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Marshall28
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04-09-2008, 02:13 AM
Post subject: 200NL 300BB deep flopped flush
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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Villain 28/20/1.7 ... no history between him and I, not even sure what he thinks of me, I've been playing well and pretty much crushing the table so I have a good image, but probably a little spewy. I called flop cuz I thought I wouldn't be getting it in vs worse hands often enough and I'd be scaring away hands that I could get value from on later streets. Plus if I do get the money in on the flop and am ahead, I'm not gonna be that far ahead.
On turn I thought raising was too transparent and he folds everything but a flush, though I maybe should have to protect my hand? Not quite sure. lyric says raise but I dunno.
Didn't have much of time bank on river but didn't want to jam and miss value, but thought I wanted to give him enough rooom to re-shove, i think this was a bad idea after the fact. I don't like the way I played this hand, any feedback?
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
saw flop|saw showdown
BB ($228.75)
UTG ($207.35)
MP ($262)
Hero ($739.25)
Button ($228.95)
SB ($631)
Preflop: Hero is CO with 7 , 6.
UTG raises to $6, 1 fold, Hero calls $6, 1 fold, SB raises to $24, 1 fold, UTG calls $18, Hero calls $18.
Flop: ($74) 5, Q, 4 (3 players)
SB bets $58, UTG folds, Hero calls $58.
Turn: ($190) 3 (2 players)
SB bets $114, Hero calls $114.
River: ($418) J (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $185, SB calls $185.
Final Pot: $788
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Genitruc
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 4,463
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wow this won't be particularly informative but i'd raise just about everywhere until i could go ALL IN
2 outs even when behind baby
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when the vpip's are high and the value bets are like razors, who can be safe?
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Numbr2intheWorld
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,561
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Raising the flop is essential especially since you have to play the turn like that?
Come on you think he's folding AA-KK or AQ on the flop?
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Massimo
Raising the flop is essential especially since you have to play the turn like that?
Come on you think he's folding AA-KK or AQ on the flop?
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300bb deep oop ... W/out a big spade. yeah.
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Numbr2intheWorld
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,561
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Massimo
Raising the flop is essential especially since you have to play the turn like that?
Come on you think he's folding AA-KK or AQ on the flop?
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300bb deep oop ... W/out a big spade. yeah. |
lol do you not bluff anymore? My experience is unless you really want to blow him off his hand with a big raise size he's not gonna fold those hands to a flop raise.
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nutsinho
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: flattin ur 4bets, makin u tilt
Posts: 3,280
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lol you bet less than half pot on river. i personally think thats an incredibly bad bet size to work into your game in these spots.
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My bankroll is the amount of money I would spend or lose before I got a job. It is calculated by adding my net worth to whatever I can borrow.
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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Quote:
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lol you bet less than half pot on river. i personally think thats an incredibly bad bet size to work into your game in these spots.
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i obv botched the hand really badly ... thats why i am posting it. i dont post hands very often, cuz i usually can figure out the mistakes i made by thinking it through. i am starting to think a jam on the river, as played is best. though raising the flop was probably >>>>>>>>>>> calling.
the other problem is i shouldnt be sitting 300bb deep if i am playing underrolled. in which case i probably dont hesitate to raise the flop. : [
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wufwugy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,660
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thing about raising flop is that our hand is quite vulnerable. it doenst look like it but it really is. we're happy to get a lot of money in now, but like 1/3 of the turns we hate. that is almost always reason enough to raise
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Deanglow
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
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Think of it like this: Raising the flop is almost never bad but just calling can be considered so. On the river I'm allin.
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griffey24
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toronto'ish
Posts: 4,611
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I can't imagine not raising this flop, especially in position. Your raising range on this flop should be really really wide cause this flop is often horrible for him, and he's OOP and he can't stand the heat.
I'm raising such nonsense on this board, that 67s here is for sure the top top of my range, so I'd have to raise that too.
As played, your hand looks so weak (and potentially drawy) that you can for sure get away with making a potsize bet on this river and get looked up by a ton of hands. He'd expect you to check behind here with almost all your marginal hands (so your entire range that he puts you on, even two pair checking behind) so betting here will look very bluffy.
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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One of those hands it HURTS to even look at. I mean honestly WTF how dare you play like this?
I'm so tilted by this hand that I can't play for hours now...
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Deanglow
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: lol
Posts: 2,443
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pocketfours
One of those hands it HURTS to even look at. I mean honestly WTF how dare you play like this?
I'm so tilted by this hand that I can't play for hours now...
