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Da GOAT
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09-17-2008, 10:22 PM
Post subject: KQ facing turn donk lead 100nl
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#1 (permalink)
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Dublin
Posts: 4,308
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32/15 over 53 hands. 44% AF% tho this is over a sample which is tiny. ive not noticed him at all really. I think he limps/call pre and plays postflop as a 31/15 would usually.
Id love hear thoughts on your turn play and expected river play. Is all we can do call turn and puke on river?
$0.5/$1 No Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com
Stacks:
UTG Hero ($100.38)
UTG+1 euronto ($143.37)
CO jussila ($169.47)
BTN goldybrown ($100.05)
SB gazfaz ($90.25)
BB GoogleMyHand ($117.51)
Pre-flop: ($1.50, 6 players) Hero is UTG  
Hero raises to $4, 1 fold, jussila calls $4, 1 fold, gazfaz calls $3.50, 1 fold
Flop:    ($13, 3 players)
gazfaz checks, Hero bets $10, jussila folds, gazfaz calls $10
Turn:  ($33, 2 players)
gazfaz bets $16.50, [color=#cc0000][b]Hero ???????
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Jman: every time the action is to you, it's an opportunity for you to make the perfect play.
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kmind
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Not Giving In
Posts: 4,240
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Call > raise > fold on turn imo and call depending on his bet size on river and bet if he checks to us. If he bets like extra small I raise.
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meeloche
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,131
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call turn call river. I think raising turn can have some merrit but I would like to have a few more reads before I do that.
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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calls
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,336
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I sometimes raise and am happy getting in all of the money.
It's a feel thing.
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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This falls under my new theory, which we'll call the dalecooper theorem: check/call the flop + donk on the turn means that 90% of the time they are not strong. Raising or calling can be good, but I'd usually raise here to protect against the flush draw.
I posted two recent hands where this occurred to me - one I called turn and river and won, and another I raised the turn and got a fold. You don't see this line that much so I haven't had a lot of opportunities to test, but I'm thinking this is so often a bad attempt to show down a weak made hand or block for a draw that you can profitably continue always (unless you get a read that says otherwise).
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,336
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dalecooper
I'd usually raise here because his stats and line suggest he sucks at poker and will pay-off with worse hands a lot.
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Against a stronger player this is a call or mulligan fold.
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Da GOAT
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Dublin
Posts: 4,308
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Ok bit of a mixed feeling leaning towards a call. what I totally hate about calling is we are facing an unknown river bet. Opp could fire so much on turn and we arent aware of his bet sizes in general. pot is about 66 on river and i dont wanna call a 40-60 river bet.
So hows my turn line,
Opp bets $16.50, Hero raises to $33 (min raise)
My thoughts are basically this will slow our opp down if he has a worse hand but even if he calls here with a 5 sometimes he will still check to me on river and i get to see a showdown for effectively $16.50.
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Jman: every time the action is to you, it's an opportunity for you to make the perfect play.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,336
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You have him by the balls, why are you trying to cut your losses?
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Da GOAT
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Dublin
Posts: 4,308
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fnord
You have him by the balls, why are you trying to cut your losses?
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im not happy about getting all the money in on turn. im raise/folding, bad? Im trying to get to showdown cheaply.
just reread your replies, you think since he obv sucks at poker im crushing him a fair amount and should be happy calling off a shove?
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Jman: every time the action is to you, it's an opportunity for you to make the perfect play.
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jimmy44
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09-18-2008, 11:58 AM
Post subject: Re: KQ facing turn donk lead 100nl
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#11 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Place where I can spew
Posts: 1,391
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Da GOAT
Flop: ( $13, 3 players)
gazfaz checks, Hero bets $10, jussila folds, gazfaz calls $10
Turn: ( $33, 2 players)
gazfaz bets $16.50, [color=#cc0000][b]Hero ???????
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Am I the only one who thinks this is very often a FD by this kind of player? (He bets exactly 1/2 the pot!)
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griffey24
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toronto'ish
Posts: 4,611
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I definitely at least call the turn, as most others have suggested.
I don't mind your line though either, and I take this line sometimes. I'd raise turn a bit bigger than like minraise though, probably to $40ish or something and check through some rivers.
I think this is pretty often a FD thats trying to suddenly rep trips and take you off your hand.
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fnord
Quote:
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Originally Posted by dalecooper
I'd usually raise here because his stats and line suggest he sucks at poker and will pay-off with worse hands a lot.
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Against a stronger player this is a call or mulligan fold. |
I'm operating on the assumption that at 100 NL most of the stronger players almost never take this line. But yeah, I can see what you mean.
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