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Fold? Shove?

  
 
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piitb
Old 04-09-2008, 08:42 PM     Post subject: Fold? Shove? #1 (permalink)  
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POKERSTARS GAME #16584772660: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($0.05/$0.10) - 2008/04/08 - 17:03:43 (ET)
Table 'Zimmerwald' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: carouan ($14.85 in chips)
Seat 2: DenverDiva1 ($6 in chips)
Seat 3: Pokerlullu ($3.80 in chips)
Seat 4: JonnyFull ($22.90 in chips)
Seat 5: jm_mathurin ($7.55 in chips)
Seat 6: Polish.H06 ($27.90 in chips)
carouan: posts small blind $0.05
DenverDiva1: posts big blind $0.10
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to JonnyFull [6d 6h]
Pokerlullu: folds
JonnyFull: raises $0.30 to $0.40
jm_mathurin: calls $0.40
Polish.H06: folds
carouan: folds
DenverDiva1: calls $0.30
*** FLOP *** [4d 2c 5d]
DenverDiva1: checks
JonnyFull: bets $1
jm_mathurin: raises $2 to $3
DenverDiva1: folds
JonnyFull: raises $19.50 to $22.50 and is all-in
jm_mathurin: calls $4.15 and is all-in
*** TURN *** [4d 2c 5d] [Js]
*** RIVER *** [4d 2c 5d Js] [Ad]


Do i shove this or is that just dumb of me? I have the over pair and a gut. Is this enough justification?
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grnydrowave2
Old 04-09-2008, 08:58 PM #2 (permalink)  
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Put it in the butt? LAWL.

On a serious note, I don't like raising 66 UTG+1. Without any kind of read on your opponents, I'd probably c/f the flop. As played, I would fold to the raise.

Maybe I'm weak-tight, but this is 10nl. You can find better spots than this. You have little fold equity, and you're not beating many hands that will call.
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sil693
Old 04-09-2008, 09:53 PM #3 (permalink)  
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I play 10NL 6max and raise any pocket pair from any position if I'm first to act so id say preflop is fine. As played fold flop though - like previous poster said, nothing you beat here is calling you I dont think.
 
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bode
Old 04-09-2008, 10:32 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 preflop is super standard here. lol at limping 66. if villain was sitting on a slightly shorter stack (like 50bb) or hes a total drooler then i'd gamble it up here, but youre not beating much. probly a fold.
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will641
Old 04-10-2008, 04:15 AM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grnydrowave2

On a serious note, I don't like raising 66 UTG+1. Without any kind of read on your opponents, I'd probably c/f the flop. As played, I would fold to the raise.
wat? why on earth would you c/f flop?
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grnydrowave2
Old 04-10-2008, 04:52 AM #6 (permalink)  
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lol, somebody else laughed at me on AIM for limping small pocket pairs in EP. I just hate getting 3-bet with them. Maybe I need to rethink that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
Quote:
Originally Posted by grnydrowave2

On a serious note, I don't like raising 66 UTG+1. Without any kind of read on your opponents, I'd probably c/f the flop. As played, I would fold to the raise.
wat? why on earth would you c/f flop?
Because I just have a gutshot? Because I don't like c-betting OOP against unknowns at 10nl? Because I can't put villain on a range, I don't know my implieds, and there's only 3 cards in the deck I'm happy to see next street?

Like I said before, maybe I'm weaktight, but if I don't make my set then I'm through with the hand.
<SrslySirius> Hal Lubarsky, my nemesis.
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pankfish
Old 04-10-2008, 04:57 AM #7 (permalink)  
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EDIT: I changed my mind.
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JL
Old 04-10-2008, 05:19 AM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grnydrowave2
lol, somebody else laughed at me on AIM for limping small pocket pairs in EP. I just hate getting 3-bet with them. Maybe I need to rethink that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
Quote:
Originally Posted by grnydrowave2

On a serious note, I don't like raising 66 UTG+1. Without any kind of read on your opponents, I'd probably c/f the flop. As played, I would fold to the raise.
wat? why on earth would you c/f flop?
Because I just have a gutshot? Because I don't like c-betting OOP against unknowns at 10nl? Because I can't put villain on a range, I don't know my implieds, and there's only 3 cards in the deck I'm happy to see next street?

Like I said before, maybe I'm weaktight, but if I don't make my set then I'm through with the hand.
We have an overpair and a gutshot. What am I missing here?

