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AA multi way 4 bet pot...totally clueless

  
 
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will641
Old 01-19-2008, 05:33 AM     Post subject: AA multi way 4 bet pot...totally clueless #1 (permalink)  
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 SB- fairly unknown, but very donkish stats thus far. 57/27 fwiw.
BB- unknown.

i think my 4 bet size was a tad too small, but the idea was to isolate without blowing him out. apparently that didnt work out too well, so wtf do i do? can i fold? and the flat call from BB is very odd, and it makes me think he has AK. he doesnt want to let his hand go, but he is very afraid because that is the worst possible flop for AK in a 3 way 4bet pot.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

SB ($91.60)
BB ($201)
UTG ($203)
MP ($289)
Hero ($188)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A, A.
2 folds, Hero raises to $6, SB calls $5, BB raises to $18, Hero raises to $42, SB calls $36, BB calls $24.

Flop: ($126) K, 8, Q (3 players)
SB bets $49.6 (All-In), BB calls $49.60, Hero...........
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IowaSkinsFan
Old 01-19-2008, 05:42 AM #2 (permalink)  
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 Pre is rly gross, I'd raise to something 58 or greater.

Shove as played.
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Numbr2intheWorld
Old 01-19-2008, 05:57 PM #3 (permalink)  
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 the small 4-bet isn't terrible against a chronic squeezer, and really isn't that bad here. A little bigger may be better.

At this point there's no way you can avoid stacking.
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noble007
Old 01-19-2008, 06:49 PM #4 (permalink)  
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The 4bet size doesn't seem so bad I think . Isn't 2.5x the 3bet (or $45 as opposed to $42) pretty std vs one opponent?
But I think ISF is right and it needs to be bumped up significantly with the presence of an additional caller, but I'm not sure what that amount is supposed to be? But his suggestion of 58 is probably right.

(but I think if you were to make your 3bet 3x+ the 3bet size 56+ as a general rule though you would be restricted to 4betting such a narrow range, whereas 2.5 is still big enough that it gives incorrect implied odds to any none-premium hand (because of how little money is left behind) but small enough that it allows you to profitably use a 4bet bluff occassionally vs light 3bettors/squeezers.)

As played its all innnnn baby.
I dont think you ever fold AA in a 4bet pot with 100 bb to start.

Oops wait... you probably meant should you shove flop or call and get it in on turn?

um interesting it depends how many AK are in his range vs draws.
if he has a draw he's pot committed himself to call a shove, so you wouldnt be forcing him to make a mistake by shoving on flop, but if you thought he might be able to get away from AK (ie. because you wouldn't shove anything worse in this spot with no sidepot) then it might be right to call and get it in on turn.

(but obv he might fold turn if he's on a draw so you lose ev there so I think it depends on as I said how many drawing hands 10J or spades could be in his range, I would guess its probably less than the amount of AK in a 4bet pot so call and bet turn might be best to get his stack if he has AK.)

Aahh wait I'm confusing myself! - we wouldnt be making him make a mistake if we shoved flop and he had a draw - but we would be making a mistake if we gave him a cheaper turn card on a draw & we would also lose ev if he was able to fold a draw on the turn to shove getting incorrect odds with only one card to come.

So shove flop & ignore above is the best solution i think.
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Genitruc
Old 01-19-2008, 07:21 PM #5 (permalink)  
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 bb has you beat
when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
 
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