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Ash256
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07-27-2007, 05:09 AM
Post subject: Position.. duuhh
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 1,760
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I'm only just starting to realise the importance of position. Looking at PokerTracker in the depression of a 14-buyin downswing, I'm rapidly reaching the conclusion that I'm a loser UTG because I'm not much tighter there than I am on the button, and that flinging mud a lot OOP makes for shitty variance. I realise this is bad, but how bad is it?
Problem is, I struggle with the concept of definite position as compared to relative position. Is there much difference between opening 56s UTG and opening 56s 2 seats later when it's folded round to you?
Just how tight should my opening requirements be? At the moment I'm 23/23 UTG and 26/19 OTB (although I never openlimp the button). What should I be aiming at? Should I be cutting stupid hands like KJo from my UTG range, or should I be aiming at getting rid of SCs? In your experience, how big is the winrate difference between setfarming in position and out of position? I realise that the answer is It Depends and I certainly aint looking for a nice Howard Lederer Hand Chart Poster to put on my wall, but some guidance would be nice.
Cheers
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snowbird4life
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Straight
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 246
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I don't know how big your database is, but maybe post a pt checkup with your position stats, etc. It should really help people with identifying what you are doing wrong plus there will probably be some leaks and weird/odd things from your stats that we all can help you with.
Anyway, some other stuff:
Your probably know most of this but regarding downswings, sometimes it helps to take a serious break and reevaluate your game, review pt, and the next day when your no longer angry/tilted/etc, take a look at the hands where you got stacked or took a serious loss of chips, and evaluate your play. Also, tightening up for a little while may help you get your confidence back. I find that usually this is just variance but often during a downswing, i find some big pots that i played pretty poorly or at the very least could have played better. If your not sure if you played it well still, then post it here for review.
As for your UTG play, your going to get the obvious "tighten up utg" replies. As for me UTG im pretty profitable playing 20/18 but i think even i can tighten up there. Try to play mostly premiums, and open with all pp's, ak, aq etc. I think you have the basic jist of position down, but you need to tighten up and most likley stop playing marginal hands from utg. What type of hands do u play here? Maybe looking through your db and finding hands you open from utg that are marginal and throwing these away will help. Ask if you have questions about what most people will open with utg. Also, sauces and ilikeaces threads should be good for this as well. If i was you, i would cut out the more marginal hands like kj k10, q10, q9 etc plus theres probably some other stuff. Im not exactly sure what your asking with the setfarming question, but i try to be in the pot with all my PP's from any position as long as the raise isn't too large because they are by far my most profitable hands in my db even from utg and OOP.
Good luck getting out of your downswing.. i know the feeling man.
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EzDuzIt
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Green Bay
Posts: 915
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you raise more utg then you do on the button? yeah that it def not good. i raise wayyyy more on the btn then utg.
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mixchange
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 1,665
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Sauce raises less on the button. Wants more callers? I don't get it... I seem to get more callers anyway with button raises because your range is wider so ppl call a wider range...!
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EzDuzIt
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Green Bay
Posts: 915
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by mixchange
Sauce raises less on the button. Wants more callers? I don't get it... I seem to get more callers anyway with button raises because your range is wider so ppl call a wider range...!
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That doesn't make sense... what do you mean sauce raises less on the button? and how would that make him want more callers?
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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UTG raise should be highest based on proportion, since you're raising first in pretty much every time you'll get a close to 100% raise percentage.
on the button you'll be calling in addition to raising/3betting so it's possible for UTG to be higher. it still shouldn't be higher than the button's overall number tho.
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EzDuzIt
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Green Bay
Posts: 915
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isnt it vpip/pfr hes showing us? from utg and btn
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Numbr2intheWorld
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,561
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by mixchange
Sauce raises less on the button. Wants more callers? I don't get it... I seem to get more callers anyway with button raises because your range is wider so ppl call a wider range...!
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Are you talking about raise size? People in medium and higher stakes raise less on the button as a little "defense" against light 3-bettors. At your stakes you should just make it 4x + 1 for every limper all around and 5x from the blinds.
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