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d0zer
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04-11-2009, 04:41 PM
Post subject: 200NL: JJ vs laggggggg
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#1 (permalink)
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,530
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Villain is playing 51/35/3.5 with 20% 3bet over 60 hands. I'd seen him raise a lot more flops than he could be hitting and generally highly aggressive postflop. He had folded to a couple of my 3bets already so I decided not to 4b.
$1/$2 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.com
Stacks:
UTG Hero ($389.30)
CO Yakuza520 ($210.95)
BTN UlfSteinke ($206.25)
SB llamage ($203.00)
BB tilt2max ($503.50)
Pre-flop: ($3, 5 players) Hero is UTG  
Hero raises to $8, 3 folds, tilt2max raises to $26, Hero calls $18
Flop:    ($53, 2 players)
tilt2max bets $28, Hero calls $28
Turn:  ($109, 2 players)
tilt2max checks, Hero bets $62, tilt2max raises to $156, Hero calls $94
River:  ($421, 2 players)
tilt2max checks, Hero ... ?
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ATOTHEC101
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Full House
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,248
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Looks good, I check behind river, he either has air that's given up or has you beat, I'd say it's sort of close though.
Also you were right not to 4 bet pre, we don't really wanna face a 5 bet this deep or scare out his crap when we're in position.
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"This sure beats Super Mario Bros.!" is my ejaculation catch phrase.
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bikes
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a hot damn mess
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,468
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Thin valueeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. 50/33 is prolly calling us here with an 8 or a T
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"the world def needs more bikeses"
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TheLeakyFaucet
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 54
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what kinda 8 or T does he have in his range?
I could see a bad player playing QQ+ like this some of the time as well...
id chk back
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bikes
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a hot damn mess
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,468
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He's 51/35 with a 20% 3b. He has so much garbage that we're ahead of it seems bad not to valueshove and expect to get called lots worse.
If he had us beat or had pure air he'd shove. Now that he checks he has some showdown value so we're ahead of all the hands with medium amounts showdown value so this seems like an obvious shove. The fact that hes rly aggro makes this an easier shove imo.
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"the world def needs more bikeses"
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bode
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2006
Location: slow motion
Posts: 4,270
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um getting c/r on this board is no good for JJ, even against this villain probably. this is the absolute worst card in the deck to double barrel on as a bluff, and not great for us to rep anything but exactly what we have. i think check back and call almost any river is better than b/c turn, eval river. as played im taking a showdown.
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Quote:
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eeevees are not monies yet...they are like baby monies.
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BigLRIP
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Straight
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: BC
Posts: 194
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Is turn b/c correct?
As played I think checking is good.
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STHollywood
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 107
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bbickes
He's 51/35 with a 20% 3b. He has so much garbage that we're ahead of it seems bad not to valueshove and expect to get called lots worse.
If he had us beat or had pure air he'd shove. Now that he checks he has some showdown value so we're ahead of all the hands with medium amounts showdown value so this seems like an obvious shove. The fact that hes rly aggro makes this an easier shove imo.
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IMO this is almost 100% incorrect. What do you propose his range is here. How did he get here with an 8 or 10?
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STHollywood
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 107
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by bode
um getting c/r on this board is no good for JJ, even against this villain probably. this is the absolute worst card in the deck to double barrel on as a bluff, and not great for us to rep anything but exactly what we have. i think check back and call almost any river is better than b/c turn, eval river. as played im taking a showdown. |
I agree with this. Im wondering if anyone thinks 4-betting pre makes sense. I mean he said that he folded to some of his 3 bets, but here the villian was the one 3 betting so that makes his range slightly stronger. And clearly the hero thinks they are ahead because of the comment that they didn't four bet because he folded to 3-bets, and with these stats I would tend to think the hero is ahead as well. But I guess what happens if the villian 5bets? We are extremely deep
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will641
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: getting my swell on
Posts: 1,610
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by STHollywood
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bbickes
He's 51/35 with a 20% 3b. He has so much garbage that we're ahead of it seems bad not to valueshove and expect to get called lots worse.
If he had us beat or had pure air he'd shove. Now that he checks he has some showdown value so we're ahead of all the hands with medium amounts showdown value so this seems like an obvious shove. The fact that hes rly aggro makes this an easier shove imo.
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IMO this is almost 100% incorrect. What do you propose his range is here. How did he get here with an 8 or 10? |
i would have to agree. it's a small sample, and clearly this player isn't good, but he probably isn't fucking around with utg raisers with A8/AT/T8.
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Numbr2intheWorld
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,561
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by STHollywood
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bbickes
He's 51/35 with a 20% 3b. He has so much garbage that we're ahead of it seems bad not to valueshove and expect to get called lots worse.
If he had us beat or had pure air he'd shove. Now that he checks he has some showdown value so we're ahead of all the hands with medium amounts showdown value so this seems like an obvious shove. The fact that hes rly aggro makes this an easier shove imo.
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IMO this is almost 100% incorrect. What do you propose his range is here. How did he get here with an 8 or 10? |
Yeah, even if he did show up with it he may not even call. You may be ahead a lot but the value is just too thin and he may have binked the nuts and decided to get tricky. Check and laugh if he shows you a flush.
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nutsinho
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: flattin ur 4bets, makin u tilt
Posts: 3,280
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i actually like the turn betcall but now check behind
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My bankroll is the amount of money I would spend or lose before I got a job. It is calculated by adding my net worth to whatever I can borrow.
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d0zer
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,530
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Interesting hand imo.
I posted this one on 2p2 and CR also and there were mixed opinions. Actually a LOT of votes for a river value shove, though overall between the three forums there seemed to be a fairly even split between check behind and shove. Maybe I'm being results oriented but I definitely see the merits of both.
I checked behind and villain showed up with ATo FWIW...
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TheLeakyFaucet
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 54
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lollll whatta nutjob
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griffey24
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toronto'ish
Posts: 4,611
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I think villain is waaaay too polarized after the turn action to consider jamming here. He's most likely got us smoked or got nothing at all that can call.
I highly doubt he hardly ever has an inbetween hand that he might wanna call with on the river.
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Originally Posted by Jay-Z
I'm a couple hands down and I'm tryin' to get back
I gave the other grip, I lost a flip for five stacks
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AFchung
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UCLA
Posts: 1,179
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if he had some sort of made hand i think he'd bet the river himself. probabyl just c/fing after his spazzy turn c-raise didn't work out
bet like $30 to piss him off? hahaha
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