 4-betting is high risk/low reward because you're usually committing yourself to call a 5-bet shove. So if you don't love variance, a better way of dealing with a guy that's 3-betting you constantly is to leave the table. If you are going to 4-bet light (which I define as a wider range than QQ+/AK) then you have 3 options.
1. Raise smaller than pot. With 100bb stacks, a less than pot-sized raise usually makes it correct to fold to a 5-bet push, if you think villain's only pushing QQ+/AK. Pros: Less variance. 4-betting and folding to a push might get your "real" 4-bets more action. Cons: Light 3-betting villains often 5-bet push wider than QQ+/AK. A small 4-bet probably has less fold equity than a larger one. You look like a nit.
2. Raise pot or more. With 100bb stacks, a pot-sized raise or more usually makes it correct to call a 5-bet push, as long as villain's range includes AK. Pros: Probably more FE than a smaller 4-bet. Great for metagame when you call a 5-bet push with 22 or 65s. Cons: You're always getting your money in with the worst of it when you call a 5-bet push. More variance.
3. 4-bet push. Pro: Most fold equity? Con: Always behind when called.
I usually go with option #2, but with a specific read (3-bets light but is a nit about stacking off) I'll go with #1. I almost never 4-bet push light, if anyone likes to do I'm curious to hear why/when.
Before I 4-bet light with a pocket pair I like to be sure that villain will felt AK pre-flop. If he won't, pocket pairs are huge dogs and should just be folded to 3-bets oop. (Calling and c/r'ing any flop AI is an option too, but I prefer to make that bluff in position.) In the games I play (2/4 & 3/6 at FT) most regulars will felt AK pre-flop, so it's not a problem. Before I 4-bet light with AQ or AJ, I want to be sure that villain will felt JJ (and preferably TT too) pre-flop, because these hands don't do well at all vs. QQ+/AK. Again, most opponents in the games I play do felt JJ. 4-betting light with low suited connectors (98s->65s) or suited aces doesn't depend too much on villain's range, because they fare equally well against most 5-bet pushing ranges. Still, they don't do as well as any pp does against QQ+/AK or as well as AQ does vs. TT+/AK. But, they do well enough to call a 5-bet push if you're getting over ~2.2:1, and they're awesome for metagame.
Comments, questions, corrections welcome.
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