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Do you call this turn?

  
 
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JL
Old 03-08-2007, 12:03 AM     Post subject: Do you call this turn? #1 (permalink)  
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 Ok, my hand history disappeared...stupid Ongame crap always losing my HH, so this is all from memory.

Villain is a Tagg who 3bets me very light.
His 3bets usually range anywhere from 3x my raise to 6x my raise. Impossible to read him.

$4 BB (5 handed)

UTG (950.00)
Hero ($857.00)
Btn (375.12)
SB ($500.10)
Villain ($500.40)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A, K.

1 fold, Hero raises to $14, 2 folds, Villain raises to $64, Hero calls $50.

Flop: 8 7 2
Villain bets $90, Hero calls

Turn Q
Villain checks, Hero bets $150, Villain pushes...

Hero has to call $200 more to win what will be a $1000 pot.


Anyone calling this turn?
I don't think I can count my overcards as outs anymore.

However, I think I may be getting the odds to call here.

Board: 8c 7c 4h Qs
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 78.788% 78.79% 00.00% 312 0.00 { QQ+ }
Hand 1: 21.212% 21.21% 00.00% 84 0.00 { AcKc }
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gabe
Old 03-08-2007, 12:16 AM #2 (permalink)  
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your flop play is what you need to be thinking about

turn is clear check once u pus out on the flop
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Genitruc
Old 03-08-2007, 12:27 AM #3 (permalink)  
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 As played you have to call.

I think 4-betting preflop (looking to get it in) is better than calling.

Once you flat call preflop I think it's best to raise this flop looking to get it AI.

Once you flat call the flop I think it's best to check behind since you no longer have much equity vs his big hands and you don't want to get raised off of your juicy draw.

Your hand is so strong vs his range + plus you flop a monster... What more can you ask for?
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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JL
Old 03-08-2007, 01:06 AM #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabe
your flop play is what you need to be thinking about

turn is clear check once u pus out on the flop
I thought about raising the flop here, but the pot is already getting out of control.
Do I really want to play for stacks on this flop?

Also, I bet the turn because villain views me as tight/weak post-flop, and I'm pretty sure he's folding most hands here.
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JL
Old 03-08-2007, 01:08 AM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Genitruc
I think 4-betting preflop (looking to get it in) is better than calling.
Do you frequently 4-bet preflop with AK vs a light 3bettor?
And how much do you 4-bet to?
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gabe
Old 03-08-2007, 01:10 AM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JL
Do I really want to play for stacks on this flop?
YESSS
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bigspenda73
Old 03-08-2007, 01:14 AM #7 (permalink)  
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 His line reaks of a set but you still have to call. Playing this flop for stacks is fine b/c you should have atleast 30% in the pot if opp has a set and you are flipping if he has 99-JJ.
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Alexos
Old 03-08-2007, 02:28 AM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Genitruc
As played you have to call.

I think 4-betting preflop (looking to get it in) is better than calling.

Once you flat call preflop I think it's best to raise this flop looking to get it AI.

Once you flat call the flop I think it's best to check behind since you no longer have much equity vs his big hands and you don't want to get raised off of your juicy draw.

Your hand is so strong vs his range + plus you flop a monster... What more can you ask for?
I hate you for thinking like this, wtf 2 months ago I understood nothing of your posts, now its starting to sink in and everything makes sense. Teach me how to think like this plzz!!! hopefully ill get some good coaching tomorrow
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Renton
Old 03-08-2007, 02:33 AM #9 (permalink)  
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 only fourbet this preflop if you are fourbetting pairs as well.

You have gotta commit on this flop though. AK high alone figures to be good vs his range, plus u have a flush draw. Its an incredibly standard raise. If u were like 300bb deep with him then I guess u could call.
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Genitruc
Old 03-08-2007, 06:51 AM #10 (permalink)  
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 When someone is 3-betting me light I like to start 4-betting (and sometime open-shoving) AK, QQ-AA (sometimes 1010-JJ if they are really crazy but these tend to play better when you flat call and call lots of c-bets).

If I'm 4-betting as opposed to shoving (shoving tends to fk w ppl's heads more though and if I'm going to get into high-variance preflop crap I tend to take it to an extreme) then 4-bet AK, good pairs, and mix it up by doing it with some rags very infrequently (like 5-10% of the time).

This has tended to work for me and I think it's pretty sound theoretically.
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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mcatdog
Old 03-08-2007, 07:08 AM #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JL
Do I really want to play for stacks on this flop?
You have a monster hand, why wouldn't you want to play for stacks?
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