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!Luck
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05-21-2010, 05:38 AM
Post subject: 300bb Live hand Flop Nuts
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Under a bridge
Posts: 1,367
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I have been playing at this home game now for the third week and I am starting to figure out the players. Right before this hand this hand came up.
Villain raises early to 6, I repop it to 20 with KK. Flop comes AJ3r he leads into me for 26. I tank and fold. he shows KJo saying that he put on a pocket pair.
I suspect now that this villain raise amount differ based on hand strength.
Next hand I have QKss on the button he raises MP to 10. I call and so do 2 other players.
Flop comes 9dtdjc (Effective stacks ~$300)
Villain leads for 26 into what is now about 40 dollar pot, the SB blind makes the motion of calling before it is my turn to act. I raise it to 75. This appears to be a mistake as his bet is likely a flush draw or a set or overs, giving this he is calling larger bets and folding his bluffs.
the SB calls and is all in. Turn 9s, pairing the board he checks. I assume that he really was on a flush draw, I bet 100 and get raised all in.
obv. I tilted and called. and I realize that he is never bluffing in this case. He had filled up.
I tend to make these mistakes where I sucker myself into calling with strong hands and hoping that he has the range that I want him to.
My real question here is what is the appropriate amount to raise on the flop? I think he would call a shove (even if it is an overbet), so next I showed just shove?
How does the fact that the SB motioned to call affect my decisions, it should reduce the combos of flushes in main villains hand.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,336
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I think your biggest mistake in this hand was acting too fast on the flop and not giving everyone a chance to put money in.
As for call vs fold here, meh. This call won't get you broke, but it's certainly a foldable spot.
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!Luck
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Under a bridge
Posts: 1,367
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Fnord,
What do you mean acting too fast. As in physical grabbing for the chips? What do you think would be a more appropriate raise size on the flop?
!luck
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Micro2Macro
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Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: http://three-pair.com/
Posts: 4,465
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stop playing in games where you are under rolled + scared money and you'll have a better chance at making correct plays.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by !Luck
SB blind makes the motion of calling before it is my turn to act. I raise it to 75.
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Give him plenty of time to put his chips in and watch his body language.
Raise size might be a bit small, meh. It's live poker.
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pokerfan
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
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Don't be result-oriented,dude.Your goal here is to raise BIG on the flop and shove on any safe turn when checked to.You seem to have some bet sizing problem in live games.
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Illfavor
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Denton, TX
Posts: 1,152
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I'm confused. It's been 3 weeks and you just now have bet sizing tells and nothing else...? I like pfans line.
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!Luck
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Under a bridge
Posts: 1,367
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Yeah. I am slow at recognizing patterns. Online poker a very mechanical type of game at the low stakes i play at. Live has helped me to try to exploit poeple.
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paratrooper99
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Straight
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 135
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Please correct me if my math is wrong. In this situation, assuming Villian is on a FD (and not a straight draw as well), the appropriate raise to take away odds is 170 dollars to 196 in a 46 dollar pot. You are a 63-36 adv. If this is the case, and I put him on a FD, or even a set for that matter which heads up is same odds relatively, I would shove. Hero hand is not improving. You definitely have fold equity in this situation over time, you win 30-60 dollar pot with shove/fold and win 63% of all calls against full stacks. Of course, you would not do this with short stacked opponents, but against full stacks, this is profitable play IMO. (really not sure about the math. plz let me know if right or wrong)
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!Luck
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Under a bridge
Posts: 1,367
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Para. I have the stone cold nuts, I would much rather shove get called. The only hand that beats me is a free roll kqdd, but that is it. I always thought of fold equity only when I am on a draw trying to make the move profitable, not when I have a nut type hand.
!luck
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Rupeni
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 51
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the way I see it, a set has 7 outs (max given SB might have blockers) to improve on the turn which is 15%? and a FD has 9 (also maybe blockers in SB) which is like 18-20%? for him to call $50 in pure odds (ignoring implied) he needs to win at least $250 by the turn. Maybe a bet of ~ $100 would be better and obviously you wanna bet a blank turn hard... but this is just a cooler isn't it?
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