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no1hustler
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05-19-2005, 02:20 PM
Post subject: Hiding tells
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Liltitz PA
Posts: 7
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How do I know if I have tells? No one has ever said anything in any of the games I've ever played in. When I think that I maybe doing something I do often, like play with chips I will purposely do something different to switch it up. Is wearing sunglasses a good thing to do or is that just a 'wannabe' type thing? I want to be like a rock were no one can read me. What kind of tips do you have?
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fjuanl
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,446
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Don't think so much about your "poker face" Getting any kind of accurate read from a facial expression is very difficult.
How do you act when you attempt to bluff/steal a pot? Many people act very aggressive and throw their chips in the pot, yelling their bet amount loud. ("I bet FIFTY".) That can be a tell
How do you act when you have a monster? Do you quietly place in your chips and look away from other players? Do you lean back and look relaxed and confident?
Are you quick to call a bet with a good hand? Work on taking the same amount of time to call/raise. (or fold. if you get caught bluffing and someone reraises you, dont immeadiately toss away your cards because everyone will know u tried to steal a pot. Act like its a tough decision)
Also notice your betting patterns. Are you predictable?
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no1hustler
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Liltitz PA
Posts: 7
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Hmm, great points. At times I do splash the pot or call real quick. I will have to work on that as well as using the same amount of time for calling/folding.
Good tips, keep them coming!
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hagakure
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Straight
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 215
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Wearing sunglasses is a horrible practice and I beg you to not do it. There are few things funnier in the poker world than sitting a 2/4 table with 3-4 college kids all wearing sunglasses and glaring at you the whole time because they think they are Greg Raymer.
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Rondavu
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,053
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The question mark check is a tell. It's when someone says check with an increasing inflection which ends on a higher octave. It means they're weak, and you can take down the pot. They're giving you permission to get payed.
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It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
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koolmoe
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Drowning in prosperity
Posts: 1,279
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The best advice I have ever heard on hiding tells is just to relax. Most reliable tells are born out of nervousness.
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Poker is freedom
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alias2211
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: U, S and A!!!
Posts: 469
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I have heard of people defining and then implementing a standard routine to limit opponents' abilities to pickup on tells. It would go something like this:
1. I Observe active player until it's my turn.
2. When it's my turn, I look at my cards. I only look at my cards for 7 seconds, then I put them back on the table.
3. I place my protector over my hand with my right hand.
4. I look down at the pot and only at the pot.
5. I wait 10 seconds and then announce my move: either fold call or bet or raise.
and so on...
The thing about this approach is that I almost think that it works against them: if you're such a damn robot about it like that and then all of a sudden vary the routine in any way, it makes it a lot easier to tell that something is up, either good or bad. I would stay away from this, although some friends say it works for them. I have one friend who is kinda good at this, but I think it goes best for him when he's playing other people for the first or second time, not the regulars.
I have to agree w/ the koolmoe D. A relaxed appearance is genuinely difficult to analyze.
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ChezJ
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Washington, D.C.
Posts: 1,456
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there are basically two kinds of damaging tells. the first kind gives away that you are weak, usually when you're bluffing or about to fold. the other gives away that you are strong, and kills your action.
i wouldn't worry much about the first kind. at low limits, you should be bluffing only rarely due of the nature of the no-fold-em calling stations. and if you're weak, well, you're hoping for a free card but basically you're already folding no matter what. this kind of tell only matters if your opponents are super observant and realize that you are NOT weak when you are NOT exhibiting a certain tell (like holding your cards in your hand ready to muck)... but that's rare.
what matters more are the tells that kill your action. you limp along to the river and suddenly wake up out of nowhere all excited, betting a huge amount out of turn with a shaky hand. this is a humongous red flag, and anyone who calls you here without the pure nuts deserves to lose because they're an idiot.
my friend had this problem and she never got paid enough for her big hands. let's remember what the main benefit of low limit poker is -- although you get sucked out on by calling stations all the time, those same jerks pay you off enormously on your big hands. so don't kill your action by acting all irregular when your hand hits. exercise some damn control!
another friend of mine, he does the opposite: he freezes up and turns beet red with a strong hand, whereas he is normally jovial and talkative and relaxed. it's literally written all over his face that he's got the nuts, so i never pay him off, sometimes even pre flop.
when you hit a big hand, do NOT think about what a miracle it is. think about HOW YOU WILL GET THE MOST MONEY OUT OF IT. be rational and consider what betting strategy will maximize your pot. raising is not always the best idea if there are multiple people behind you. betting into an aggressive person is totally stupid when you are sure he's going to fire again on the river, enabling a checkraise. going all in out of nowhere is a surefire way to kill all action unless you have some kind of a reputation for stealing pots or you think your opponent hit big too.
but other than the super obvious tells of strength, i don't worry about tells because most people are unobservant or don't pay heed to the tells they perceive. sometimes i flop a big hand and i say "woo hooo!" and bet big. sometimes i even say what i have. everything ALWAYS assumes i'm full of shit and i get called down anyway.
ChezJ
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biondino
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars
Posts: 3,170
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Playing online last night, I made a couple of comments about my cards in the chat window, both during and after a couple of hands (which I won, and won well). But a part of me sees talking about my cards as a low trick, like it's not worthy of me. But it obviously introduces another variable, potentially a confusing one, for your opponents to consider, so should I consider it another useful implement in my armoury? And if so, to what extent?
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Xianti
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Administrator
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: facebook.com/xianti
Posts: 5,289
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{Moved from Hold'em Strategies}
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russhall
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ashland, OH
Posts: 13
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by biondino
Playing online last night, I made a couple of comments about my cards in the chat window, both during and after a couple of hands (which I won, and won well). But a part of me sees talking about my cards as a low trick, like it's not worthy of me. But it obviously introduces another variable, potentially a confusing one, for your opponents to consider, so should I consider it another useful implement in my armoury? And if so, to what extent?
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hate to say it, but nothing's below you. it doesn't make you a worse player because you're talking about your cards. it's making them a worse player if they pay you off big later. *grin* i talk about my hands sometimes, especially if there are other friendly folk at the table. or if i muck my cards and someone asks. don't beat yourself up over using it. if it tilts someone, or if they think you're full of it sometime and call your monster, that's their problem. so many people talk trash for no reason in attempts to tilt other players, so at least you're not doing that.
to what extent? i'd say, to whatever extent you feel comfortable. if you talk about your winning hand everytime, then take down a big pot with no callers and don't say anything, people are going to figure you were bluffing. also, do you want to be seen as a really tight player? if so, talk about those good hands or the good cards you folded. i love this because then i can pull off that mega bluff later.
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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you can try the bill fillmaff approach and hiding inside of a sweater with shades on.
oh wait thats phil helmuth... but you'll probably look like a geek hanging out with your friends wearing shades and a turtleneck acting like your competing for the WSOP title.
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