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oskar
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07-07-2009, 04:34 PM
Post subject: omg 3b pot @live donkstakes... call national geographic!
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
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€1/€2
6 handed
BB: €435
MP(Hero): €600
BTN: €150
Hero has A A
Hero opens for €10, BTN calls, BB raises €30, hero calls, btn calls.
I've played fairly tight, but still raising enough to frustrate the limpers... like standard 20/18 or something. BTN is going after me and has called most of my PF raises. BB used to be a dealer, and is now a floorman at another cardroom. She straddles and limps a lot pre, and has limp/folded to me a couple of times... she limped AK once UTG after a straddle, but plays solid post flop and has shown that she can make thin value shoves comfortably. She hasn't 3-bet pre before in about 2h, and made a pretty sick snap-fold on the river with middle set a couple of hands earlier, when the other guy had slowplayed the nutflush... so I didn't think there was a lot of value in 4-betting... also I don't mind keeping the BTN in.
flop(€91): 57 9
BB leads €70, hero calls, btn folds.
ok, so obv. the question is: is there any value in raising... this is the first 3b pot I've had live... I think both of our ranges are absurdly well defined, and I'm just trying to be like "oh hello, i was going to setmine, but now I has small overpair to the board... you can value town me now."
turn(231): A
BB bets €100 and has about €230 left.
Ok, I went through all that shit because obv. I need a range now.
Knock yourselves out.
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yourfather
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: In your fridge
Posts: 603
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QQ,KK AKcc I know that seems absurdly tight but idk. I assume live players arent 3betting 99,77 or scs. I just call and get it in on any river obv.
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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BBs range isnt going to be anything other than big pairs so id call turn and call any river - sure you can ship it on the turn, and i dont think opp can fold getting 1: bazillion, but his suggests hes auto shoving river anyway.
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Nobody~~
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 3b Squeezing HU.
Posts: 60
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I think.... I might....pass out from all the... passive play..........
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oskar
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
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I chose to raise to €335, putting her all-in. The reason was basically because I pulled off a Daniel Negreanu and thought that she wouldn't be betting here with QQ, KK - so that narrows it down to AcKc... but I'm still not folding a club river. And it's hard to get KK, QQ to call a river shove... I thought I could make her think she's freerolling with her draw.
And of course, even if it's really unlikely, she might show up with a set or a lower clubdraw... or maybe even Ac4c or something... I've only seen her play 70 hands or so after all.
An option I didn't think about at the time was to call and bet like 100 on the river when checked to. That would have been brutal.
Nobody~~, think less about the hand we have, and more about what range we want to represent.
Villain is not a drooler.
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Nobody~~
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 3b Squeezing HU.
Posts: 60
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So villain is familiar w/ a sqeeze, is villlain aware that YOU are familiar w/ a squeeze?
If villain is familiar w/ a squeeze, but still only 3b's a tight High PP range, AND is aware that you too are familiar w/ a squeeze, then I just think you could put villain in a very awkward situation pre w/ QQ+ AK.
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oskar
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
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Squeezing oop with btn in this hand and me IP would be lolbad... squeezing to 30 would be lolretarded. BB is not retarded.
If I 4b pre I'm not getting another cent on the flop by 1 pair hands. If I raise the flop, she's very likely to release TT-KK - because I would never make a move with BTN left to act, and I would not be raising less than AA for value against her.
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BankItDrew
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Losing Prop Bets
Posts: 2,789
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miffed22001
BBs range isnt going to be anything other than big pairs so id call turn and call any river - sure you can ship it on the turn, and i dont think opp can fold getting 1: bazillion, but his suggests hes auto shoving river anyway.
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Sounds like you're saying it doesn't make a difference when we get it in because we are eventually getting it in anyways.
I say there is a difference: scare cards on river.
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Girlfriend: Why are the werewolves more important than living life?!
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Nobody~~
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 3b Squeezing HU.
Posts: 60
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or on the turn...
I'm raising the flop, I understand the reasoning behind not doing so, but if the turn brings a club an A (maybe a K or a Q if villain has JJ-QQ) a 6 and an 8.... which is about ~27 cards.... it will not be good for you. Not to mention It will be hard for villain not to see a pretty strong range here whether you call or raise I think.
Personally I think villain willl likely not be able to let go of QQ or KK here to a 4b. You say villain is decent/thinking opponent but suggest several limp/folds and limping AK etc... IDK this is my opinion. My main point is however, that playing this hand so passively does not attain the highest EV I don't believe.
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mmmaaarrrccc
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 16
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Obviously he was getting really creative with 6c8c, maybe you should fold.
Really though, I'd probably just get too excited and shove on the turn.
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oskar
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
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Nobody~~, would you raise QQ in that spot?
There you go.
I don't wanna sound like Mr. grumpy, but if OP has more money on the table than you have in your roll, just maybe you're not the most qualified to analyze the hand.
I welcome everyone's opinion, but I don't want to have to defend pretty obvious plays.
A club on the turn would be almost a blank, so would be any low cards... I'm loosing more value by raising and folding out everything I beat, than I do by letting her potentially catch a 2 outer.
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Nobody~~
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: 3b Squeezing HU.
Posts: 60
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lol.
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