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How to deal with too many calling stations?

  
 
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Buckeye
Old 10-30-2005, 06:36 PM     Post subject: How to deal with too many calling stations? #1 (permalink)  

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Well, my homegame has increased in size from an average of 10 players to an average of 15. (would have been 17 except we caught 1 stealin chips from the case). anyways, many, many newbies are getting involved or worse, those who found thier newbie tactics effective, and continue to live by them. Now, when it was only 1-2 bad calling stations, I could deal with it, but now there is like 6, or more - I lost track.
Here's a typical scenario - I am UTG, fire out a 1500 PF raise into a 300 pot, (blinds 100/200) - lo and behold I get 4 friggin callers, FOUR! OMFG. Flop come and I miss, Fire out another 1500 - 2 stay, whew. miss on turn, checked, miss on river, fire 1000, (woulda bet more, but i knew one would probably call with bottom pr) both call with K8o - WTF - hit thier 8 on the river and THEY split. No flush draws on the flop, maybe a gutshot str8 draw - can't remember exactly. How in the hell am I supposed to play "Good" poker against this? I can't sit and wait for PP's that turn trips every hand - or I'll continue to make 4th. - On a streak - 3 in a row - still pays back even, but that's starting to suck - I should be 1st or 2nd more often.
My normal suckout/calling station strategy is to "make a hand cheap, then drop the fin hammer" - FNORD. but this is very difficult when the hands just are NOT coming. Any suggestions please.

Thanks,
Buckeye
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gabe
Old 10-30-2005, 07:31 PM #2 (permalink)  
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only bet with your good hands.
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arkana
Old 10-30-2005, 07:41 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Make your hands cheap and then make them pay, play hands that do well multiway like Axs.
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Buckeye
Old 10-30-2005, 09:58 PM #4 (permalink)  

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabe
only bet with your good hands.
no kidding.

What if I don't get any good hands, or they turn to crap on the river because no one will fold. ex: ur sittin pretty with top set, bettin like a mofo, maybe even all-in on the turn, and the river makes a 4 card flush or 4 card str8. Sure enough the bastards sucked out to it. How are you supposed to play against that? I believe a great player should be able to cream these people somehow - good or bad hands. Just have to figure out how................ Maybe, when........no, no.. that won't work.................. hmmmmm............ I suppose if I condemn thier play when they miss, they might begin to analyze what they are doing - lol, yeah right. They will probably get mad and never come back, then talk shit about how I am an a-hole - don't want that.

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esattech
Old 10-31-2005, 08:09 AM #5 (permalink)  
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same exact things in my home games, and I win the higher % of them and place 2nd even a higher %.

DON'T Bluff one of the calling stations, this is a bad idea, A high will kill you everytime.

See as many early low blind cheap flops as you can with suited connectors and Ax Kx.

If you miss and they check, check it back, DONT BLUFF!

If I get AA or KK early I will move all in if a station is still in behind me, they love to call all-ins and they can't seem to toss away their j5 hands, you will win the higher % of these hands when called, but keep in mind, you will not win every one of them, they will suck out on you 10-20% of the time it seems, this is what makes them call, cause sometimes they win. But I am cool with that, I invite an all-in call against my AA or KK early, If I win I now have a "2-Stack" as I call it. 2:1 over all other players if early enough in the tourney.

Be carefull when the calling sations Lead out with a bet after the flop, in my home games, they never ever ever raise preflop even with AA or KK, they simply call everything. So be carefull if after the flop they start leading out with a bet, you are probably beat.

My home game calling stations want to see as many free cards as possible and sometimes if you don't catch your hand, it is better to see a free card along with them, if not they will rip your AK that missed with a 2 on the river while holding J2 after calling your preflop raise.


Very hard to beat this type of player by playing preflop poker, I would almost say impossible.

play your flops and turns and beat them at their own game when you are allowed to check and make your hand.

Give these tips a try, they have worked pretty well for me in the last few months, although keep in mind, some nights you just can't beat the Donkey stations.

If you are lucky enough to make it heads up with one the Donks, be extra carefull and try to play "Flop" Poker. My calling stations seem to be a little timid when playing headsup, not sure why but they will laydown more hands than normal it seems, unless they have a "Face" card of course.

Another recent strategy I have used is letting the donks kill one another off and play only very solid hands, but it seems If I employ this strategy and do make it to top 3 or 4, I am a terrible low stack, so I would rather try to chip-up early by seeing cheap flops with nice drawing hands.

It is definately a different kind of poker for sure. An UTG preflop raise with AK is begging 5 of the other 8 players behind you to call and you will surely loose. It is very hard to put a donkey on any kind of a hand after the flop, and 1 more very important thing that applies to my home games: the button means nothing, I never attempt button moves to pickup blinds until we get down to around 4 players or so, most of these players have no clue as to what the button is or how important it is, to a few of them it is just a shiny Black piece of metal with a pretty design on it that they ohh and ahh about when placed in front of them.

Goodluck and let me know if these tips help or not.

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Xianti
Old 10-31-2005, 01:31 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 Excellent insight, esattech.
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Buckeye
Old 10-31-2005, 11:14 PM #7 (permalink)  

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excellent reply esattech. Most of that stuff is what I used to do, but it evaded me for some reason. Now the only challenge is maintaining the disipline. I'll give it a whirl this friday.

Thanks alot!
Buckeye
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azureXsmurF
Old 02-02-2006, 03:18 AM #8 (permalink)  
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My problem is that it's impossible to get a read on my opponents because they will call me all the way down the river regardless of their hand...

A good example of their behavior is I've had a kid call me all the way down the river (including ON the river) with quad Queens, and then call me all the way down to and on the river with bottom pair. They never raise, and if they do bet it's always the minimum so it's hard to get any reads from their betting patterns, and it's hard to get tells since they don't really have any idea what constitutes a good starting hand other than mid-high PPs and two face cards.
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Buddy Love5
Old 02-10-2006, 04:35 AM #9 (permalink)  
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We have a game in my hometown, and we usually have ten players that come and play with us. Usually we have four solid players and then six players that are total fish, and are the calling stations that everyones seems to have a problem with.

Most nights I'll usually win this tournament, and I would say that I am probably the second best player out there, maybe even third, but I continue to win because I have figured out how to play these "idiots". Basically my thing is what everyone has been saying, its just you have to be disipline to wait for your hand, and punish every calling station. I can remember one night when I won just two hands in a two hour period but was still the chip leader because those two pots I took down were huge pots.

Another thing that I realized when I was three-handed with two of the "calling stations" was that they folded if they didn't hit a pair, but would call me down with any pair no matter what I bet. So basically I decided to just limp in every handed no matter what I was holding and fire the minimum bet at the flop and if I was called then I would quit firing away unless I was holding a hand.

Probably the most important thing you have to remember is to be extra patient against these players. To help me do this I take my IPod and listen to music the whole night. Whatever it may be to keep you patient I would recommend you doing that because in my mind thats the key to beating these people.

P.S. You should be able to tell when they have a big hand, because I have noticed alot of newbies pretty much tell you when they have a big hand. Go read Caro's Book of Poker Tells to help you out if you have to.
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donnybaker
Old 02-10-2006, 04:51 AM #10 (permalink)  
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"In a loose game you must tighten up on your bluffs and semi-bluffs, but loosen up on your legitimate hands. You bluff less, but you bet for value more. You also call with more hands and play drawing hands." -Sklansky

nice post esattech!
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