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2 hands: b/f or c/c, 1 hand re: value (50nl).

  
 
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bjsaust
Old 07-29-2008, 12:56 PM     Post subject: 2 hands: b/f or c/c, 1 hand re: value (50nl). #1 (permalink)  
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I think I'm struggling with the concept of when its best to use a b/f line. Here are two hands I wasnt sure about in spots where I could b/f, c/c or c/f.


Hand 1

30/10ish loose postflop (not a lot has stood out, think I saw him call a flop c-bet with 2nd pair once).

$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG Hero ($84.89)
CO Rafapaz ($12.20)
BTN Sweetpenny ($169.29)
SB pauluzz84 ($47.50)
BB Tiltmanager ($50.00)

Pre-flop: ($0.75, 5 players) Hero is UTG
Hero raises to $1.75, 1 fold, Sweetpenny calls $1.75, pauluzz84 calls $1.50, Tiltmanager calls $1.25

Flop: ($7, 4 players)
pauluzz84 checks, Tiltmanager checks, Hero bets $5, Sweetpenny calls $5, pauluzz84 folds, Tiltmanager folds

Turn: ($17, 2 players)
Hero ???



Hand 2

I dont like my PF 3-bet here, but main question is on river:


53/16 havnt seen this min-raise pf thing before. Calling station tendencies postflop.

$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG simonpok ($47.30)
UTG 1 AAndrzej ($59.85)
CO RedBaronBS ($62.38)
BTN davidenco ($104.05)
SB Hero ($76.31)
BB bosjes1 ($51.23)

Pre-flop: ($0.75, 6 players) Hero is SB
simonpok calls $0.50, AAndrzej calls $0.50, RedBaronBS calls $0.50, davidenco raises to $1, Hero raises to $5, 1 fold, simonpok folds, AAndrzej folds, RedBaronBS folds, davidenco calls $4

Flop: ($12, 2 players)
Hero bets $8, davidenco calls $8

Turn: ($28, 2 players)
Hero checks, davidenco checks

River: ($28, 2 players)
Hero ???


Havnt seen him slowplay ever, but I'm still concerned about monsters under the bed...



Hand 3

I think I played this fine until river (correct me if not), however I kinda froze on river:

Err, around 60/20 have seen him do this min-bet donk on flop and fold to pot sized raise (hence my smaller one).

$0.25/$0.5 No Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG AAndrzej ($69.05)
UTG 1 RedBaronBS ($90.58)
CO 33berna33 ($37.71)
BTN Hero ($108.24)
SB bosjes1 ($55.34)
BB simonpok ($38.40)

Pre-flop: ($0.75, 6 players) Hero is BTN
2 folds, 33berna33 calls $0.50, Hero raises to $2.50, 2 folds, 33berna33 calls $2

Flop: ($5.75, 2 players)
33berna33 bets $0.50, Hero raises to $4, 33berna33 calls $3.50

Turn: ($13.75, 2 players)
33berna33 checks, Hero checks

River: ($13.75, 2 players)
33berna33 bets $13.75, $13.75 to Hero ($101.74)?

I check behind turn because I figure I dont get any more value barrelling a scare card for him when he's obviously weak. Question is with approx 17 behind is there value shoving over river? How much of his range is QT (which he always calls), how much is bluff (which he always folds) and how much is something else he may call with?
Just playing to improve.
 
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ATOTHEC101
Old 07-29-2008, 01:58 PM #2 (permalink)  
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hand 1: check/ fold to a decent sized bet, check call to a small bet, though i also dont mind a semi blocking bet on turn, $7.5 sounds good to me.

hand 2: Played fine, now just check/fold river to any decent sized bet.

hand 3: You butchered this hand, your arguement for checking the turn is that hes weak and will fold to another bet? Well even if thats the case, and its often not the board is quite substantially drawy so not betting the turn when you have the nuts is suicide imo and your not only losing a ton of value but letting him draw for free. On the river just shove all in for value, q10 makes up a miniscule part of his range.
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yourfather
Old 07-29-2008, 02:28 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Not really trying to give advice but I think I would:

1. C/C most bets and peel river. Sometimes bet as this Ad can scare him as well and you have second nut draw.

2. C/C bluffcatch alot

3. Bet turn, shove over river. I agree that he is unlikely to have Q10 here, more often 2 pair or JJ
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pgil
Old 07-29-2008, 02:44 PM #4 (permalink)  
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bet the turn so it doesn't matter what he has on the river

edit: for the set of A's hand
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Da GOAT
Old 07-29-2008, 02:55 PM #5 (permalink)  
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hand 1 - c/c a decent bet, c/f river

hand 2 - dont 3bet, i think theres value to bet river

hand 3 - wow, bet turn
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kmind
Old 07-29-2008, 05:04 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Da GOAT
hand 1 - c/c a decent bet, c/f river

hand 2 - dont 3bet, i think theres value to bet river

hand 3 - wow, bet turn
my exact thoughts
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Vi-Zer0Skill
Old 07-29-2008, 05:14 PM #7 (permalink)  
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 1. without any postflop reads i would bet/fold 13.

2. c/f river
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nutsinho
Old 07-29-2008, 05:20 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Da GOAT
hand 1 - c/c a decent bet, c/f river

hand 2 - dont 3bet, i think theres value to bet river

hand 3 - wow, bet turn
flawless victory. and definitely shove river in 3, he will often have a bluff and fold but very very rarely have QT.
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Renton
Old 07-29-2008, 06:08 PM #9 (permalink)  
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 1 check something. If he bets really big you might be able to fold right there.

2 i would just c/f river, i doubt theres value, and i doubt he turns pairs into bluffs

3 yeah turn is an obv bet, and river is an obv shove
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bjsaust
Old 07-29-2008, 10:39 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Ok.

1. I went with a b/f but he just called. Turned out he just floated me with ATo. Dunno why, gg him.

2. I checked, and I think he made like a 1/10 psb so I called and he had A5s.

3. Oops. I guess I tried too hard to get value, has been a leak of mine. Thanks guys.
Quote:
definitely shove river in 3, he will often have a bluff and fold but very very rarely have QT.
I know he'll often have a bluff, but I pick them off by calling. The question is what hands other than QT does he call my shove with having taken this line?

Turns out he rivered J9 for 2P so he probably would have paid me off .




Back to the original point, what are the kinds of things I'm looking for to make a spot a b/f spot, instead of a c/c or c/f?
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