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This is how I feel when I see every hand in the FR forum.
Raise the flop.
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Galapogos
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The Loser's Lounge
Posts: 2,323
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^^^ That action makes no sense.
Agree with what everyone has said about the first hand. But I was wondering why you don't think you're very far ahead when you're ahead? You're like a 70% favorite against the tightest not-ahead-of-you-range.
Edit: Curse your ninja edit!
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by sauce123
I don't get why you insist on stacking off with like jack high all the time.
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griffey24
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04-09-2008, 04:59 PM
Post subject: Re: 200NL 300BB deep flopped flush
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#14 (permalink)
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toronto'ish
Posts: 4,611
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
Didn't have much of time bank on river but didn't want to jam and miss value, but thought I wanted to give him enough rooom to re-shove,
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I guess i'm confused at this hand. You're willing to call a re-shove by villain here. So playing this hand slow the whole way, was not cause you thought you could be behind, but instead cause you didn't wanna blow him out and get a fold?
Don't worry about him folding. If he folds too much, then just exploit him by bluffing him more with air. You have to fill this up on the flop, especially since there are so many scare cards for you AND he's not going anywhere wtih AsK,AKs,AAs,KKs.
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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griffey, i think i outlined my thought process at the top of the post.
go back and re-read that, it makes sense, doesnt mean i played the hand well, just means based on the type of player i think he is, hes not ever checking the river when hes ahead.
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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im not going to balance my range vs players i dont assume to be good.
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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obv i shoulda jammed the river, its dumb to think he fires 2 barrels as a bluff.
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DaNutsInYoEye
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: St. Louis
Posts: 1,921
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lol
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TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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i would expect a fish to play a flush like this, dont want to scare him off amirite?
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by gabe
i would expect a fish to play a flush like this, dont want to scare him off amirite?
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its possible, but theres for sure one thing i would expect, and that's for a fish to shove a straight draw with no fold equity.
POKERSTARS GAME #14100312878: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($3/$6) - 2007/12/25 - 22:19:43 (ET)
Table 'Marceline II' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: z8eldred ($985.40 in chips)
Seat 2: schoolato ($1425.90 in chips)
Seat 3: Marshall28 ($664 in chips)
Seat 4: johnnykran ($594 in chips)
Seat 5: gp333 ($1585.40 in chips)
Seat 6: gusse10 ($1085.75 in chips)
johnnykran: posts small blind $3
gp333: posts big blind $6
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Marshall28 [Qs Qc]
gusse10: folds
z8eldred: folds
schoolato: folds
Marshall28: raises $12 to $18
johnnykran: folds
gp333: calls $12
*** FLOP *** [9h 4d 5s]
gp333: checks
Marshall28: bets $24
gp333: raises $30 to $54
Marshall28: raises $108 to $162
gp333: raises $1405.40 to $1567.40 and is all-in
Marshall28: calls $484 and is all-in
*** TURN *** [9h 4d 5s] [Jh]
*** RIVER *** [9h 4d 5s Jh] [9d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
gp333: shows [6d 7d] (a pair of Nines)
Marshall28: shows [Qs Qc] (two pair, Queens and Nines)
Marshall28 collected $1328 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $1331 | Rake $3
Board [9h 4d 5s Jh 9d]
Seat 1: z8eldred folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: schoolato folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: Marshall28 (button) showed [Qs Qc] and won ($1328) with two pair, Queens and Nines
Seat 4: johnnykran (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: gp333 (big blind) showed [6d 7d] and lost with a pair of Nines
Seat 6: gusse10 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
edit: BURNED!!
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lolzzz_321
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NO YOU
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: My ice is polarized
Posts: 2,797
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cmon, it was christmas!
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,339
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
a straight draw with no fold equity.
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He had a backdoor flush draw too!
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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marshall i make so much money from people playing QQ like that, its sick
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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so u are basically saying u just get it in bad constantly and suck out a lot. nice.
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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and btw .. .w/ your image .... i play 98 the same way : /
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
its possible, but theres for sure one thing i would expect, and that's for a fish to shove a straight draw with no fold equity.
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HAHA I'm sure gabe knew the SUITS of your two queens.
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pankfish
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: On Tony Romo's nuts
Posts: 385
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Damn I hate not being on a bandwagon. Yer ghey marshall.
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<Staxalax> I want everyone to put my quote in their sigs
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pocketfours
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
its possible, but theres for sure one thing i would expect, and that's for a fish to shove a straight draw with no fold equity.
