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Big fish, big draw, big pot 100nl

  
 
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Robb
Old 05-01-2009, 04:07 AM     Post subject: Big fish, big draw, big pot 100nl #1 (permalink)  
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 UTG is 75/50 fish who has shown loopy moves over 40 hands. MP is a 18/13/2.2 TAGG reg for these stakes over 350 hands. I wanna play against the fish, and keep him in the pot on flop. Probably botched this.

$0.5/$1 No Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($97.90)
UTG 1 ($211.40)
Hero (CO) ($153.30)
BTN ($235.60)
SB ($100.00)
BB ($115.85)

Pre-flop: ($1.50, 6 players) Hero is CO
UTG raises to $3.50, UTG 1 calls $3.50, Hero calls $3.50, 2 folds, BB calls $2.50

Flop: ($14.50, 4 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, UTG 1 bets $11, Hero calls $11, BB folds, UTG calls $11

Turn: ($47.50, 3 players)
UTG checks, UTG 1 bets $28, Hero calls $28, UTG calls $28

River: ($131.50, 3 players)
UTG bets $1, UTG 1 calls $1, $1 to Hero ($110.80)?
My Operation and FTR Rethread: Stations are *sob* so hard to play against
 
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BigPapi
Old 05-01-2009, 09:32 AM #2 (permalink)  
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Any postflop reads on fish? calls down with crazy hands?? Otherwise i think calling is fine... i like calling there in a 3way pot (pf for sure, pot could be a raise, i prefer call here). Turn has given us showdown value, plus we can still improve to the nuts. They both seem to have marginal hands on the river, but so do we. I dont see a good raise size really, so I would probably call while playing. B/f might be good sometimes, but with these stacks/pot?
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Marshall28
Old 05-01-2009, 10:00 AM #3 (permalink)  
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Marshall28
Turn appears to be a pretty easy fold given UTG+1 is any kind of decent player at all.

w/ the fish in the pot, the pot is protected, UTG+1 should know this, making his flop betting range particularly strong since he has to expect fish to call with anything.

Flop call is good.

Now that you've called the flop and the fish called the flop as well, there's basically no way villain is bluffing on the turn, and now you could no longer be drawing to the nuts. You definitely don't have the best hand, it's not like I know anything about pot odds, but when you don't have the best hand on the turn and you are drawing, general rule is you should fold to any decent sized bet.

As played, I'm never considering doing anything but just calling this minbet on the river.
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Stacks
Old 05-01-2009, 10:06 AM #4 (permalink)  
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Stacks will become famous soon enoughStacks will become famous soon enough
 Preflop/Flop: Both are fine imo. I wouldn't be 3betting JTs when it has so much value in calling, especially when we want to keep the fish in. Plus, the fish is likely to call with a fair amount of hands that even though it's likely incorrect to call a 3bet with OOP, it would be correct against our hand (like KT, etc).

On the flop, I don't see any reason to raise here. Not only are you repping such a small value range, and could potentially get played back at by the reg, whose range isn't going to be incredibly weak here, but we would be blowing the fish out as well. So yeah, I think a call is correct here.

Turn: Only real semi-interesting spot. I lean towards a fold as we aren't getting appropriate pot odds to call, and we likely have very little implied odds. And I doubt we are often ahead of a regs 2-barreling range into a 4-way raised pot.

River: Nice pot odds . Getting 133:1 on a call, I think I make it. We only have to be good .7% of the time.
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mcatdog
Old 05-01-2009, 10:10 AM #5 (permalink)  
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I agree with what Marshall said and think UTG+1 has you beat the vast majority of the time. However, your turn call showed a lot of strength and if UTG+1 has a hand like 89, or JJ he somehow didn't 3-bet against this fish, he's probably fairly concerned that you have him beat. This is probably the reason he didn't raise the river.

If you feel like making a really sick play, you could shove the river to make UTG+1 fold and get the terrible player to call with worse. I think that might be too thin though even against the fish, not to mention UTG+1 won't fold 100% of the time, so I'd just call the minbet.
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Robb
Old 05-01-2009, 12:29 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigPapi
Any postflop reads on fish?
He can bet "normal" sized bets with nothing, but usually doesn't. I played another 150 hand with him after this one last night, so I'm trying to remember my earliest reads. The first couple hands I played against him, I won small pots with 2nd pair/underpair type hands where he had air and I was weak - he will let you check a hand down. He generally calls or bets small when he's weak. A few hands before this point, I stacked off to 84s with AK and TPTK board came KT78x runner-runner flush cards, to give you an idea of his play. I had position and he check/called flop 3/4's and turn 2/3's, then crai over river value bet with whatever was left. We were about 100bb deep at the time.

During the hand, I felt he had air or something woeful like 3rd pair or a thin draw, though I recognize even whales can make a real hand every now and again. The TAGG had me worried, obv, but I was praying for a draw to come in so I could stack 'em both.
My Operation and FTR Rethread: Stations are *sob* so hard to play against
 
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