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A Legit tough spot 3/6

  
 
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sauce123
Old 03-09-2007, 05:27 AM     Post subject: A Legit tough spot 3/6 #1 (permalink)  
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History: villain is MT UR Waller, a multi-tabling 24/18ish regular. Is aggressive postflop and seems in general to be a solid if not overly scary player. I have 3bet him almost constantly in all the hands we have played together which is my usual style against tags lol. Relevant history here is this hand which we played about 15 minutes ago on same table.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $6 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Hero ($690)
Button ($286.25)
SB ($1482.40)
BB ($591)
UTG ($1597.40)
MP ($612.50)

Preflop: Hero is CO with T, T.
1 fold, MP raises to $24, Hero raises to $72, 3 folds, MP calls $48.

Flop: ($153) 9, 8, 6 (2 players)
MP checks, Hero checks.

Turn: ($153) T (2 players)
MP bets $120, Hero calls $120.

River: ($393) 3 (2 players)
MP bets $420.5 (All-In), Hero calls $420.50.

Final Pot: $1234


And now the decision at hand:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $6 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Hero ($1200.50)
SB ($69)
BB ($113)
UTG ($1599.55)
MP ($767.25)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J, J.
1 fold, MP raises to $24, Hero raises to $72, 2 folds, MP calls $48.

Flop: ($153) 2, 7, T (2 players)
MP checks, Hero bets $96, MP raises to $695.25,

I??? Haha the hardest part of constant 3betting on regs is definitely figuring out when they will play back at you.
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 03-09-2007, 06:01 AM #2 (permalink)  
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 I think the results of Hand 1 would help, since you had them when making this decision.
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sauce123
Old 03-09-2007, 06:07 AM #3 (permalink)  
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hand 1: he had 86
I got more flava than fruitstripe gum
 
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elipsesjeff
Old 03-09-2007, 06:24 AM #4 (permalink)  
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 Yeah, i would call H1 too, but H2 i really dont like JJ in this spot.


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IowaSkinsFan
Old 03-09-2007, 06:31 AM #5 (permalink)  
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 I think it's safe to say there are going to be some AK/AQ type hands in his range. The shitty part is that he's pushing your basic set, AA/KK range here also.
I don't think you can call but I'd like to see a range in pokerstove.
BTW everyone first hand opp had 86 (thin value).

Hands you are beating I think are AT, KT, 89, and a pure bluff with a low pair. What's interesting about this flop is i see opp going alright im gonna check bomb a low flop with a low pair because your range is so huge. Which is great because you are a huge fav versus low pairs.
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aislephive
Old 03-09-2007, 06:43 AM #6 (permalink)  
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Yeah this is a really tough spot, but if you've been 3 betting him a lot I think this is a call. Tons of draws he could have as well as AK/AQ. He is calling your preflop 3bets with a wide range apparently so yeah, I think you need to call here.
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sauce123
Old 03-09-2007, 06:59 AM #7 (permalink)  
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I think many players- and I think he is one, would likely 4bet AK, and maybe AQ here PF. I don't know if he is 4betting KK or AA here tho.
I got more flava than fruitstripe gum
 
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Genitruc
Old 03-09-2007, 10:11 AM #8 (permalink)  
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 This looks like station-city to me. If you've been fking with him, he'll play back at you on a board like this from time to time.

+he has draws here lots of the time etc.

I understand your puky feeling though. Usually when I flat-call AA-QQ preflop to a 3-bet, I hope the flop will have this exact texture so that villain will call me down lightly for above-mentioned reasons.

So I guess I'm saying that I'd call myself here and expect it to be slightly -ev in a "bubble" (i.e. vs a complely unremarkable "standard" thinking villain) but probably neutral or slightly +ev based on you banging on him constantly.
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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Irisheyes
Old 03-09-2007, 12:15 PM #9 (permalink)  
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I think this is a call. I think AA/KK play this slower so they don't push you out. Unless he is levelling you that is and I don't think he is given the history between you.

Really tough hand to comment on without seeing the flow of the game and getting a feel for the players breaking point.
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Hornsta9
Old 03-09-2007, 01:16 PM #10 (permalink)  
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FWIW I think this is a call based on previous history. You have been 3betting light and so he seems to have been calling your 3bets light, especially considering Hand 1.

I just feel that if he had a real hand on the flop he would not want to be getting you to fold with an overbet push. Then again, if he is a tricky kind of player he may be 3rd levelleing you. Have you seen him overbet push before?

I still think I call based on the history.
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 03-09-2007, 04:58 PM #11 (permalink)  
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 Sauce, i think hand 1 is a perfect example of what you were saying in the slow playing post. Lets say instead of TT there, you flopped a set of 9's. The board is very draw heavy, especially since villian has a wide range here, so he thinks that you'd bet any strong hand to protect it. But you don't, you check behind... so now you've induce the villian to do a two barrel push thinking his hand is good.

I think even without the two pair you may see the villian do this.
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gabe
Old 03-09-2007, 05:05 PM #12 (permalink)  
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gotta call because you didnt bet the flop in the first hand
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sauce123
Old 03-09-2007, 05:38 PM #13 (permalink)  
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Gabe- thats exactly why I bet the flop in hand 2- however I wanted to induce a smaller raise than a push, but I knew villain would remember that hand and so I deliberately made a weak-looking AK-like bet on hand 2. This is what ultimately made me call.
I got more flava than fruitstripe gum
 
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IowaSkinsFan
Old 03-09-2007, 06:41 PM #14 (permalink)  
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 results then?
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sauce123
Old 03-09-2007, 07:26 PM #15 (permalink)  
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he had 87 and i won YAY
I got more flava than fruitstripe gum
 
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Harry
Old 03-09-2007, 07:51 PM #16 (permalink)  
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What's the thought process on the flop check in hand 1?
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sauce123
Old 03-09-2007, 08:40 PM #17 (permalink)  
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Induce a bluff
I got more flava than fruitstripe gum
 
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gabe
Old 03-10-2007, 10:30 PM #18 (permalink)  
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and u induced it........on a later hand
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