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HAHA I'm sure gabe knew the SUITS of your two queens. |
always me against the world. : )
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
and btw .. .w/ your image .... i play 98 the same way : /
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man i must be so easy to beat!!! feel free to sit in any of the games i play
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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gabe, im gonna lay down this gauntlet ... since im so confident vs u ... 4 tables HU 100/200 blinds. accept?
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pankfish
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: On Tony Romo's nuts
Posts: 385
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
gabe, im gonna lay down this gauntlet ... since im so confident vs u ... 4 tables HU 100/200 blinds. accept?
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Sick, I wanna rail.
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<Staxalax> I want everyone to put my quote in their sigs
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by marshall28.liquidpoker.net
February 16th marshall28 blog entry:
Anyways, so now basically what I'm gonna do is play a game I call the 8 table 8 buy in rule game. Basically, what I'll do is sit down with my entire roll (400$) spread across the 8 tables
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
gabe, im gonna lay down this gauntlet ... since im so confident vs u ... 4 tables HU 100/200 blinds. accept?
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How exactly are you planning to post the blinds?
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pankfish
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: On Tony Romo's nuts
Posts: 385
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pocketfours
Quote:
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Originally Posted by marshall28.liquidpoker.net
February 16th marshall28 blog entry:
Anyways, so now basically what I'm gonna do is play a game I call the 8 table 8 buy in rule game. Basically, what I'll do is sit down with my entire roll (400$) spread across the 8 tables
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Marshall28
gabe, im gonna lay down this gauntlet ... since im so confident vs u ... 4 tables HU 100/200 blinds. accept?
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How exactly are you planning to post the blinds? |
coaching money, duh.
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<Staxalax> I want everyone to put my quote in their sigs
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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lol yea, lets play. i wont play higher than 40k nl though
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bode
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2006
Location: slow motion
Posts: 4,270
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please do this
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Quote:
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eeevees are not monies yet...they are like baby monies.
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wufwugy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,660
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im sure gabe will back out if i stake marshall since he'd be afraid that i'll be playing instead of marshall
that happened like twice before
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bode
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2006
Location: slow motion
Posts: 4,270
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was marshall saying 100/200 or 100nl or 200nl? hes playing 200nl on a short bankroll so theres no way he has 20k to put down on a table. maybe he will pawn his porsche?
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Quote:
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eeevees are not monies yet...they are like baby monies.
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pocketfours
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lighting sweet moneys on fire.
Posts: 2,166
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by bode
was marshall saying 100/200 or 100nl or 200nl? hes playing 200nl on a short bankroll so theres no way he has 20k to put down on a table. maybe he will pawn his porsche?
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He's FOS ofc... I don't know why Mods tolerate this kind of crap. Like it's not even funny 
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IowaSkinsFan
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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lol @ this thread.
Raise flop, you have a ridiculously bad image lets use it.
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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marshall i will also play you HU at 2/4nl if u want just for fun
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will641
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: getting my swell on
Posts: 1,610
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gabe you are fucking hilarious. by far the funniest thread outside of the commune.
marshall by posting that QQ hand, its almost like the classic fish statement, "you arent better than me, who has more chips?"
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Cash Rules Everything Around Me.
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Numbr2intheWorld
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,561
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BINGO!!!
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by will641
gabe you are fucking hilarious. by far the funniest thread outside of the commune.
marshall by posting that QQ hand, its almost like the classic fish statement, "you arent better than me, who has more chips?"
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jesus christ ... does nobody else get this? ... its like it must go over 98% of people's heads. (even half of you know i have a problem of thinking too deeply in poker) .. i do the same thing here ...
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Renton
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 5,992
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seems like raise flop or shove river as played. I think calling flop to raise turn is probably worst.
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Jack Sawyer
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Old School
Posts: 2,535
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c'mon guys, are we all grownups here or what?
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My dream... is to fly... over the rainbow... so high...
Quote:
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VHS is like a book and a book is like a stack of kindles.
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Hey, I'm in a movie!
http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
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Jack Sawyer
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Old School
Posts: 2,535
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Renton
seems like raise flop or shove river as played. I think calling flop to raise turn is probably worst.
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+1
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My dream... is to fly... over the rainbow... so high...
Quote:
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VHS is like a book and a book is like a stack of kindles.
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Hey, I'm in a movie!
http://youtu.be/lGdnIrRKDTI
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Marshall28
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,198
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Sawyer
c'mon guys, are we all grownups here or what?
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cmon guys does no one have a sense of humor here or what?
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wufwugy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,660
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lookit my boy marshall
hes all growns up and growns up and growns up baby
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