|
baudib
|
02-22-2010, 06:24 AM
Post subject: $1/$2 live QQ in BB: I 4-bet and LAG backraises
|
#1 (permalink)
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,233
|
|
Action:
UTG, a semi-loose player, raises to $10 UTG, an unknown UTG+1 calls, UTG+2, a tilty LAG, calls $10. A super tight player at CO makes it $50.
I am dealt QQ in the BB. I have just under $400, I grab the $50 in chips place them behind my cards without releasing them and announce raise. "One hundred, I say." UTG calls string bet on me, there is discussion and argument, of note UTG+1 argues in my favor, saying it wasn't a string bet. It's ruled a string, so my action is ruled a call.
UTG folds. UTG+1 calls. UTG+2 says, "I'll make it easy on everyone and raise. Three hundred." He has everyone at the table well covered. CO folds. I hear UTG+1 announce, "WOW." I'm frankly a bit more concerned because it seems like a bit of a Hollywood, and he really wanted my original $100 bet to stand.
I assume this is an instashovel?
|
|
|
Play for FREE and practice your game at...
Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!
|
|
eugmac
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 739
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by baudib
Action:
UTG, a semi-loose player, raises to $10 UTG, an unknown UTG+1 calls, UTG+2, a tilty LAG, calls $10. A super tight player at CO makes it $50.
I am dealt QQ in the BB. I have just under $400, I grab the $50 in chips place them behind my cards without releasing them and announce raise. "One hundred, I say." UTG calls string bet on me, there is discussion and argument, of note UTG+1 argues in my favor, saying it wasn't a string bet. It's ruled a string, so my action is ruled a call.
UTG folds. UTG+1 calls. UTG+2 says, "I'll make it easy on everyone and raise. Three hundred." He has everyone at the table well covered. CO folds. I hear UTG+1 announce, "WOW." I'm frankly a bit more concerned because it seems like a bit of a Hollywood, and he really wanted my original $100 bet to stand.
I assume this is an instashovel?
|
I would never fold here.
I think in this case tilty lag really could have something as weak as any two paint or 88 (he basically just can't get his aggression under control), and UTG+1 seeing that he just cold called the initial PF raise and then flat-called your reraise, I can't put him on KK/AA. He'll most likely just reluctantly call with 88-JJ, AK or whatever 
actually that's probably giving UTG+1 too much credit - i've seen people call all-in in places like this with 78s because they read somewhere that this is the BEST hand for cracking AA!
|
|
|
|
oskar
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
|
|
Live reads only confuse me, so I'll ignore those. Just judging by the call/backraise I would say this is AK more often than not, some stupid hands and rarely AA, KK.
I would not 4b there pre OOP ever. If the 3-bettors stackoff range is wide enough, then yah... 4-bet but make it something that he can't flat pre. tbh with the reads it seems more like a fold pre. - 'tight live player 3-bets'
|
|
|
|
eugmac
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 739
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by oskar
Live reads only confuse me, so I'll ignore those.
|
With a bit of experience you start being able to read live players like a book. Quite a few of them pretty much play their hands face up.
|
|
|
|
baudib
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,233
|
|
To be honest I am not four-betting QQ to fold to a 5-bet shove very often...CO had about $240 behind so folding to her shove would be absurd. And yes she's very very tight but it's a loose player UTG and 2 cold calls in EP, she knows how to play poker and her image is somewhat known to the others so she definitely has a hand but squeezing in LP there doesn't necessarily put her on QQ+/AK. Given our history, had it folded back to her I think she folds AK a lot there, and yes, frankly, I raised to isolate the pot against her and didn't expect the craziness up front.
IMO flatting a 3-bet there with QQ is fairly bad...flatting makes it likely to get to the flop 3-4 ways and, as I remember nutsinho once said, people pretty much put us on TT-QQ and play well against us. so...4bet> fold > flat...flatting turns our hand into 22 imo.
yeah i think my intended four-bet size was probably bad, $125 or so may be better.
|
|
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,336
|
|
I fold to the $50.
Fail that, I give the back raise no respect.
|
|
|
|
eugmac
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 739
|
|
yeah sorry i was focusing on the push from the LAG, which i'm calling any day - I would tend to give the super tight player some more respect and consider folding to the 3bet also, but i don't know if i would manage. I guess she must have had AK...
|
|
|
|
baudib
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,233
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
I fold to the $50.
Fail that, I give the back raise no respect.
|
Fnord I appreciate your replies always and they always surprise me. I know CO quite well and I have her range as TT+/AK, I assume we stack off against this range?
|
|
|
|
pokerfan
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NS, Canada
Posts: 1,736
|
|
I think I'd fold QQ in this situation especially when a tight lady at casino 3 bet preflop in multiway pot.More often than not, she has KK+(AK sometimes).
|
|
|
|
oskar
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by baudib
I know CO quite well and I have her range as TT+/AK, I assume we stack off against this range?
|
I've run this through StoxEV. Assuming everyone else folds, and she folds TT,JJ,AKo and calls QQ+,AKs - then it's EV +$10.
Depending on where the rake is capped, this can easily become -EV in a live game.
I agree that calling pre is pretty gay. That's why I'd still just fold to the 3b.
woman + live poker + 3b = watch ur ass
|
|
|
|
baudib
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,233
|
|
I am pretty sure she calls with JJ and probably AKo, if it were HU and I shoved all-in she would fold those hands ... we have a few thousand hands of live poker together and I have a good feel for her. there is always the non-zero chance she's slightly loosening her range here as I've seen her 3-bet AQ/88/99 before.
thanks for the responses guys.
fwiw the hands in play: UTG: AJs UTG+1 JJ UTG+2: AKs CO: TT
|
|
|
English
Deutsch
Español
Français
Italiano
Nederlands
Pусский
Svenska
06-01-2012, 11:03 AM White House Responds to Poker Players Alliance's Petition
Linear Mode