FWIW I raise 66 UTG in 10-max games, so LOL at limping anywhere in 6max.
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martindcx1e
Old 04-10-2008, 05:58 AM #9 (permalink)  
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ya grnydro stop open limping 66 in 6max man.
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bode
Old 04-10-2008, 11:00 AM #10 (permalink)  
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 stop open limping any pp in any position. if you get 3bet, which i cant imagine is THAT often if your playing mircros, then adjust. call when you have odds or just fold. not that big of a deal really.
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dalecooper
Old 04-10-2008, 01:24 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Getting 3-bet with small pairs is super +EV if you call when you have implied odds, because your opponent is significantly more likely to felt than if they had put in the first raise. If you are getting 3-bet a lot, you should just 1. try not to make your initial raise very big (so the 3-bet shouldn't be too much to call) and 2. always have a full stack - and hopefully the 3-bets are coming from people with full stacks as well, so it will be profitable to call them.

If you're really getting 3-bet relentlessly though, limping isn't bad. You should be trapping more in those games anyway.
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kmind
Old 04-10-2008, 03:42 PM #12 (permalink)  
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 I think it's pretty marginal for whatever he plans to do after the raise on the flop but is it a leak that I want to b/f the flop?
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will641
Old 04-10-2008, 04:04 PM #13 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grnydrowave2
lol, somebody else laughed at me on AIM for limping small pocket pairs in EP. I just hate getting 3-bet with them. Maybe I need to rethink that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
Quote:
Originally Posted by grnydrowave2

On a serious note, I don't like raising 66 UTG+1. Without any kind of read on your opponents, I'd probably c/f the flop. As played, I would fold to the raise.
wat? why on earth would you c/f flop?
Because I just have a gutshot? Because I don't like c-betting OOP against unknowns at 10nl? Because I can't put villain on a range, I don't know my implieds, and there's only 3 cards in the deck I'm happy to see next street?

Like I said before, maybe I'm weaktight, but if I don't make my set then I'm through with the hand.
dude, we have an over pair first of all, and were definitely ahead of his range. second, a gut shot is 4 outs and a set is 2, giving us a total of 6 outs if were behind.

and from the sound of it, you seem content with being weak-tight, and you really shouldnt. its a terrible way of playing.
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kmind
Old 04-10-2008, 04:21 PM #14 (permalink)  
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 Ok, yeah I now agree that it's a shove. B/S > B/F >>> C/F
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reprisal
Old 04-10-2008, 04:24 PM #15 (permalink)  
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Well if you just call, there is only a 2/3 PSB left anyways. So if we think we can fold out 77-TT(probably not) or if we will get called by a lot of Axs, 33, and some other random stuff(probably?) then shoving seems pretty decent. Otherwise b/f .
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kmind
Old 04-10-2008, 04:27 PM #16 (permalink)  
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 I think his raising range is basically is push calling range which is really helpful if we have reads but since it's a short at 10nl I think it can be semi-wide here and we have more than enough equity.
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ChrisTheFish
Old 04-10-2008, 05:19 PM #17 (permalink)  
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I'd play it same
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grnydrowave2
Old 04-10-2008, 10:24 PM #18 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
dude, we have an over pair first of all, and were definitely ahead of his range.
What's his range?
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pankfish
Old 04-10-2008, 11:39 PM #19 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grnydrowave2
Quote:
Originally Posted by will641
dude, we have an over pair first of all, and were definitely ahead of his range.
What's his range?
Mainly two overs and a flush draw or Ace X with a worse gut shot. We are flipping against the the flush draw and pretty good distance ahead of the Ace X. Of course you can't really take Ace 3 out of their range unless you have reads that he has a tight preflop calling range.

I'm don't think you are making too big of a mistake either way you go here.
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piitb
Old 04-11-2008, 04:20 AM #20 (permalink)  
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I think that this guys range here is very wide Including and pair w oesd. Tptk, a couple of diamonds and the such.

I dont think his range is beating me here. Maybe i am not that far ahead of it but..... this is 10nl
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Genitruc
Old 04-11-2008, 04:54 AM #21 (permalink)  
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 whoa can t believe i didn't notice this thread

hasn't anybody played these stakes when they're rly drunk/high late at night?

-villain isn't full-stacked

-we have overpair

-we have outs even if he has a set or overpair (yay 25% equity!)

-we have a diamond blocker if he has a FD

-ppl with less than 100bb's, even moreso than the "regs" (lol?) playing these stakes, can often play this way with any piece of the board, a "slowplayed" AK, Ax.....
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 04-11-2008, 05:41 PM #22 (permalink)  
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 you played it well, nice hand.

That's an awesome avatar...
Check out my blog http://suited-aces.com
 
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