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dsaxton
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02-16-2006, 05:22 PM
Post subject: Flopped boat line.
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 2,667
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Second hand at table, but given opponents short stack and preflop minraise, it's safe to assume he's bad.
This line worked out well, but is there a better one? Perhaps check-call the turn then make a huge lead on the river?
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx
BB ($106.35)
UTG ($69.70)
MP ($193.70)
Button ($291.25)
Hero ($210.10)
Preflop: Hero is SB with Q , 9.
UTG calls $2, 2 folds, Hero completes, BB raises to $4, UTG calls $2, Hero calls $2.
Flop: ($12) Q , 9, Q (3 players)
Hero bets $8, BB calls $8, UTG folds.
Turn: ($28) 4 (2 players)
Hero checks, BB bets $10, Hero raises to $24, BB calls $14.
River: ($76) 3 (2 players)
Hero bets $54, BB calls $54.
Final Pot: $184
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bdawg56kg
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Honolulu
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I probably CR the turn a little more, like to $30 and push river. Looks good though.
Edit: What makes you so sure he will bet the turn when checked to? If you had a read that led you to believe he will bet, then I like it, but otherwise I don't mind leading again for $20 or so. The last thing you want here is the turn to get checked around.
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Fnord
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Moderator
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Size the turn + river to get all of the money into the pot.
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r8ed
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4-of-a-Kind
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Nice. I often check this on the flop hoping the original raiser puts a bet in and hopefully the other guy calls it. Then I'll reraise if necessary. I like that you bet out and got called though.
Should I be betting these like you did? wtf did he have?
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dsaxton
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4-of-a-Kind
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by r8ed
Nice. I often check this on the flop hoping the original raiser puts a bet in and hopefully the other guy calls it. Then I'll reraise if necessary. I like that you bet out and got called though.
Should I be betting these like you did? wtf did he have?
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He had kings. Betting out builds the pot when he may check behind on the flop, and it also confuses my opponent. When I start showing a strength on the latter streets, he'll be more prone to call me as he'll be confused by my bet on the flop. If I check-call the flop, then start raising and reraising on the turn and river, or check-raise the flop (which are really the only alternatives to leading the flop), I might as well just turn my hand up on the table.
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zenbitz
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If villian is aggro, can you make the flop bet even donkier? Like $6?
This is obviously one of those hands where it pays to have been PFR/C-bet every time.
The turn check/raise looks suspecious as hell. The  was your card? You are saying "I have a Q" here. I suppose if villain can't beat Q2, he's not likely to give you much more money... I might lead out again for like 8 on the turn. Weak, but not super trappy like checking.
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dsaxton
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4-of-a-Kind
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by zenbitz
If villian is aggro, can you make the flop bet even donkier? Like $6?
This is obviously one of those hands where it pays to have been PFR/C-bet every time.
The turn check/raise looks suspecious as hell. The was your card? You are saying "I have a Q" here. I suppose if villain can't beat Q2, he's not likely to give you much more money... I might lead out again for like 8 on the turn. Weak, but not super trappy like checking. |
There's no way to play this hand that isn't either suspicious at some point, or obvious.
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bdawg56kg
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Full House
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dsaxton
There's no way to play this hand that isn't either suspicious at some point, or obvious.
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This is true, but like I said in my post above, why were you so sure he would bet the turn? I think a LOT of hands will check behind here, AA and KK being two of them. If villian is donkish enough to bet AA/KK/JJ/TT when checked to on the turn, then he certainly isn't folding to a strong 3/4 pot turn bet. Therefore I think leading the turn is the safest way to ensure building the pot as well as being the most disguised line IMO.
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Demiparadigm
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by bdawg56kg
Quote:
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Originally Posted by dsaxton
There's no way to play this hand that isn't either suspicious at some point, or obvious.
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This is true, but like I said in my post above, why were you so sure he would bet the turn? I think a LOT of hands will check behind here, AA and KK being two of them. If villian is donkish enough to bet AA/KK/JJ/TT when checked to on the turn, then he certainly isn't folding to a strong 3/4 pot turn bet. Therefore I think leading the turn is the safest way to ensure building the pot as well as being the most disguised line IMO. |
Why would TT-AA ever consider checking behind on this turn?
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To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.
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bdawg56kg
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Demiparadigm
Why would TT-AA ever consider checking behind on this turn?
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For pot control. TT-AA cannot stand a turn CR, but can afford to call $20-25 on the river.
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dsaxton
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Arlington, VA
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by bdawg56kg
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Demiparadigm
Why would TT-AA ever consider checking behind on this turn?
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For pot control. TT-AA cannot stand a turn CR, but can afford to call $20-25 on the river. |
You're offering an argument as to why a player with one of these hands "should" check the term. That doesn't mean most players with these hands usually will.
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bdawg56kg
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Honolulu
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dsaxton
Quote:
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Originally Posted by bdawg56kg
For pot control. TT-AA cannot stand a turn CR, but can afford to call $20-25 on the river.
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You're offering an argument as to why a player with one of these hands "should" check the term. That doesn't mean most players with these hands usually will. |
You're right. I probably am giving this villian too much credit. But think about this. If he is stubborn enough to call a turn CR like as played, don't you think he calls a strong lead on the turn as well? And hence if he calls the turn with TT-AA, don't you think he calls a big river lead too?
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