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donkbee
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07-16-2007, 07:23 AM
Post subject: nice draws, >100bb effective stacks
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#1 (permalink)
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WELP
Join Date: May 2005
Location: so close but so far
Posts: 3,605
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When hero flops a draw like this and the stacks are only 100bb deep, it seems like a pretty easy push when raised. I'm wondering how deep stacks have to be for a push to be bad. And when the play is not push, what is the correct play? And then what happens on the turn?
So for example, this hand has 157bb effective stacks. Is a push still good?
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
Button ($51.50)
SB ($27.40)
Hero ($157)
UTG ($159.10)
MP ($231.10)
CO ($103.50)
Preflop: Hero is MP with T , J.
1 fold, MP raises to $4, CO calls $4, 2 folds, Hero calls $3.
Flop: ($12.50) 6 , 7, 8 (3 players)
Hero bets $9, MP raises to $27, CO folds, Hero ...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
Why poker fucks with our heads: it's the master that beats you for bringing in the paper, then gives you a milkbone for peeing on the carpet.
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minSim
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Deventer
Posts: 1,512
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You can 3-bet 70ish. You don't need FE because you're likely ahead here.
It's actually more interesting with just 9 outs instead of 13.
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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as stack sizes approach infinity, you can no longer push profitably with less than 49.999999% equity.
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Galapogos
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The Loser's Lounge
Posts: 2,323
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by minSim
You can 3-bet 70ish. You don't need FE because you're likely ahead here.
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I seriously doubt J-high is ahead here. I just call here and see what happens on the turn. But yeah, with ~100bb effective stacks I push.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by sauce123
I don't get why you insist on stacking off with like jack high all the time.
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by |~|ypermegachi
as stack sizes approach infinity, you can no longer push profitably with less than 49.999999% equity.
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not if they always fold
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sauce123
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Dizzy
Posts: 2,405
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courtie- this is a really really easy 3bet and make it at least half ur stack- you have gigantic amounts of fold equity here and all ur outs are clean + you have very little implied odds making it even easier.
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I got more flava than fruitstripe gum
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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id make it $70
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bigspenda73
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
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Why 70? Does that set up at the right amount for a turn push? Why not 3bet a little smaller and make the turn bet have maximum FE?
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JJDAMAN
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: UVIC
Posts: 106
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After a 3bet here are you guys shoving all turns?
What about if you 3bet in position and a blank comes on the turn?
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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more interested in flop FE
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bigspenda73
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by gabe
more interested in flop FE
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Then why not c/r?
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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typically i would c/r given the raiser is right after you instead of after you and the other guy
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donkbee
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WELP
Join Date: May 2005
Location: so close but so far
Posts: 3,605
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by sauce123
courtie- this is a really really easy 3bet and make it at least half ur stack- you have gigantic amounts of fold equity here and all ur outs are clean + you have very little implied odds making it even easier.
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I always raise this but I never know how much. With shallow stacks it's an easy push, but when it gets deeper, I always get confused. Raise and then push any turn? What if we're 200bb deep? Same thing?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
Why poker fucks with our heads: it's the master that beats you for bringing in the paper, then gives you a milkbone for peeing on the carpet.
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bigspenda73
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
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once you raise you're committed to any turn so you might as well shove it.
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bigspenda73
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,546
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by shove it I mean the turn if your flop 3bet gets called
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